Going Soil to Hydro, couple questions

[ott3r]

Hey all, I've got a bunch of autos and two potential moms I need to get out of soil that's hotter than I intended (4.0 runoff after 3 gallons of 8.5 flush). I only added 2 inches or so of the soil to the base of the pot, which is why the issues aren't really cropping up until about 4-5 weeks in. The girls themselves are very strong though they have some excess nitrogen and various stages of leaf cupping from being in such hot soil but I'm seeing leaf tips turning and I don't think another flush is gonna cut it. I've got a pair of 2x3 tubs and reservoirs that I am going to use to do an ebb/flow system.

Long story short, I need to flush my roots and plant into net pots and start the timer on the E&F tray. I was wondering what PH I should start them off with, and what strength nutes I should use. The autos will be bunched together in one ebb and flow table, since they're all already starting to show signs of flowering with hairs popping up on nodes left and right. I want to keep my pair of potential moms segregated as they are going to be fed veg nutes until I can grab at least 8 viable clones off the taller of the two next month. I inherited a 4x6 E&F table and res for (!) ten bucks, figured I may as well use it.

Light: 430 HPS
Trays: 2'x3'x6" trays with 10gal reservoir underneath - 4x2 1gal 6" square potters in each tray
Nutes: EarthJuice line (Grow, Bloom, Catalyst, Microblast, Meta-K), GH Rapid Start root stim, CalMag, and I have a bottle of superthrive concentrate as well (4oz) - A friend also gave me a 3-bottle collection of GH nutes, Flora series. Not sure if I should stick with my EJ line or use the GH nutes..
Medium: Sunleaves ROCKS medium (washed it last night)
Hardware: Etekcity pH pen, HM Digital TDS ppm tester, Elemental Solutions 951gph air pump, 2x 175gph water pumps for E&F tables, 2" airstones in a 44 gallon garbage container on wheels for a reserve of water. I'll add 1-2 each for the reservoirs when I switch over.

I'll be pulling the plants out and watering the rootball to get the dirt loose, then I'll try to 'pour' the soil+roots out of the pot and hopefully wash it as carefully as I can in room temperature tap water to avoid shock. As the PH is so low right now, should I run a lower PH initially to prevent shock?

Thanks!

 

[Nizza]

the water temperature used should be the same as root temperature, not room temperature.
try taking a soil thermometer and checking your root temp before doing this.
optimal 65-68 imo

 

[zem]

after removing the rootball, immerse in a bucket of water stir sideways up and down. most of the soil will fall off this way. I dont like to open a tap and mess with the roots. after all, the very well adhered soil particles deep in the rootball is unlikely to fall off and cause any problems in your hydro. aim at ph 5.8-6

 

[ott3r]

Thanks for the tips guys, I'll try this tomorrow night when my parts get here. How long afterwards can shock take to appear?

Also, any nutrient (EJ or GH line) or hormones (superthrive, gh root stim) suggestions?

Edit: I have two WW and one's short and stout (3-4 inch tall, 7-8" diameter) and the other is tall and narrow; I'm thinking that's the one is to clone..

 

[Newbyduby24]

I did the same when I transplanted two of my Girl Scout cookie clones and I put some super thrive in the water when I washed the roots off and they transplanted just fine. Maybe a teaspoon or two in the cup your washing the roots off in.

 

[ott3r]

I went through with it, I only transplanted the two non-auto plants as the work involved was far too intensive; I'll take the loss on the autos if it means I can focus my efforts on the potential for getting a few clones.

PH is 5.8 (@.5), ppm is 470; I added 3tbsp of Gro, 1.5 of micro and .5 of bloom and 1/2 a tsp of root stimulant then tossed in two air stones for good measure. Was debating hooking up the spare air pump to the timer for the pump so I have an airstone in the tray since it's flooding 15 minutes every 4 hours... Thoughts?

 

[Uncle Ben]

.....Nutes: EarthJuice line (Grow, Bloom, Catalyst, Microblast, Meta-K), GH Rapid Start root stim, CalMag, and I have a bottle of superthrive concentrate as well (4oz) - A friend also gave me a 3-bottle collection of GH nutes, Flora series. Not sure if I should stick with my EJ line or use the GH nutes..

Son, ya done shit in your mess can. You need to read this and heed it well. You have just succeeded in setting yourself up for failure. Wish ya luck anyway......
https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/720043-need-topping-experts-advice-5.html

Uncle Ben

 

[waterdawg]

??? What did he do I ask in great wonderment lol?

 

[ott3r]

Hey guys! Update since I'm at home bored. Here's a few pictures (duct tape is only to keep the reflectix down to prevent shadows and the fan from drying the root zone); anyone know how long the left WW will stay shocked for? The right one handled the transplant much better.. I got some shadows when I added the flood table and rearranged everything so I put my CFLs in to cover the dark areas on the flowering girls. Lastly I have an auto bubblicious with 'the claw' that I'm debating flushing. They're about 27 days in now.



I checked the Ph and PPM earlier and it was 6.1 and 472 so I Ph Downed it to 5.45-5.5 (fluctuates a bit, and i'd rather have it a hair low to give it longer to buffer). Nutrient level is just under the 7 gallon mark however I think I'm going to put 6.5 gallons in the res going forward, it's too high and splashes out of the res from the air stones. I can't wait until all of these autos finish flowering and I can clear the space for some clone action! I can smell them already (heh, carbon filter's working) and seeing some flower sites showing; I'm getting excited!


