Running a sterile reservoir? (hydroponics)

[bibbles]

Is there a good resource on running a "dead res" anywhere?

Initially I neglected any biological or sterilizing agents, ran into some problems, tried H2O2 and got poor results, switched to bio-control, then over the course of a few grows went so far as building a vortex brewer; I've tried a number of different teas, inoculates, and enzymes, but they never really did the job, and the resulting biofilm attracted fungus gnats (but I have made it to harvest every time). I'm out!

I've done a fair amount of research, but there doesn't seem to be much consensus; the options which seem most appealing to me at the moment are Dutch Master Zone, chlorine, and SM-90, as H2O2 is hard to test, expensive, and my experience wasn't exactly uncommon, information on quaternary ammonium (e.g. Physan 20) is lacking, UV filters negatively impact nutrients, and mefenoxam (e.g. Ridomil Gold SL) is too damn expensive (also lacking info).

Chlorine is simple, cheap, and readily available, the amount in solution can be easily tested with pool kits (or an ORP meter), and it's got a good amount of evidence behind it.

Dutch Master Zone appears to contain chloramine, which is similar to chlorine, but stays in solution longer, albeit less effective; additionally, it's got copper sulfate and potassium nitrate which help break things down and/or kill stuff.

SM-90 is coriander oil, sulphonated canola oil, and triethanolamine, which seems pretty basic, but I've seen a lot of glowing reviews; extra benefits include deterring bugs, some growth benefits, and, if it can be used with either of the above, triethanolamine will make them more effective.

So, I suppose the questions weighing on me at the moment are whether or not SM-90 can be used with chlorine/chloramine, and whether Dutch Master Zone provides any significant advantage over straight chlorine; however, any input on the subject would be appreciated!

NOTE: This is for my next cycle, which should be happening in an ebb and flow style system, probably using Sure to Grow media.

 

[nameno]

Something going on.
I never used it but I've read about it & never heard
of it not working.
What kind of system you running? Your water temps?
There is a thread "heinsburg tea,(spelling) on here .
GL

 

[bibbles]

Something going on.
I never used it but I've read about it & never heard
of it not working.
What kind of system you running? Your water temps?
There is a thread "heinsburg tea,(spelling) on here .
GL

I don't have anything going right now, this is just my planning for the future.

In the past I've done aeroponics (winter) and DWC (summer), either way I ran into root issues, and while the teas and stuff definitely helped (Heisenberg was my starting point), they never actually solved the problem, and I was left limping through to harvest. It's possible that my reservoir temps were just a bit too high, and I definitely packed things in a bit too tight, but I'm solving that by switching to an ebb and flow system, and placing the reservoir outside of the garden.

 

[SnapsProvolone]

I never needef to fight mybres so much in ebb & flow. In DWC yeah but not e&f. Just toss a pump in the red to kerp it moving.

 

[bibbles]

I never needef to fight mybres so much in ebb & flow. In DWC yeah but not e&f. Just toss a pump in the red to kerp it moving.

Yeah, that's the main reason for the switch, I don't like DWC, and while aeroponics is awesome, it's too hot here most of the time.

You don't think the "waterfall" of filling the brain, the "waterfall" of draining back, would be enough to keep it oxygenated? I've got a few of the GH dual diaphragm air pumps, so that's handled, just curious.

 

[SnapsProvolone]

I used to do e&f sog. Ran the hell outta that for years. May run some again, doing trees now.

The problem with relying on flood cycles to airate and prevent stagnation is your only flooding like 20 min every 4 hours or so and none when lights are off.

I never got results from air stones needed to mover the water to prevent stagnation. In e&f an air stone id pointless imo.

Get a cheap little pump and put it in a corner to make for a circle flow pattern.

 

[SnapsProvolone]

Had to say: Cute dobie. I have rotties nameno. Love large dogs.

 

[bibbles]

I used to do e&f sog. Ran the hell outta that for years. May run some again, doing trees now.

The problem with relying on flood cycles to airate and prevent stagnation is your only flooding like 20 min every 4 hours or so and none when lights are off.

I never got results from air stones needed to mover the water to prevent stagnation. In e&f an air stone id pointless imo.

Get a cheap little pump and put it in a corner to make for a circle flow pattern.

Fair, I'll probably stick with the GH pump though; I already have it, it's quieter than the small aquarium pumps, and only draws 7w.

 

[SnapsProvolone]

You will probably be fine in an e&f since plants are getting air to the roots between floods.

Best of luck and keep growing the good stuff!

 

[burgertime2010]

I recently started ebb and flow with Coco and the first time around I used organic ingredients along with the synthetic and found slime, funk, and algae were everpresent. Gnats came and the funk was the reason. Needless to say this gave me a reduced yield and an unsanitary work zone. The roots suffered and so next time I divided the use of organic teas, bennies, kelp into veg only. On the flip into flower I ran Zone the whole time in my reservoir. It kept sterile my my root zone, tray, and res and the plants really grew. I was apprehensive about root rot and algae but with zone and sm-90 the worries were taken care of. The ease of going sterile was attractive versus the problems I saw before. The bottom line was a clean, productive, and easy grow. I looked at the root zone after harvest and just very white healthy and thick roots was what I found. This is just a guess, but it seems that with a sterile res I could get more mileage out of my nutes by changing out the water less. Every 10 days even 14 days worked fine as I could not afford more nutes toward the end. I think the roots need the organic brews in veg and the healthy plants in flower need clean and stable to excel. I look at trying to use the best of both as well as saving time, money, and effort and so far sterile is the leader.

