250 watt HPS vs. 500 watts in CFLs

Thinking about making the switch. Currently running a modified Dr. Bud CFL perpetual SOG with decent results, just don't like keeping up with so many plants (like, over 50 of them need water every other day!) so I have been looking into switching to a 250 watt (or 400 watt) HPS.

My main concern is: HPS runs hotter than CFL, at least that is what I am told. I don't have much experience with the lower wattage HPS so I am wondering if a 250 watt (or 400 if it will work) HPS would be cooler than 500ish watts of CFLs (in 23 and 42 watt bulbs of varying spectra). The cabinet/tent is/ will be in my bedroom, which get's pretty hot in the summer time, but since that is winding down in my area I am not too worried about it. The air coming in will be between 60-75 degrees depending on if I'm sleeping in there or not, and the lights will be on at night when it's cooler. However, during the summer it gets really hot, like upwards of 80 in my room, and I already have heat issues with the CFLS.

Tl;Dr: what's hotter: 250 watt HPS vs. 500 watts of CFLs? If a 400 watt HPS will work, I'll do it. With an HPS in a grow tent I think I'll be able to control temps better than a DIY grow cab. Just looking for an opinion.

I think you would like HPS. My only suggestion is getting a 600w digital ballast so you can turn the power to 50% or 300w. That way you have a 300/400/600 watt setup. rather than a 100/175/250 setup. Difference in potential average yield would be about 175 (300-125) grams of buds every 60 days between teh 250w and 600w setup based on .5 gram/watt average yield under HPS. Might as well do 400w or 600w if you are already running 500watts

If you can afford it go for a quality LED. I have an area 51 rw 150 in a 2x2 tent and temps are a non issue. And that 150 watts should pull more than a 250 HPS

If you have a good enough exhaust fan go with a 400w hps, in my 4x2 tent I have one running at about 6" about my plants, lower for a cpl with no heat stress using only a hpme depot online order only higher powered inline duct fan running around 82-84 degrees F depending on the temps outside. And I was running about a total of 600watts combined led/cfl, and I like my 400w hps much better, plants will agree, and got an entire 400w hps kit with a cheap but good enough cooltube w/ 6" reflector for only 139.99

Thanks for the idea Johnny Retro, I really like LEDs and I think that in the future (when they become cheaper AND more stronger) I will totally go with that route for a small scale. However, I am trying to get the tent and the lights for under 200 dollars.

Desolation, thank you as well for your help! It is very encouraging to hear from someone that the heat will not be an issue. I think I am going to play it safe and go with a 250 watt system I found for $120 and with a tent for $80 I think I would be set. I would use my current CFLs to supplement the lighting. Once I can get into a place with a basement (cooler temps) and a more.....legal....environment I will definitely upgrade, but for now I think a 250 with some CFLs to supplement will do fine, especially with my Pure Power Plant

Does anyone disagree that the 250 watt HPS will not be too hot given the conditions in my initial post? Any help or ideas are really appreciated!

I'm stoked to make the switch.

I think a 250 supplemented with cfls is good and bad. The heat from the hps, in a cooltube will be easy to control, but adding the residual heat left from the cfls, you might need 2 exhausts depending on the quality of your fan, definitely need good intake or you will have a very hot canopy, make sure you have a circulation fan in there as well, those beautiful ladies will need it. Are you doing the 20 oz coke bottles like drBgJeans ? If so how is your harvest rate per plant, I harvested 12 with as many watts as you in 32oz cups and only yielded 1oz dry

I do 1 Liters (6 per tray, one tray every 25 days) at between 7-10 grams per plant. Hoping to get up over a 10 gram/ plant average next harvest though, and once i start running some better yielders. Anyway, I have a basic 6 inch fan, I think it does 150 CFM. Got a couple follow up questions:

On the cool tube, do you think i could do without it? it's only like 50 extra dollars but if i can do without it i'd like to. Th 6 inch fan would be for exhaust (i'd pull through carbon filter) with a passive intake at the bottom. I am looking at inline ducting ducting fan to pull air from the tent, through the cool tube, through a carbon filter and vent it outside the tent into my room. If no cool tube just pull air through the filter and out. Any recommendations for fans that would work well with what I am doing?