UncleBen> Not sure what you mean?

Edit: I also intent to wrap my res tomorrow. I didn't get a chance today or last night. How significant is it to do it immediately? The nute solution is cooler than room temp right now, since it's sitting on a concrete floor.

 

[waterdawg]

I didnt wrap mine but it depends on your rez temp, i keep (try lol) it around the 65-70 range and the cold floor helps. You'll have to see. It is light proof right?

 

[ott3r]

For the majority of it yes, small amounts of light can leak through where the material is slightly thinner, but it blocks almost all the light. The lid blocks all light from the room, however I cut a hole in the top of the rez lid for hoses and to allow a runoff hole to drip into it, but I'm going to put some sort of cover of some sort on it so the res isn't open with holes into it.

Amusingly enough, the short bushy WW is actually showing signs of new growth already whereas the taller one is still having some sort of panic attack. New growth (from prior to transplant) is a very nice shade of green and standing up proudly, so I have to imagine she'll recover soon enough.

 

[waterdawg]

I dont worry about a bit of light and have not yet had any issues with slime, my lid is not totally sealed either. May get slammed for that one lol. All of my hoses are black though as I did have algae issues. I was also going to say you may want to wait a bit before deciding the clone. I would take both and see how the originals behave in flowering if possible. They are a pretty resilliant plant in most cases! I have broken and split many stocks and "mostly lol" no issues. I'm a real newb at hyrdo so I'm just mucking through at 11 or 12 runs so far and just about to start another. Last run was Critical Kush and White Russain so a relative of your WW lol. Here's a pic of the WR still finishing at 8.5 weeks And this is the CK drying

 

[Uncle Ben]

UncleBen> Not sure what you mean?

When you transfer from soil to hydro and have to knock off all soil "contaminants", you compromise the root system. The roots are damaged, especially the root hairs. Roots are the very foundation of your success. I would have left them in soil. Curious, why did you go to DWC? Also, read the link I provided. It reflects my philosophy.

For starts, there's no way the typical soil mix is at a pH of 4.0, not unless it's pure peat moss with sulfur thrown in. I think your original diagnosis was completely misguided. You had something else working there. Do you know what the elements are that your plants are "seeing"?

Good luck!

 

[waterdawg]

Ah I get it now, but what should op have done, putting aside the soil versus hydro debate. He needed to get the soil off the roots be it for what ever reason right or wrong, is there a better way to do that? Just on a side note, and keeping in mind I know shit about a controlled grow as I spent my youth planting a lot of clones in a swamp with a bit of time release and hoping for the best, which actually did work lol. I started with soil and when i switched over to hydro after my first year I found that I spent less time maintaining things, and it was way cleaner with no soil to contend with, I was able to understand plant needs better (in my mind lol). And have had several great grows to boot. I did have some shit ones to though lol. Not saying its better but it was better for me. the reason I switched was I like to tinker and building the systems was real cool as well.

 

[Uncle Ben]

Ah I get it now, but what should op have done, putting aside the soil versus hydro debate. He needed to get the soil off the roots be it for what ever reason right or wrong,

That is debatable. I think he wanted to go to DWC because of the sex appeal of it all and just needed an excuse, rationalizations, to make the move. You need to read the link I provided.

He claims the leaf cupping is from too much N when the foods he's using are low in N. I don't get it.

 

[ott3r]

Actually no, please don't just assume I wanted to dive into DWC, which is not what I've done. I made an ebb and flow table, which while similar is actually a different item altogether. I would have preferred soil because I'm not a fan of constant monitoring of my plants. I'm only able to do this now because I'm out of work taking care of a sick family member. I made organic supersoil using subcool's recipe with the plan to use it in place of most of my nutrients throughout the grow; said soil went anerobic for quite a while in a container as there were no drain holes in the bottom of the tote. That lasted at least a few weeks until I stirred the tub and got blasted with a powerful ammonia smell. I laid the soil out and let it aerate for a day and piled it up in the corner of my room. I planted the potters with a few inches of this soil and mixed in some other FFoF soil along with it to dilute the soil, however what I should have done was add some composting beneficials to the pile when I finished airing it out as my SS did not properly compost..

Bear in mind; all plants were fine growing in the top 6" of regular soil. It's when the root mass grow down into the later of 50/50 supersoil is when they started having strange growth, dark green coloring and cupping of the leaves.

Edit: Oh, and the soil was acidic enough to dry out my hands pretty well after cleaning just two root balls.

 

[waterdawg]

Well like I said I like to try new things and I like to grow as much as quick as i can lol. I shut things down from june till september due to heat and an influx of tourists 😞. As far as spending time doing stuff. I spend about the same amount as with soil maybe a bit less due to hand watering and feeding, I could probably shorten the time but thats where i sneak a smoke lol. I grow in a detached building and probably spend .5 hr per day in there, except for every 7th day when I change rez's. Again not saying its better or worse just works for me. I did try to read the article BTW but she's a long one lol i gotta get some freakin shoppin done before Christmas lol.