126W Penetrator LED Bloom Test

For those of you who don't know me already, I'm a medical marijuana patient in WA state who has spent the past 2 years researching, testing, and developing LED grow lights specifically for marijuana. I've posted results on this forum of my own personal grow (1512W LED) and my friend's grow (504W now 630W LED), but a lot of you want more. Most people have been happily following along with my current progress, but I'm repeatedly asked to show what a single, 126W light can do on its own.

For those of you who've asked, this test is for you. I went ahead and took 4 plants from my veg garden today (sep. 26), that were about a week away from being ready to throw into my usual bloom room, and placed them into an 8-plant aero system. Above those 4 plants is a single, 126W Penetrator LED. The grow space measures approximately 30" wide, and 18" deep. Today marks day 1, and progress pictures will be posted regularly. Here's what it looks like:

it seems to me that with a bunch of trail and error one would be able to control plant height alot easier and more effectiviely (with leds) with the knowledge of what specific light,nm and so on are used by the mj to grow taller (perhaps even regardless of genetics?) am i off totally? oh, and i look forward to watching this thread, thanks and good luck.

The way you regulate height with these LED's, is by raising or lowering the light from your canopy. If the light is 12"+, they'll stretch, if it's 6-9", they'll stay nice and bushy. Plants only absorb a certain percentage of light at each nm, so once you get it all dialed in, you get a light that's perfect for all stages.

Alright, so it's time for an update:

Two days ago I put 4 plants into a small aeroponics unit, within a small room. The light stayed on the entire day, and throughout the following, meaning that they had 1 day to adjust to the new system prior to going into bloom. Last night the light went out for the first time at 12am, and came on again this afternoon at 12pm.

I'm not guaranteeing that these results will be typical for everyone, but I wanted to take a picture to show how rapid the onset of flowering can be with these LED's. The picture was taken about 9pm, only 9 hours from when the plants came out of the dark cycle for the first time. Anyhow, enjoy the set of pistils

Hey LEDgirl,

Have you notice any leaves turning yellow? I am wondering if my hieght is not right, or not enough nutes. Do you use any nutes? How much per plant do you yeild? weight

Lookin good. Ill be watching hopefully the flames don't set this one ablaze as well. I do have I do have one problem though... Ur suGgesting the light alone caused ur plant to sex in nine hours.... I gotta call bs. And I'd like to

Sorry idk what happened. Lol. I gotta say though I can't help but be paranoid its hard to be unbiased when some of ur sales hang in the balance of these results. Reguardless I wanna see this one out just maybe with less "up talking" of the light and more straight to business let the plants sale it for ya u know they're good enough to. Again I hope this wasn't taken as an insult or flame just wanted to point out a few things... Also for humor it would be cool to see a side by side with a competitor (not ufo but someone who actually could compete lol) and maybe done by an independant rather than the company owner. Either way ill be watching and wish u the best of luvk and a bountiful harvest (ps they always look so fuckin cool under led.)

erkelsgoo420 said:

Sorry idk what happened. Lol. I gotta say though I can't help but be paranoid its hard to be unbiased when some of ur sales hang in the balance of these results. Reguardless I wanna see this one out just maybe with less "up talking" of the light and more straight to business let the plants sale it for ya u know they're good enough to. Again I hope this wasn't taken as an insult or flame just wanted to point out a few things... Also for humor it would be cool to see a side by side with a competitor (not ufo but someone who actually could compete lol) and maybe done by an independant rather than the company owner. Either way ill be watching and wish u the best of luvk and a bountiful harvest (ps they always look so fuckin cool under led.)

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I just show what happens, that's all. The Ice plant had pistils the day after the lights went out. All plants were showing pistils the following day. Is it due to the nutes? Dunno. Is it due to the light? Dunno. Is it due to going from 24 hours to 12/12? Could be. There's a lot of factors that contribute to flowering. That doesn't mean the plants are budding out like crazy though after a week now

As far as the independent tests go, there are a few that will be started soon. Our 126W will be put against the ProSource 180W Jumbo UFO. 3 of our 63W lights will also go up against a 180W Jumbo via a completely different grower. And two of our 63W lights will be put up against a 150W LED bar that uses 3W LED's. We also have Ed Rosenthal conducting a test with 3 of our 318W units against a 1000W HPS. I just wanted to do a grow with a single 126W as there were a lot of people asking for it.

