12/12 From Seed Experiment - 21 Strains

Hot Diggity Sog

Hot Diggity Sog

Well-Known Member
Chapter 3 Update
Day 22 Continued

I have been having some troubles getting plants to get roots long enough to be able to go into the contraption. I know where I went wrong but we're almost there now.
There are exactly 50 plants in the contraption. 3 plants have not made it and 47 are being nursed. It should just a few more days before most of the 47 will be able to go in.

I also am working on a new really simple design that I'll be running in parallel with this grow. Basically a PVC hempy container that is automatically watered and has an air stone at the bottom. These containers could be the best of both worlds.

The one picture of the root I took is pretty typical. Of the 50 plants in the contraption, the roots are anywhere between 8 and 15 inches long already.
Most of them only have a single tap root but some of them have 2 and even 3 taps coming out.

DSC_0005_00001.jpg DSC_0006_00002.jpg DSC_0007_00003.jpg DSC_0008_00004.jpg DSC_0009_00005.jpg DSC_0010_00006.jpg
 
drcrumble

drcrumble

Member
Hot Diggity Sog said:
Chapter 3 Update

I'm a little late getting started but the seeds went into rockwool on Thursday. Everything is tested and water tight. I've got the seeds sitting in perlite because I need them to grow their taproot out of the net pot by about 2 inches before I can transfer them. Hopefully it works.

The only other thing worth mentioning is a minor line-up change.

  • (20) Humboldt Seed Organization Blue Dream
  • (20) Humboldt Seed Organization Blueberry Headband
  • (20) Humboldt Seed Organization Sour Blueberry
  • (20) Female Seeds C99
  • (20) Barneys Farm Chronic Thunder
View attachment 3439256 View attachment 3439257
Click to expand...
omg this fucking cool!
 
DirtyNerd

DirtyNerd

Well-Known Member
Looking awesome brother glad to hear your going with the 1000 watt i think it will be better in that space your the master of DIY i love it the 1000 watts will stop the girls from stretching for the light so much as well

One thing that comes to mind when i look at this set up this is me forward thinking and i would recommend adding some string around the the PVC so you can tie the girls back to it once they start flowering i could be wrong and they might be fine but i would think they would be to top heavy and try to lay down or even some hooks on the back reflector something to support the girls later keep up the great work bro
 
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Hot Diggity Sog

Hot Diggity Sog

Well-Known Member
DirtyNerd said:
Looking awesome brother glad to hear your going with the 1000 watt i think it will be better in that space your the master of DIY i love it the 1000 watts will stop the girls from stretching for the light so much as well

One thing that comes to mind when i look at this set up this is me forward thinking and i would recommend adding some string around the the PVC so you can tie the girls back to it once they start flowering i could be wrong and they might be fine but i would think they would be to top heavy and try to lay down or even some hooks on the back reflector something to support the girls later keep up the great work bro
Click to expand...
the 1000 watts will stop the girls from stretching for the light so much as well
I hope so...they definitely look a little stretchy and spindly. The 600 just was not enough horse power.

i would recommend adding some string around the the PVC so you can tie the girls back to it once they start flowering
For sure man. Not sure what's gunna happen or be needed yet but the top heavy cola's combined with the lean is going to require something.
 
DirtyNerd

DirtyNerd

Well-Known Member
Hot Diggity Sog said:
the 1000 watts will stop the girls from stretching for the light so much as well
I hope so...they definitely look a little stretchy and spindly. The 600 just was not enough horse power.

i would recommend adding some string around the the PVC so you can tie the girls back to it once they start flowering
For sure man. Not sure what's gunna happen or be needed yet but the top heavy cola's combined with the lean is going to require something.
Click to expand...
Where are the fans... ? once you get the stems to bulk up you might be fine they are always weak at the start anyway
 
Hot Diggity Sog

Hot Diggity Sog

Well-Known Member
Hoping you guys can critique this container idea.