I'd probably just supplement with a few small CFLs just to get some side lighting, however, I am not opposed to scrapping it if it causes any heat issues. I think the 250 watt will give a lot better results.

My next issue is stealth. I have an attic space, and with winter coming, I think I could put the tent in that and be OK. But, If i had the tent in my room, I know it would be light tight, at least more so than my current setup, do you think it is sketchy to have it in my room? nobody ever comes by, I am just worried that if someone does come by (landlord is the only realistic threat), I want it to look like a clothes hamper or collapsible closet of sorts, maybe just toss some clothes on it?

Side note, I'm high off some Blue Mystic just got done curing. Fire. I just read Beast Grow's comment and I am for sure going to get the 400 or 600 watt package, it is about as much money and allows me to expand in the future. Good call!

http://www.amazon.com/Mylar-Reflective-Hydroponic-Grow-4x2x4/dp/B008WMUEDG/ref=sr_1_11?ie=UTF8&qid=1407822364&sr=8-11&keywords=grow+tent+2x4x4

I am thinking this grow tent, maybe a 2x4x5 one for the same price if it will not sacrifice stealth at all.

1000bulbs.com has , 250 watt phantom ballast , xtrasun econo wing hood , plant max bulb mh 7200k , plantmax bulb hps flower for about 180$ shipped to your house . if your looking for a cooltube hood look elsewhere theirs is xpensive.

I already ordered the tent. It'll fit perfectly and I can use a large TV box to disguise it, throw a sheet over it and bam! Just some boxes in storage. It'll be right by a vent I can exhaust the air through. Sneaky snake, and better. Gonna go with the 600 watt hps cool tube, run it at 50% until I can do something legally, then i've already got the equiptement for a bigger grow. Using the current CFLs with a fixture i am gonna rig up until i can get the lights, don't wanna order the tent and the lights in a short time span for security reasons. Has anyone had any luck with 1 gallon smart pots in a SOG? I've already got the system set up, 6 plants every 25 days, I'd just like to do it a bigger scale. OZ per plant even a possibility?

GeorgiaOkeefe said:

I already ordered the tent. It'll fit perfectly and I can use a large TV box to disguise it, throw a sheet over it and bam! Just some boxes in storage. It'll be right by a vent I can exhaust the air through. Sneaky snake, and better. Gonna go with the 600 watt hps cool tube, run it at 50% until I can do something legally, then i've already got the equiptement for a bigger grow. Using the current CFLs with a fixture i am gonna rig up until i can get the lights, don't wanna order the tent and the lights in a short time span for security reasons. Has anyone had any luck with 1 gallon smart pots in a SOG? I've already got the system set up, 6 plants every 25 days, I'd just like to do it a bigger scale. OZ per plant even a possibility?

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when u run a light whatever the size under the intended watt the spectrum goes haywire the cri goes down and the light nanometer does wierd stuff . theres a good read on dimmable switch ballasts and spectrum problems on icmag . i found it thru google i wish i had a link i'd put it down .

vostok said:

HPS Hands down ....lol you break that cfl, by law you gotta call the EPA or else ....lol

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totally agree! so far, hid is the way to yield the most. i'm keeping my eye on the plasma though...

Oohhh, good thing I ordered the tent first, not the lights. Damn, I thought i was gonna save myself some $$$$ down the road by dimming the 600 watt but it sounds like, from what has been said on this thread and the research I just did, that doing so would actually cost me in the long run, in terms of less lumens per watt, a potentially shortened bulb life, and a worse spectrum. I think I am just going to go with a 400 watt then, and hope it does not get too hot.

Here's the citation of a great study on dimming HIDs, I found it through google:

Ji, Yunfen & Wolsey, Robert. "Dimming Systems for High-Intensity Discharge Lights" Lighting Answers, Volume 1 Issue 4, September 1994.

