20,000 Watt Medical Grow Op Construction
- Thread starter collective gardener
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collective gardener
Well-Known Member
Whoa! Are we adding nutes between water changes? If so, stop. That is a big no no. As far as seeing "micro" defs with lower ppm, 1000ppm is more than high enough. Any defs would have to be the nutes and/or ph. I should mention that micro defs are very rare when using any quality hydro solution.
When you change your water do you do it "mid drain cycle"...so that you can get all the water...including what's in the plant buckets? This would be best.
I know what you mean about how big and fast they can grow in just a 6 gallon bucket. You guys may remember Godzilla, my DWC test plant this year. That was just an air stone in a bucket full of nutes. The root ball got so big it only took 2 gallons of nutes to fill the bucket...the roots displaced the rest. I find your system interesting. "Drain and Fill". Good way to move the solution around. Congrats on avoiding any root rot, as well. That's why I stopped playing with DWC in this op. I would have needed a big ass chiller to really crank ass, and didn't want to go that route. It is an amazing system. I like that the plants can be moved around. I do not like re using nutes, though. I've become a huge fan of drain to waste. This is really the only way to KNOW that the nutes your plants are getting are perfect. Plus, my PH pen is gathering dust...nice..
collective gardener
Well-Known Member
Found a feel good video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iAc4N_drTXU
lamabile85
Member
Collective,
Are you still using Cutting Edge?
Are you still using Cutting Edge?
collective gardener
Well-Known Member
No. I'm using Advanced Sensi Bloom (but am going back to Connoseur), Big Bud, B-52, and Cutting Edge Mag Amp. I use Yellow Bottle Final right before the flush. The AN just out produced the CE so much, I had to switch. Now, I'm trying to find something as good as AN. Trying the GroTek line next week on 4 test plants.
SupaM
Well-Known Member
CG, I am going to add that Yellow Bottle Final to my line up. Have you had any experience using silica stones as your media, and if so, what is your take on it? Thanks in advance!
ACK you made me cry, shame on you! Just when I feel so cynical, thanks.
I am beginning my first grow and am using NFT. I have some left over (from a tomato grow) old General Hydroponics, Flora Grow, Flora Bloom and Flora Micro. Are they ok to start with? Or do I need to buy new?
Thank you for all your information it is amazing,
Annie
collective gardener
Well-Known Member
The GH nutes should be fine. Just check to see how much fallout has settled in the bottom. If there's like an inch of crust in the bottom, buy new nutes.
I really do not think NFT is the best settup for you. I would go with Sunshine #4 soiless mix+30% perlite in 1 gallon then 5 gallon pots. Water once per day with 1/2 strength nutes, pure water on Sunday and Thur. Done. That settup will never fail you. There are no pumps to break or clog...no trays to clog or overflow...just no bullshit to go wrong. The Sunshine Mix and Perlite can be watered everyday without getting too wet.
Sorry to just butt right in like that. I'd just hate to see you fight with an NFT settup right off the bat.
TheLastWood
Well-Known Member
U like sunshine better than coco cg?
collective gardener
Well-Known Member
No, I do not. But I like it better for beginning growers. It's idiot proof. If you add 30%-50% perlite, you can water everyday without worry. Sunshine #4 and AN 2 part PH Perfect nutes have to be the easiest way to grow a solid crop with very little to go wrong. I used to advise beginners to use GH nutes, but my experience with AN has changed my mind. 2 part is so easy to mix. Even without a TDS or PH pen, you can just go with half strength and be sure that your ppm will be around 1000 and the PH will be perfect. I really don't think new growers should use ebb and flow, aero, NFT, or any other hydro system. Soiless is the way to go. Then, when the atmosphere is perfect, and they have some experience, they can start playing with more productive and more complex systems.
I have this thing about needing to be able to pick up a plant and move it at anytime in the cycle. This rules out ALOT of systems for me. It's why I never SCROG. Just this morning I took 36 plants from bloom, one at a time, into the veg/work room. I set them on a bench, carefully pruned them, thoroughly sprayed them with my secret coctail (spectracide and Neem), and placed them back on the bloom table in a better position than they came out of. I like this. I like removing a plant to work on it. Having the canopy or the roots in a big tangled mess drives me nuts.
Thank you.
You know the reason I first decided to go with NFT was because every time I have tried to grow anything in soil I have killed it. I have killed things that people say you can not kill. So in 1998 when I first decided to try mmj I started with the NFT system. I did a successful grow of tomatoes and it was actually pretty easy once I realized that the gph metering tips wouldn't work, all they did was clog, tossed them and used the 1/4" tubing staked into the net pots.
Because you have recommended it I will also get some Sunshine Mix #4 and Perlite and follow your instructions. I keep re-reading your grow journal and so much is over my head but each time I read it I retain more. You are a great resource.
Beansly
RIU Bulldog
Hey CG, I hate to even ask cause I know you must be asked questions all the time, but I was hoping you could give me some info on the pre98 bubba? I came across a clone labeled pre98 bubba, but you never know. The guy who gave me the clone only told me that the bud came out airy (he wasn't the grower), but I don't think real bubba's supposed to be airy. Idk though. help?
collective gardener
Well-Known Member
Real Pre-98 is super dense. IF it's grown in a good atmosphere. Too hot and it will get airy. Real pre-98 is so hard to find it's almost non-existant.