Container.png

4" PVC with the bottom glued.
The lower 2 holes at the bottom: The bottom most one is a passive drain. Could be drain to waste or drain back into a rez.
The hole above that feeds an air stone sitting in the bottom.
The drain hole would allow about 2 inches of water to sit on the bottom.
Ultimately this would be watered from the top on a timer.
May or may not have a lid.

The idea of the air stone in the bottom sounds really good in theory. One thing I worry about is pushing 75 to 80 degree air into the container could make it too warm.

Perlite vs Hydroton: I'm inclined to think both would work. With hydroton, I think I could add fresh water every hour which would help combat the temp concern I mentioned above. What about perlite? How often could I water that?

Any and all suggestions, thoughts, concerns are welcome and appreciated.
 
akhiymjames

akhiymjames

Well-Known Member
Hot Diggity Sog said:
Hoping you guys can critique this container idea.

View attachment 3453483

4" PVC with the bottom glued.
The lower 2 holes at the bottom: The bottom most one is a passive drain. Could be drain to waste or drain back into a rez.
The hole above that feeds an air stone sitting in the bottom.
The drain hole would allow about 2 inches of water to sit on the bottom.
Ultimately this would be watered from the top on a timer.
May or may not have a lid.

The idea of the air stone in the bottom sounds really good in theory. One thing I worry about is pushing 75 to 80 degree air into the container could make it too warm.

Perlite vs Hydroton: I'm inclined to think both would work. With hydroton, I think I could add fresh water every hour which would help combat the temp concern I mentioned above. What about perlite? How often could I water that?

Any and all suggestions, thoughts, concerns are welcome and appreciated.
Click to expand...
That's pretty much the same system I run except I have a pot/container inside of another. Go look at Nerds post of the 4 pot setup he's about to do. That exactly how I run mines. The bottom pot is basically the pot that catches the drain water from the plant being top fed from a reservoir. Then the drain water is recirculated back to the reservoir. Very easy system but you have to have to right type of pots that leaves you enough space in between the pots once you set one inside the other. The drain water can't be stagnant as it causes ph problems and deficiencies.

I've seen a system like the one your showing and have heard of people putting airstones in the bottom of them but like you said could be a recipe for disaster with too much warm air so I would go the route of the system me and Nerd use as you have an airstone in the reservoir so roots get plenty oxygen when being top fed.
 
Hot Diggity Sog

Hot Diggity Sog

Well-Known Member
akhiymjames said:
That's pretty much the same system I run except I have a pot/container inside of another. Go look at Nerds post of the 4 pot setup he's about to do. That exactly how I run mines. The bottom pot is basically the pot that catches the drain water from the plant being top fed from a reservoir. Then the drain water is recirculated back to the reservoir. Very easy system but you have to have to right type of pots that leaves you enough space in between the pots once you set one inside the other. The drain water can't be stagnant as it causes ph problems and deficiencies.

I've seen a system like the one your showing and have heard of people putting airstones in the bottom of them but like you said could be a recipe for disaster with too much warm air so I would go the route of the system me and Nerd use as you have an airstone in the reservoir so roots get plenty oxygen when being top fed.
Click to expand...
What are you guys using to allow the drainage but prevent the perlite from coming out? My little test clogged my drain line immediately.
 
akhiymjames

akhiymjames

Well-Known Member
Hot Diggity Sog said:
What are you guys using to allow the drainage but prevent the perlite from coming out? My little test clogged my drain line immediately.
Click to expand...
Nerd is using pot sox. It's basically a bag with a small micron screen on the bottom that doesn't allow the perlite to come through. For me the pot that holds the perlite has a zillion 1/8th size holes to allow the pot to drain but not allow the perlite to go through. That's the only thing I could think of to do maybe get some window screen for the bottom the pot but other than that that's what I do
 
Melbs92

Melbs92

Well-Known Member
Hey @Hot Diggity Sog, I love the look of that new setup man! The NFT pipes look wicked! You could put up like a 2m tall piece of lattice (the checkered wood stuff) behind each straight section to provide anchor points for ties. Just an idea!