KenWood said:

Hey LEDgirl,

Have you notice any leaves turning yellow? I am wondering if my hieght is not right, or not enough nutes. Do you use any nutes? How much per plant do you yeild? weight

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During bloom some leaves will naturally turn yellow and die out Some plants are also more resistant to stress or nutrient deficiencies more than others, causing yellowing. Yes I use nutes, I believe it was in post 1, but I'm running nearly the entire line that Humboldt Nutrients recommends for their Master A & B series. I keep my lights between 6-12" from the plants. Any closer is not recommended with these LED's. Yield is completely dependent upon strain, plant size upon entering bloom, and whether or not it underwent any stress or not. I've yielded up to 8 oz's on a single plant, although most tend to be around 4oz's. I've been messing around with nutes too, and am about to switch back to the company I trust most: Advanced Nutrients. I love their Iguana Juice, and I honestly think it gives better results than the line I'm using.

Now onto the progress.

This is the first time I've ever used almost a full nutrient line from Humboldt Nutrients. Week 1 burned one of my plants, so upon switching the nutrients today, I dialed them down a bit. It's not a surprise that this particular plant burned, as it's the least stress-resistant in my garden. The roots on all 4 plants though, are not looking as healthy and alive as they should, so hopefully dialing the nutes back will help. Otherwise I'll switch out to Advanced in a week or two.

I re-arranged the plants after cleaning the system, and hung the light higher than it's been previously. A few days ago I raised it about 3", and now it's 9" above the tallest plant, 12" above the shortest plant. This will cause the plants to stretch a bit more before they begin to really start flowering.

Anyhow, these pictures were taken 10-3-09:

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sweet thread i love led i use 2 90w tri spectrum ufo with a 250w hps i can cover a 6'x6' area with nice tight buds no problem i will be watching this one

Hi LEDgirl... I am following your thread with intrigue. Am just kicking off a procyon + cfl auto grow as an experiment and for some Xmas bud. I have bookmarked your penetrator though as a potential successor or a replacement light should anything happen to my current one (last one broke within 1 week and I had to send back!). One thing I notice that is different to your unit is that yours has 6 fans!! Mine only has one. The only fan I have on mine is noisier than my ideal but totally bearable (it's noisier than the whooshing sound of my carbon filter setup which I have stepped down on a voltage controller). Since I have my babies in my bedroom... low noise is v important to me... as of course is heat. Now the reason I ask about hte fans is... how loud are they? 6 seems quite a lot for a unit that is only 26watts more powerful than the procyon... though procyon does have a f$$k off heatsink. Also... the procyon also definitely gives off some heat... nothing like my former HPS 250 or 400. So... how much heat does your penetrator give off? I'd say my procyon is comparable to a 20watt CFL in terms of how hot to the touch (maybe a little less) but gives off more overall ambient heat... prob comparable to a 125watt CFL envirolite. How does your light compare? Final question - the procyon uses 25watts of its total 125w power consumption for the fan (meaning it's really only offering 100watts of growing power)... how many watts are consumed by your fans for the 126watt penetrater light? Like the look of your to be honest... looks well made and if I had to buy all over again I would prob give your light a go since it's also like 200$ cheaper! anyway... I look forward to seeing what your badboy can do... I just love LEDs . The future of growing for sure. Cheers!

FYI - I am growing my autos for the first 1-1.5 monthes with procyon only... then introducing some cheap cfls (4x20watt) for teh final stages to help fill out hte spectrum (wiht you light I shouldn't need to do this... another reason I like it!!!). Autos should be brilliant for LED cos they stay short and LEDs don't penetrate as well as HPS. I was considering doing procyon 100% of the time... but for now... those are my thoughts. Trying a range of auto strains to see which ones like LED more. That's the last I'll say about procyon... not meaning to hijack your thread... just want to see whether I should be investing in your 126w light going forward .

