2x6x8 LED grow - Best Light setup around $1000

Hello,

I am going LED for the first time and I would like to purchase the best set of full cycle LED lights for around $1000 in a 2w x 6l x 8h grow closet. Since the grow is area is rectangular, I may end up with 2 sets of lights. The closet will be vented very well.

I have been looking at the following models: 2x 200w Solarflare from Cali Light works, 2x 270w blackstar, 2x 240w blackdog, 1 x 330w magnum plus2.


Also, where can I find a good place to explain the wattage of an LED light, for example is 200W of LED equiv. to 200W or 400W of HPS??

It's all pretty confusing, but I can see LED is the way to go for obvious reasons despite the start-up cost.

Please help a fellow grower out!

Thanks all!!!
 

djwimbo

Well-Known Member
LED companies like to compare their panels to HID, but they aren't really a good comparison, and whatever the company says is usually wrong. You will hear all sorts of claims of, "This LED outperforms any HID under XXXXwatts!", but that's based off of some BS. That being said, I'm a believer in LED when the sun is not an option.

If you're willing to drop the cash on 2x BD240's why not look into Area51? 2x SGS-160's would be $1095, and are meant for a 2x3ft space.
http://area51lighting.com/the160.html ... that's one I can legitimately recommend, because I own one. And A51's warranty is "better" IMHO.

The CLW SF200's would be a good setup too, the 5W diodes put out some good power, but also a considerable amount of heat (based on what I've read on this site). I chose not to buy on that alone, but CLW also doesn't like to talk about what LED's they use either... and they don't outperform anything else by anything worth bragging about. http://ledgrowlightsreview.org/california-lightworks-interview-with-george-mekhtarian/
With our 5W emitters, the light intensity is so high, even from a distance of 24” that any beam angle narrower than 120 degrees becomes overkill. Other companies need to use a narrower beam angle in order to get higher intensity at the longer distances. But of course they do that at the expense of coverage area.
... some of the worthwhile info on that link.

The 2x BlackDog's would push you up to 40w/sq.ft which is a benchmark to aim for, but I'd still get the SGS over the BlackDog, even at a lower wattage.

This is Dawg's current setup with 2x SGS-160's https://www.rollitup.org/led-other-lighting/644641-all-cree-led-plus-waterfarm-5.html
Or click the link in my sig to see mine.

I do not work for Area51, or any other lighting company, just voicing a counterpoint and my experiences so far.
 

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
Area 51 (A-51) has some excellent offerings. IMHO, worth the extra $$$$$

I just ordered 4 @ 4ft x 23w led tubes ($35 per) Also available in 2ft, so you could have one of each
 
I've seen area 51s before, I noticed on their site that they have umol ratings for their light-- not all companies display this when selling their stuff, I wonder why??

I'm basically looking at the set up with the highest PAR with the highest effective coverage area with low heat and high durability.

Since LEDs are continually and rapidly changing, I would want a more up-to-date model that includes higher quality LEDs, etc.

I will check out the area 51 booth at the cannabis cup this Saturday.
 

djwimbo

Well-Known Member
I've seen area 51s before, I noticed on their site that they have umol ratings for their light-- not all companies display this when selling their stuff, I wonder why??

I'm basically looking at the set up with the highest PAR with the highest effective coverage area with low heat and high durability.

Since LEDs are continually and rapidly changing, I would want a more up-to-date model that includes higher quality LEDs, etc.

I will check out the area 51 booth at the cannabis cup this Saturday.
Most other companies don't advertise their umol ratings because #1 they haven't tested them and #2 if they have, they're not proud of them.

I like the recent addition to their site of "Ours VS Theirs".