Hey @DirtyNerd i checked out my local hardware and hydro shops today! A 4 pot system is looking to cost me about $130AUD minus the pump. Struggling to find one 600+ LPM

@akhiymjames did you say you had trouble landing pot sox due to the price? Have you tried www.cheaphydroponics.com? They had 4 packs for like $16ish
 
Hot Diggity Sog

Hot Diggity Sog

Well-Known Member
Melbs92 said:
Hey @Hot Diggity Sog, I love the look of that new setup man! The NFT pipes look wicked! You could put up like a 2m tall piece of lattice (the checkered wood stuff) behind each straight section to provide anchor points for ties. Just an idea!

Hey @DirtyNerd i checked out my local hardware and hydro shops today! A 4 pot system is looking to cost me about $130AUD minus the pump. Struggling to find one 600+ LPM

@akhiymjames did you say you had trouble landing pot sox due to the price? Have you tried www.cheaphydroponics.com? They had 4 packs for like $16ish
Click to expand...
The lattice is a great idea man...thanks!
 
akhiymjames

akhiymjames

Well-Known Member
Melbs92 said:
Hey @Hot Diggity Sog, I love the look of that new setup man! The NFT pipes look wicked! You could put up like a 2m tall piece of lattice (the checkered wood stuff) behind each straight section to provide anchor points for ties. Just an idea!

Hey @DirtyNerd i checked out my local hardware and hydro shops today! A 4 pot system is looking to cost me about $130AUD minus the pump. Struggling to find one 600+ LPM

@akhiymjames did you say you had trouble landing pot sox due to the price? Have you tried www.cheaphydroponics.com? They had 4 packs for like $16ish
Click to expand...
Where did you them at on there I looked and can't find them?
 
Sativied

Sativied

Well-Known Member
Hot Diggity Sog said:
Hoping you guys can critique this container idea.
Click to expand...
Just some thoughts based on own experiences. I've done hempy runs and plants as an alternative to nft because it doesn't require the chiller, and also to grow males besides the females in the tubes.

-Vertical (tall narrow instead) containers don't work as well as shorter wide containers. Simply put, the less wide the container, the higher the contents of the reservoir needs to be. Too high and too many of the roots are soaked, too low and... well, perlite alone dries out very fast. Watering with a timer will help of course.
- They would be suitable for SoG size plants so you'd need a lot of them to fill a space (like 36, 6x6). Growing in relatively narrow tubes is doable because we don't use a medium, once you start adding it, you significantly reduce the root space. The plants sort of follow the narrow structure and you risk gettig tall stretchy plants that quickly get root bound.
- 1 air stone per pot per plant is a pita. They can usually be reused but not endlessly (in my case barely 2 runs, tried various stones). I frankly don't think the airstone will have any noticeable effect (on top of using something airy as perlite). As for blowing in warm air, I actually used air stones to help keep my rez cool. I put the air pump itself in my intake of my closet.
- Recirculating soilless ( /hyroculture) is tricky. Can't entirely 'refresh' the root zone if something goes wrong, and by recirculating from a single rez, if one goes bad they all do.

I use a layer of carefully placed hydroton at the bottom of hempy bucket, basically make sure there's not 1 pebble exactly in front of the drain hole. I do unplug them a couple of times during the run though.

So my suggestions would be to get wider PVC, and use a drip system (e.g. a ring, or cap with holes to spread it evenly at the top). instead of periodic watering and the rez+stone at the bottom. Dripping will allow you to keep waste to a minimum so no need to recirculate, and you'll only need a couple of stones for in the rez.
 
Hot Diggity Sog

Hot Diggity Sog

Well-Known Member
Sativied said:
Just some thoughts based on own experiences. I've done hempy runs and plants as an alternative to nft because it doesn't require the chiller, and also to grow males besides the females in the tubes.