Good questions, add me to the curious list. Between the Procyon and Penetrator:

1. Which is louder?
2. Which creates more ambient heat?
3. Which uses more wattage for light, or produces more light?

Noise and heat are important for me too. I've had my eye on a procyon for nearly a year.

vh13 said:

Good questions, add me to the curious list. Between the Procyon and Penetrator:

1. Which is louder?
2. Which creates more ambient heat?
3. Which uses more wattage for light, or produces more light?

Noise and heat are important for me too. I've had my eye on a procyon for nearly a year.

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Can only add info here. Not answer... since I do not have a comparison...

1. The Procyon basically seems to use a standard sized PC fan... running full pelt. if you've got a desktop PC nearby.... have a listen. Imagine it exposed and not being cushioned by the case. Makes a high whirring noises... as expected. rocyon more than acceptable. I have a DR80 tent with carbon filter and ruck 100 extractor running at 1/5th power (otherwsie sounds like a jet engine!) in my closet.. combined and when cupboard door closed... Not audible in room next door. Put it this way.. I can sleep through it. I am not a light sleeper but the level of noise is absolutely fine all things considered. If it was not in the cupboard.... hmmm... would prob irritate me just enough that I'd prob have to invest in some earplugs .
2. No idea... but Procyon prob adds about 3-5 degrees (a guess) to ambient temperature in an enclosed space. For me it is v v comparable with heat generated by an envirolite 125w in terms of ambient heat.
3. I cannot answer this but rather than focussing on wattage... I think you should focus on results. Who cares about wattage if the Penetrator has a better spectrum for growing on less watts. Bear in mind.. by time I add some CFLS.. my wattage increases. If I thought I had a light that covered all spectrums on its own... I wouldn't use CFLS at all... a real PLUS for penetrator. I've not seen any grows thus far using procyon with dwarf plants. Everyone I've seen has tried to grow monsters or strains which aren't neccess best demo of LED growing. I mean I saw one for Jack The Ripper and that's a bitch of a plant to grow even with HPS... LONG flowering time and only yields really well under ideal conditions... plus let's not forget it's hardly good for penetration of LEDS cos it grows massive. I saw SNSStealth ones which again were monsters relatively speak and not strains I consider "easy grow" under normal lighting. I even saw one just using bag normal (non skunk) weed.. v unhelpful for evaluating the light. I wouldn't dream of growing bag weed even under HPS.

Those are my thoughts... hardly conclusive but thrown into the mix nevertheless to see if they help . Once my current grow finishes I'll have a much better evaluation of Procyon. My plants are loving it right now but I won't hit flowering till about 3 weeks.

Thanks LEDgirl

I got the nutes wrong too weak that is why they started turning yellow. I try and keep height around 4 to 6 inches. Here is a compare I am really impressed with LED's hopefully mine will flower like yours have been. You have a great day.

KenWood

Our units produce very little sound while operating. The fans are nearly silent, as are the units themselves. They use about 3W each, meaning 18W total for the light (add that to 126W LED, and it's 144W operational). Sorry your Procyon is so loud, but our units will definitely be outdone by the noise from your carbon filter. Our units operate a max temperature of 105 degrees F at the LED board. We tend to use larger heat sinks than most companies, when you look at how many watts they run on their boards. So our unit shouldn't produce much more, if any more heat than the Procyon. Then run higher power LED's, at higher currents, so their unit may actually run hotter...

As far as the Procyon goes for growth, I've heard it performs fairly well for vegetative growth. I haven't heard such reports for bloom, but I know it's capable of flowering a plant. One key thing to know about Procyon, is that there design hasn't really changed a whole lot since LED's first came out. They still use your standard red/blue light, with 635nm red, and 450nm blue. That's only half the spectral output necessary to drive photosynthesis. It works for veg, but without 660nm for flower, lights like this tend to fall short. Plants need all 4 peaks for photosynthesis, not just two. I'm a bit surprised that companies like Procyon haven't done more development over the past few years, as they got off to a great start in the beginning...