Also, when A51 updates with new clusters/panels, they are supposed to be modular. If you have a light failure, you get the updated parts(newest rendition for the chassis).
 

pepperdust

Well-Known Member
PAR means little.. I'll show you why. want a 1000 PAR reading at 24 inches? what if I told you it was a all green panel.. we can never compare spectrum to other spectrum, unless using a higher power color of the same brand.. and even then it would not even be comparable. PAR also doesn't work comparing as some lights are only red / blue, some have whites which is going to register to the PAR rating, while the plant might not use 520nm as well as a 630nm .... once again, comparing PAR I would not suggest to do.

what is a better idea is comparing LED chips / lens angle / panel layout / warranty / price vs. watt output ...

but also I feel this can all be bypassed using the power of instinct. load up a websites page... does it work or fit to you or not? if not move on.. it takes 5 seconds to know how your going to feel about it, all the same if you researched it for months.... pick what will work for you, not for us.
 

hyroot

Well-Known Member
PAR means little.. I'll show you why. want a 1000 PAR reading at 24 inches? what if I told you it was a all green panel.. we can never compare spectrum to other spectrum, unless using a higher power color of the same brand.. and even then it would not even be comparable. PAR also doesn't work comparing as some lights are only red / blue, some have whites which is going to register to the PAR rating, while the plant might not use 520nm as well as a 630nm .... once again, comparing PAR I would not suggest to do.

what is a better idea is comparing LED chips / lens angle / panel layout / warranty / price vs. watt output ...

but also I feel this can all be bypassed using the power of instinct. load up a websites page... does it work or fit to you or not? if not move on.. it takes 5 seconds to know how your going to feel about it, all the same if you researched it for months.... pick what will work for you, not for us.
PAR and PUR. Which is usable light. The more green you have the less usable light therefore lower par. You have par and lumens confused. The more green the more lumens. The more usable light there is the higher the par, so par does matter. Unusable light is subtracted from the amount of usable light. par is measured in umole/s. That is an abbreviation term for micromoles

Plants absorb 20% of green and yellow. Green wavelengths helps plants to absorb more photons in other areas. So not having green will have less par than having the right amount of green. Any amount of green over that 20% will lower par.
 
I am looking into Area 51. They seem solid especially with the level of detail they provide on their SGS-160. Cree LEDs seem good and their 2+ year warranty calls for a super discounted upgrade on the lights. I'm thinking about 2 x Area 51s too now!
 

pepperdust

Well-Known Member
^^ our plants DEFINITELY use 630nm, just to clarify.
I know. Either you confused my words, or I made a confusing statement. I was meaning comparing the plant using more 630 then 520..

PAR and PUR. Which is usable light. The more green you have the less usable light therefore lower par. You have par and lumens confused. The more green the more lumens. The more usable light there is the higher the par, so par does matter. Unusable light is subtracted from the amount of usable light. par is measured in umole/s. That is an abbreviation term for micromoles

Plants absorb 20% of green and yellow. Green wavelengths helps plants to absorb more photons in other areas. So not having green will have less par than having the right amount of green. Any amount of green over that 20% will lower par.
I think your confusing what a plant wants vs. a PAR meter reading.. PAR meters read 400nm to 700nm. any light in those wavelengths contribute to the PAR reading.

"Any amount of green over that 20% will lower par. " see I think your confused, as a PAR meter will register green regardless of intensity, it will not lower a PAR reading, it will only increase a PAR reading.

"The more green you have the less usable light therefore lower par" not when talking about PAR reading.

"Unusable light is subtracted from the amount of usable light." there is no meter in the world that does this, as it's even impossible to talk what data to assign a color spectrum on a made program. also what is usable light and unusable light in your definition? the definition of a PAR meter is to calculate 400nm to 700nm

"The more usable light there is the higher the par, so par does matter" whats even your definition of "usable light" ?once again any light in 400nm to 700nm will contribute to a PAR reading. no PAR does not matter when comparing lights, as each and every light is a different spectrum. the only time you can compare a PAR reading is when using the same object over and over.. using a HPS one round, the same HPS second round, the same HPS third round.. as that is given the exact same data to go off of, as the spectrum does not change. if you were to compare a HPS PAR to a LED PAR, this is a waste of time, as the spectrum has just changed, so it's pointless to compare the PAR number.