-Vertical (tall narrow instead) containers don't work as well as shorter wide containers. Simply put, the less wide the container, the higher the contents of the reservoir needs to be. Too high and too many of the roots are soaked, too low and... well, perlite alone dries out very fast. Watering with a timer will help of course.
- They would be suitable for SoG size plants so you'd need a lot of them to fill a space (like 36, 6x6). Growing in relatively narrow tubes is doable because we don't use a medium, once you start adding it, you significantly reduce the root space. The plants sort of follow the narrow structure and you risk gettig tall stretchy plants that quickly get root bound.
- 1 air stone per pot per plant is a pita. They can usually be reused but not endlessly (in my case barely 2 runs, tried various stones). I frankly don't think the airstone will have any noticeable effect (on top of using something airy as perlite). As for blowing in warm air, I actually used air stones to help keep my rez cool. I put the air pump itself in my intake of my closet.
- Recirculating soilless ( /hyroculture) is tricky. Can't entirely 'refresh' the root zone if something goes wrong, and by recirculating from a single rez, if one goes bad they all do.

I use a layer of carefully placed hydroton at the bottom of hempy bucket, basically make sure there's not 1 pebble exactly in front of the drain hole. I do unplug them a couple of times during the run though.

So my suggestions would be to get wider PVC, and use a drip system (e.g. a ring, or cap with holes to spread it evenly at the top). instead of periodic watering and the rez+stone at the bottom. Dripping will allow you to keep waste to a minimum so no need to recirculate, and you'll only need a couple of stones for in the rez.
Click to expand...
This all makes sense. Before you posted this I was thinking about the drain to waste versus recirculating and I think I came to the same conclusion. If I size my reservoir such that after 5 to 7 days, all of the water has been used then there simply is no reason to recirculate at all.

Very interesting thoughts on tall narrow vs wide pots. I'll bring on some more examples this week and see what ya think.
 
akhiymjames

akhiymjames

Well-Known Member
Sativied said:
Just some thoughts based on own experiences. I've done hempy runs and plants as an alternative to nft because it doesn't require the chiller, and also to grow males besides the females in the tubes.

-Vertical (tall narrow instead) containers don't work as well as shorter wide containers. Simply put, the less wide the container, the higher the contents of the reservoir needs to be. Too high and too many of the roots are soaked, too low and... well, perlite alone dries out very fast. Watering with a timer will help of course.
- They would be suitable for SoG size plants so you'd need a lot of them to fill a space (like 36, 6x6). Growing in relatively narrow tubes is doable because we don't use a medium, once you start adding it, you significantly reduce the root space. The plants sort of follow the narrow structure and you risk gettig tall stretchy plants that quickly get root bound.
- 1 air stone per pot per plant is a pita. They can usually be reused but not endlessly (in my case barely 2 runs, tried various stones). I frankly don't think the airstone will have any noticeable effect (on top of using something airy as perlite). As for blowing in warm air, I actually used air stones to help keep my rez cool. I put the air pump itself in my intake of my closet.
- Recirculating soilless ( /hyroculture) is tricky. Can't entirely 'refresh' the root zone if something goes wrong, and by recirculating from a single rez, if one goes bad they all do.

I use a layer of carefully placed hydroton at the bottom of hempy bucket, basically make sure there's not 1 pebble exactly in front of the drain hole. I do unplug them a couple of times during the run though.

So my suggestions would be to get wider PVC, and use a drip system (e.g. a ring, or cap with holes to spread it evenly at the top). instead of periodic watering and the rez+stone at the bottom. Dripping will allow you to keep waste to a minimum so no need to recirculate, and you'll only need a couple of stones for in the rez.
Click to expand...
I wonder would blumats work for this idea that you just stated. Since it is a drip system that only goes by the moisture of the medium. I know they work for soil but I wonder would they work for a medium like perlite? If it does they would be perfect for what your trying to do main thing is with the res for blumats it has to elevated high so gravity feeds the line.
 
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