 

[bibbles]

I recently started ebb and flow with Coco and the first time around I used organic ingredients along with the synthetic and found slime, funk, and algae were everpresent. Gnats came and the funk was the reason. Needless to say this gave me a reduced yield and an unsanitary work zone. The roots suffered and so next time I divided the use of organic teas, bennies, kelp into veg only. On the flip into flower I ran Zone the whole time in my reservoir. It kept sterile my my root zone, tray, and res and the plants really grew. I was apprehensive about root rot and algae but with zone and sm-90 the worries were taken care of. The ease of going sterile was attractive versus the problems I saw before. The bottom line was a clean, productive, and easy grow. I looked at the root zone after harvest and just very white healthy and thick roots was what I found. This is just a guess, but it seems that with a sterile res I could get more mileage out of my nutes by changing out the water less. Every 10 days even 14 days worked fine as I could not afford more nutes toward the end. I think the roots need the organic brews in veg and the healthy plants in flower need clean and stable to excel. I look at trying to use the best of both as well as saving time, money, and effort and so far sterile is the leader.

What sort of system are/were you running?

Last night I was thinking about running Botanicare Pure Blend Pro with SM-90 for an organically sterile grow, though I'm unsure everything will be available without beneficials, and the jury is still out on whether SM-90 kills them. Really, the biggest hurdle I'm seeing at the moment is trying to find nutrients with a clean (i.e. non-ammonical) nitrogen source... So far I've found that and Heavy 16. :/

 

[Myles117]

i run ebb n flow trays on 90 gallon rez and the zone is what i have stuck with. had serious root rot issues and went to H2O2 then chlorox bleach. both lessened the issues but never eliminated em. the zone seems to keep shit from growing for about 10 days after rez fill. curious bout the SM-90 but since zone is working i havent ventured to anything else

 

[burgertime2010]

I had a 4x8 and 4x4 trays and a 100gal resivoir. I was using coco, rockwool, perlite medium. Zone, SM-90, fulvic acid, base nutes, and cal mag, but nothing organic because the zone turns it to shit.

 

[Myles117]

how often did you change over the rez?

 

[burgertime2010]

It was usually 7-10 days, 7 if I had something special waiting to add to the solution and 10 was normal. At the end, I use very expensive nutes went 2 weeks even. That was a big part of it all too....I could save 25% on nutes if this were able to keep pathogens out and thus lasted longer. I really don't know if this was in fact happening, the results exceeded my expectations.

 

[Myles117]

thats the great debate i am having with myself lol. iv made it two weeks but then i start seeing ph swings and itty bitty pieces of "debris" in the water. i dont use super pricey nutes (floranova) but its alot more work emptying multiple rez's weekly and remixing. i went to hydro to make life a lil easier after all

 

[burgertime2010]

That's what I am talking about......ease.

 

[Nizza]

you want easy hydro try hempys! https://www.rollitup.org/drain-waste-hydro/546006-world-hempy.html
sterile reservoir? yeah if you get the hang of it. read through there a little and see if it might be for you, if you wanted i'm sure you could do a drip feed setup with an overflow tray or something!
hope this helps!
i run an aerocloner and clean it weekly to avoid slime buildup. it's easy to keep clean cause i only put water in it and occasionally a little root excel.
other than that i do hempys with ease and the rootballs are nice and white, no beneficial additives just dyna gro foliage pro, silica, cal-mag(for coco) , and humboldt honey hydro. make sure the ph up/down you use is suitable for hydro and water every 1-3 days , its sweeet others use canna or other nute lines; great success!! amazing things there
maybe not for you just thought i'd share

 

[Myles117]

i dont think id wanna be dealing with hempies in a larger garden. do you reuse the perlite? and how many do you run at a time

 

[Nizza]

well i have run 30x 3L before under a 400, then downsized it by 10 took the 10 smallest and put em outdoors. but i found i like running less, bigger plants, hempys can range from 2L to 5gallon or more, and how large of a garden are we talking?
i like to do Coco now, and have only used a 400w hps but i hear of people doing bigger setups . the guy there was doing perpetual 2L and getting 1/4 oz per 2l, and i think it was 10-20 every 2 weeks under a 600 or something... (the information is there somewhere 3 sets of 10-20 so 30-60 total and each had their own runoff tray. they were cloned and put straight to flower so the mother chamber was huge and he was gettin pretty good at it and then he got bopped, pulled down his images but there are others who do the same type of setup.
you could modify it to drip but that kind of takes the simplicity out of it

i could re -use my coco but i put it in a compost pile then buy more. Each year i use the compost/coco mix for an outdoor grow

i guess for an industrial type grow you could do bigger hempys, but i get that it's going to be a lot easier to do a flood setup; each setup has it's own obstacle i guess just wanted to hopefully turn you onto the hempy idea, maybe you could try one and see how it does compared to the others in a side by side; just sayin it doesn't need pumps and can drink whatever you're giving the others; just know if using coco it demands a little extra treatment