LEDGirl said:

Our units produce very little sound while operating. The fans are nearly silent, as are the units themselves. They use about 3W each, meaning 18W total for the light (add that to 126W LED, and it's 144W operational). Sorry your Procyon is so loud, but our units will definitely be outdone by the noise from your carbon filter. Our units operate a max temperature of 105 degrees F at the LED board. We tend to use larger heat sinks than most companies, when you look at how many watts they run on their boards. So our unit shouldn't produce much more, if any more heat than the Procyon. Then run higher power LED's, at higher currents, so their unit may actually run hotter...

As far as the Procyon goes for growth, I've heard it performs fairly well for vegetative growth. I haven't heard such reports for bloom, but I know it's capable of flowering a plant. One key thing to know about Procyon, is that there design hasn't really changed a whole lot since LED's first came out. They still use your standard red/blue light, with 635nm red, and 450nm blue. That's only half the spectral output necessary to drive photosynthesis. It works for veg, but without 660nm for flower, lights like this tend to fall short. Plants need all 4 peaks for photosynthesis, not just two. I'm a bit surprised that companies like Procyon haven't done more development over the past few years, as they got off to a great start in the beginning...

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Good to hear about the noise level and how wattage is applied. Heat appears negligable with your unit. I totally subscribe to your theory on spectral output and that the procyon prob falls down on that area. It does definitely flower but how good? I will find out. Its a shame I already spent all my money on a Procyon (I bought it last year but it never made it for the grow it was intended for) cos I would love to try out your light on the next grow I do early next year. I plan to repeat the grow I do this year under identical circumstances 1st qtr next year (providing it works well enough!) i.e. potsize, grow medium, light cycle, autoflower strains, tent etc. Only difference is I'll be setting my mate up with my kit at his house. I think Procyon is pretty much your nearest competitor for the 126watt light. I'm not huge fan of UFOs and your kit looks much better built (sod all these "made in China" units). Now all I want to see an actual grow under 1x 126w penetrator light (cos that's the perfect single light for someone growing a personals stash in an average closet). The only other light I have seen that, if I had the money, I would consider is the LED Spectra Unit by Dutch Green Growlights (it looks awesome) but its much more expensive than yours and a bit more expensive than the Procyon (120Watt is 511Euros!). Your price point is v attractive... just hope once your introductory period runs out it doesn't rise too steeply. It gives you the edge and is yet another reason why I like the look of it. Now show us some more of your grow ! I'm waiting to be blown away . Have got your light bookmarked for the future some day. Good Luck!

flippa said:

Your price point is v attractive... just hope once your introductory period runs out it doesn't rise too steeply. It gives you the edge and is yet another reason why I like the look of it.

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The most common reason I've heard people say not to invest in LED is because of the price, that the cost doesn't justify choosing LED over HID. If the Penetrator proves itself and the price stays lower then the competition I wouldn't be surprised if a few more people convert to LED.

vh13 said:

The most common reason I've heard people say not to invest in LED is because of the price, that the cost doesn't justify choosing LED over HID. If the Penetrator proves itself and the price stays lower then the competition I wouldn't be surprised if a few more people convert to LED.

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They are pricey, but they last alot longer. The one I have is like a 30 yr life. with a 5 yr warrenty no question ask. So in 5 yrs how much would we spend on 1000w hps we spend close to $150/bulb we have 4. So in five yrs that is $3000. plus the electric you save. Plus we would not have to worry about the heat. Or the heli heat cops. We are legal growers in Colorado but tha does not mean the FEDS cant do anything. Why take a chance screwing something up. You cannot go more than 15 degree with our hps bulbs, LED's you can mount them on the walls at 45 degrees. Like I said before if this works out we will switch over. Sit down and actually think about the math. I know I know you dont get the same amount as with HID or HPS, we looked at this and if it produces half of what we get now we will be sitting pretty good. LEDgirl is doing some good stuff with hers. I would say just sit back and watch.

KenWood