Short and simple question: Will a 400 watt with a cool tube be adequately cooled using a basic 6 inch inline fan? I am thinking this:

("<" or ">" shows direction of airflow depending on which way it is pointing)

6 inch ducting that meets up with a vent to exhaust air < < 6 inch inline fan < 400 watt HPS cool tube < DIY carbon filter < 2x4 grow tent < passive intake (maybe 4 inch CPU fan for intake if I will need it). I will also have a fan inside the tent to circulate air.

Use store bought LED bulbs!!! 45 degree and 27 degree focus available at 1500 lumens per flood LED bulb
Regular style bulb LED outputs 1800 scattering everywhere 18 bucks each you can hit 10k lumens for 150 bucks.

or just spend 400 on this http://www.cesco.com/b2c/product/105415

23000 lumens CREE LED its good stuff mon

Are those the LED bulbs that screw in to traditional sockets? I have seen those, and had wondered about their potential for cultivation, for some time now, but never found anything when I researched the subject. I am glad someone decided to try it. Definitely don't have the 400 for that though, as nice as it would be. I am extremely excited about LED technology, it seems great for small applications it just is not cheap enough for me......yet. I do not know if you are familiar with the Dr. Bud style of gardening, but i've already got sockets on sockets wired together that would easily adapt to LEDs from CFLs. I've got 15 hard mounted sockets. How many lumens could I get with that?

Maybe I could supplement with these LED bulbs......they're cooler than CFLs and will give me some extra weight. Hmmmmmmmmm

I got the tent in the mail yesterday and got it all up and running. Using a 150 CFM PC fan as eshaust right now, still using the CFLS in the tent, just attatched the lights to a Afro-engineered fixture till I get my HPS. I am gonna buy a fan next, I am thinking a 440 CFM one and use a fan speed controller to keep it quiet. Gonna vent the air either out the window or through the ventilation already in place in the house (the tent is right next to a duct).

Any luck or suggestions on a 1 gallon smart pot SOG? I am thinking twelve plants, 4 harvested every 3 days. Veg for a week or so, depending on strain, then flip? I've been looking around and haven't seen much, most people are pretty strict about that "one plant per square foot" rule with SOG, but coming from a Dr. Bud setup, I have faith in pretty much anything!

BeastGrow said:

I think you would like HPS. My only suggestion is getting a 600w digital ballast so you can turn the power to 50% or 300w. That way you have a 300/400/600 watt setup. rather than a 100/175/250 setup. Difference in potential average yield would be about 175 (300-125) grams of buds every 60 days between teh 250w and 600w setup based on .5 gram/watt average yield under HPS. Might as well do 400w or 600w if you are already running 500watts

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.5 gram per watt ? I get that with CFL's...I would think HPS would do much better but I could be wrong as I have never used HPS.

Georgia how are you ventilating your HPS ? from where are you pulling the air outside ? from inside the grow ? You said that you live in a hot zone and you already have temp's with cfl at 80's , just asking because some people talk about they're temp's with hps , buts thats not mathematic ... you can have exatacly the same system has other guy , but the weather of the zone you live , your house ambient temperature , all this things will play a huge role in you temps with the cooled hps . its not 2x2=4 ...
For example : if you are cooling your cooltube or hood with Inside the Grow air , you can't expect to have the same results as if you where cooling with outside air ... this if the air outside is cool , for example where i live during the day outside temps can go almost to 104 F ... as other guy with the same system then i, living in a zone that dont go past 70 F will offcourse have better temps ...

Unless you put an AC in the equation .. thats another 5 cents off course ..

dluck said:

.5 gram per watt ? I get that with CFL's...I would think HPS would do much better but I could be wrong as I have never used HPS.

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Efficiency of HPS is 125/lumens per watt. AND it has more red spectrum both by percent and total.

Id love to see your high yield CFL pics.

Either way i didnt have to adjust my light at all during flowering keep that in mind. Saves a lot of labor and reduces potential fall hazards.