Beansly
RIU Bulldog
Yeah, It probably isn't pre98 Bubba but idk. Does bubba have hermaphroditic tendencies?
collective gardener
Well-Known Member
Knock wood, I haven't had a problem with our pheno. Commercial J hasn't either. He tried a tray of Skywalker that went wholesale Hermi and blew out a whole room. There's alot of that out there. I've even heard of growers selling clones that go hermi on purpose...to mess up people's grows. It's shitty, but it makes sense. From a pure business standpoint, it's the smart thing to do. By flooding the market with destructive clones, they reduce or eliminate competition.
I don't know how people get decent genetics these days without knowing someone that already has some good shit. There is a bunch of real shit out there. I have a friend who's just getting started. He's been growing a year and has grown around 20 different strains. All of them have been sub par. All were advertised as real high end shit...mostly OG's. But, not one of them turned out to be anything close to a true OG. The clones were bought from a few different clubs.
I believe most clones are not what they say they are. I also believe that no real commercial grower would ever let live plants of a great strain leave the grow op. Furthermore, I believe that most of the clones being provided to dispensaries to sell are knowingly sub par. It's lucrative to sell clones, but insane to let other people have your best genetics. I could easily sell clones of some shit weed to the clubs we deal with and pass them off as the same Bubba we sell them. If a customer came back to complain, you just tell them they fucked up the grow. It sucks how easy and profitable it is. It also sucks that there's really no way to know what it is you're getting until you spend the time and energy to bloom it out. The only realiable source is, and has always been, a friend who has been growing the strain for several crops. This way you know it's stable enough for production growing. Anything else needs almost a full year of testing before being rolled into production. Anything short of that risks a lost crop.
Beansly
RIU Bulldog
I hear you man. It's tough out there as a new grower without connections though man. I have no idea what he gave me but my only chance to make it here is to get a good clone of a well established strain, I'm almost sure of it. So I have to try it out if I wanna make it. I don't really have a choice until I get a better clone connect which I don't see happening soon. I have some interesting seeds like hindu kush x bubba and ak48 x hillbilly skunk and I have some miscellanious OG and some TGA Plushberry growing, but I'm not sure any of those strains are good enough to fill a whole grow room with.
Idk, I'm rambling now. Thanks cg.
InsaneMJ
Well-Known Member
I think I'd have to agree with you on that one CG. I got a "GDP" strain from a medical shop in SoCal about a month and a half ago, just cut 12 clones and I flowered one out. Sure enough the plant was male.. I took the clones and the mother to the shop and they tried to blaim me for the clone turning male saying I stressed it and what not... We had a nice litte conversation, and he was generous enough to replace my clones and mother for some nug. I think this is why I will never get strains from a medical shop again. A few years ago it wasn't like this though, I would be able to go into LA and buy some legit Kush clones. At the time I didn't even clone, too bad because I can't get my hands back on those strains.
-I.MJ
-I.MJ
collective gardener
Well-Known Member
This is the first I've heard of male clones being sold. This backs my idea that growers are trying to distribute sub-par clones to protect their markets. Now they've gone to straight males. Well, the vendor for those clones will eventually be found out. The club owners will figure it out after 3 or 4 complaints. Then the grower will just sell his male clones to the store down the block. Personally, I think it's far more destructive to sell shitty females. This way the grower takes care of them for 8 whole weeks before he/she realizes that the clones they bought were dog shit.
I've been trying to convince an associate of mine of this. I "loaned" him some 18" plants to bloom out. He buys clones from clubs and has spent the past year growing total crap. He has 3 - 1000 watt lights in a decent grow op and still BUYS pot from me. That's how shitty the clones are he's been buying. I gave him 18 Bubbas to bloom out. He thinks it's his growing skills (lack of) that's causing the bad results. I told him it's bad genetics and gave him the Bubbas to prove it. The plants are in week 3 and looking killer. He's tried my Bubba and loves it. Yet, he keeps on buying clones from clubs, thinking that what they call "OG" is really and OG. He has a third tray ready for plants and wants to put the store bought clones in it. I had to offer him some Tahoe plants to keep him from wasting another 2 months on shit cuts. I don't know what it will take for people to realize that 99% OF STORE BOUGHT CLONES SUCK!!! Not only do they suck, they suck on purpose.
When commercial J found out the new Skywalker would go hermi, another grower really wanted a cut of it. He told us that he knew a guy that would buy clones than go hermi or are super prone to PM, or that look good but really suck. The guy sells these shitty cuts to clubs. Me and J were shocked...but the dude told us that this guy is just one of many who sell defective genetics to clubs.
When Helper D and I bought clones from Cloneville in the Valley we didn't have high hopes. But, we did think that we'd get some pot with at least some redeeming qualities. We were so wrong. The NYC Diesel we took all the way to bloom was a joke. It had nice big buds, was super healthy, but no trichomes. This shit was "No High" pot. No smell, either. It was the perfect plant to fuck up a grow with. It looked great all the way to the end. We kept thinking it would develope some crystals...but it never did. For 10 weeks that piece of shit took up light in my bloom room. The weed it produced was worthless. One plant yielded 7 ozs, and we threw it away.
The delivery service we service is starting a grow op. He asked me about genetics. I, of course, refused to give him any. But, I told him he's be better off buying hundreds of seeds and high grading than buying cuts. It takes 8 months to high grade a batch of seeds...that's from planting seeds to harvesting a crop from the selected pheno. That's alot of power bills to pay with no income. But, you can end up with a great strain. You could buy clones for years and not come up with a decent pheno. Unless you have a source for known cuts, buying seeds provides a better chance of getting a great pheno than buying cuts from clubs.
If anyone knows of a club that sells great cuts CONSISTANTLY, I'd love to hear about it. Personally, I don't think such a club exists. I've just never met a grower who would EVER sell cuts of his best strains for $5-$10 each.