Also, no, PAR does not matter once again, as I explained above: " want a 1000 PAR reading at 24 inches? what if I told you it was a all green panel."

all you should be using a par meter for is to see canopy lighting, to get as even lit as possible ( talking about center and edge ). there's really not much more you can do with it. as stated you can use it to build data if using the same lamp over and over, but that's about it, or to see the "aging" of a lamp. you can't even use it on say a XM-L vs a XM-L2 as the spectrum changed, so to compare the PAR reading with the XM-L to X-L2 is pointless once again. even when the new area 51 panels come out, it would be un-wise to compare there old PAR reading to there new PAR reading, as the spectrum is guaranteed to change. which would meaning trying to compare two things that can never be compared ( or shouldn't )
 

hyroot

Well-Known Member
i understand what you think you are saying but you have no idea or clue, i said everything above. the rest of the world disagrees with you.

par meters measure in umole/s (micromoles). if there is too much green the umole/s reading will be lower. an all green panel will measure at the lowest par rating. ana all green panel will measure at the highest lumens though

http://jxb.oxfordjournals.org/content/61/11/3107.full.pdf


http://pcp.oxfordjournals.org/content/50/4/684.full

[url]http://aob.oxfordjournals.org/content/91/7/869.full.pdf

[/URL]
 

pepperdust

Well-Known Member
i understand what you think you are saying but you have no idea or clue, i said everything above. the rest of the world disagrees with you.

par meters measure in umole/s (micromoles). if there is too much green the umole/s reading will be lower. an all green panel will measure at the lowest par rating. ana all green panel will measure at the highest lumens though

http://jxb.oxfordjournals.org/content/61/11/3107.full.pdf


http://pcp.oxfordjournals.org/content/50/4/684.full

http://aob.oxfordjournals.org/content/91/7/869.full.pdf

your an idiot, also have a big ego there, that won't accept when you don't know something someone else does.

do you even have a PAR meter? if not shut your big hole, as I actually know what I'm talking about, as I have first hand experience, as I have a PAR meter.

it's funny posting up documents when you have no first hand knowledge yourself. all your talk is based off papers complicated people wrote up, that you try to make sense of.....


here's something from Eric ([email protected] ) at Li-Cor : "You are correct. If your LEDs all have the same intensity, the LI-190 will read twice as much with two LEDs as it does with one LED. The LI-190 has a linear response to irradiance, and responds nearly equally to any wavelength of irradiance between 400 and 700 nm (see spectral response below). Please let me know if you have any further questions."

you may know the rest of the world, but I know the guy who sells / knows PAR meters from the most used PAR meter company agrees with me, so who agrees with you by the way?

let me know when you want to apologize for being wrong / wasting my time. when you learn to stop being an angry little man, you might actually learn something.
 

hyroot

Well-Known Member
^^^^^^ WHAT EVER YOU SAY SMART GUY. Fyi Thats sarcasm . I can quote some one no one else knows too. You dont know your left from your right..... You are so.wrong and you know it. You just argue for the sake of arguing trying to save face. All you do is make yourself look like an ass who is not very bright. you probably need a shovel to dig yourself out of that hole.

No I dont have a par meter. But I have rented them several times.

Spectraologist,NAsa, Texas a&m, oxford university, Washington state. everyone here. Everyone Thats designs lights in this world agrees with me.

You just quote Some guy at a hydro shop........


Read those scientific studies . They back up everything I say. You might learn something. You might need need a dictionary by your side to understand it.
 

pepperdust

Well-Known Member
I don't know what your hear for, but I'm here to learn, there's a lot I don't know about LED, and I took what you said and made sure someone was right on the topic, to share with everyone so people who come on here can build there knowledge with correct info. I took what you said and what I said, emailed some meter companies to see the correct info to double check. Please see for yourself. I'm not your enemy man, were hear to advance LED which there's too few of us.

here's the emails:

email 1.jpgemail 2.jpg
 
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