A Bored Electrician to Answer Your Questions

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
yeah man, im bored today.
babysitting a system while a building is in a shutdown poersiod for remodelling.

OT is nice, but damn im bored... thank god for wifi.
 

silverhazefiend

Well-Known Member
yeah man, im bored today.
babysitting a system while a building is in a shutdown poersiod for remodelling.

OT is nice, but damn im bored... thank god for wifi.
I say enjoy ur downtime..although is borin ..I was askin about running my 2 600ws in one room with my ac..u were saying it might not work..im gonna see if i can find how many watts the ac pulls..Is there anyway i can make it work? ive seen people use 2 1ks and fans etc..did they alter there home?..any help is apperciated..
 

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
there running lights on one circuit, and a/c on another.

any time you get over 1500 watts or so total, you really need to start seperating the load between different circuits, or switch to 240v.
either way requires rewiring some things.
 

silverhazefiend

Well-Known Member
there running lights on one circuit, and a/c on another.

any time you get over 1500 watts or so total, you really need to start seperating the load between different circuits, or switch to 240v.
either way requires rewiring some things.
I see..2 run a cord into another room is not stealthy at all..I have outlets in my hallway maybe i can use one of those..I have another question..what is that test button u have 2 press on the ac plug..does that stop the ac from tripping everything?
 

stoney917

Well-Known Member
thats a gfi u really want them outside or in kitchens and bathrooms but not for a fridge or nthing with a wound motor it will trip. they can tell the difference between the flow of current froma hot wire that flows threw the neutrul. if the difference is drastically different it trips by the ground fault. its protects appliance and the person using it .that button is just a test to make sure it was installed correctly there is a line and a load if said button is pressed all power should shut down in the outlet untill u hit reset.
 

stoney917

Well-Known Member
now i have a ?
this will be temporary like 2 months of use. while i finish my basement
i have a 20a breaker with a 14-2 wire to it for a bedroom circuit. i know it should be 15a for 14-2 so im gonna treat it as a 15a breaker not 20 so max continous load would be 1440w correct?
mathmatically it works out for me but would like another opinion.
1000whps- 1200w
6infan- 150w
4infan- 70w
airpump- 20w
------------------------------
comes to 1440w exactly which is 80% of 15a should be fine right? i added extra watts about 225 for start up surge to get 1440. once start up is over it will be runnin about 1200-1300 continous. if i can get away with it i may plug a circultion fan in aswell but that will fire up once everything been runnin so it wont be on the inital start up . will this work for me or do i can add temp run through the house out of some 12 or 10 wire but it dont want to if i can get away with it like that . it would be obvious to ppl if they see an bright yellow or orange wire runnin up stairs when all the work in bein done down stairs and the pannel is on the groundfloor. im sure u can help me out with the info i provided but if u need more just ask. safety is key always and so is the temporary .
thanks for your help brotha
stoney
 

stoney917

Well-Known Member
nuthin else will be ran in that circuit and i read ur previous post and want to know how much pushin the 1500w max is acceptable to you? with my setup for my current situation.
 

silverhazefiend

Well-Known Member
nuthin else will be ran in that circuit and i read ur previous post and want to know how much pushin the 1500w max is acceptable to you? with my setup for my current situation.
Im lost myself..what i dont undestand is why..i have 4 outlets..totaling 9 wall jacks..and i cant even use them...i have 2 find more OUTSIDE my room..THEREE IS NO STEALTH WAY 2 RUN A BIG ORAnGE CORD..maybe stapling it 2 the corners of the wall and door wont make it look bad..
 

Miss MeanWeed

Active Member
its just not worth the hassle.

decades ago, it was the thing to do, becase running a few kw's was unheard of for a residential service, so commercial indoor growers didnt have much of a choice, they would stick out like a sore thumb pulling 15kw an hour on a street where the other houses are only pulling 7-900w per hour. the meter reader would have to be an idiot to not notice something fishy.
nowadays, usage has increased significantly across the residential sector, so its pretty easy to get lost in the shuffle if your pulling a large load.
also, generation costs have increased expotentially, and as the power grid ages and maintenance cost rise along with cost of living based salaries, utilities have massive overhead costs, so they dont have the time or patience to be tracking down large anomolies like they did in the past, an anomoly being a meter that is spinning faster than it should be (because your running all those lights) what they care about nowadays, is that they get paid for what power they transmit..... so if there not getting paid for power, bet your sweet ass there going to come looking for whose ripping them off, and prosecute with vengeance.
Thanks for the answer and advice. I needed to show an associate that it is possible and even likely that you will get caught ripping electricity and that it's not worth losing his op over. He still needed convincing so I showed him the infamous Tennessee Pot Cave and how they were busted because they got caught stealing power. That worked.
 

lucindrea

Member
well i see 128 pages on this thread and you still seem to be answering questions ( woot and thanks )
I have a 220 ac plug under my window for a wall unit , i long replace the unit with a 110 unit but i still have this 220 outlet just sitting their. The breaker box has what looks like 2 20A breakers with a metal bar across them both for that plug ( i'm shore you know the type i'm referring to ). The biggest issue i have is that this is a old building , some of the wiring is this silver coated stuff , some is pvc romex .. none of my light fixtures seem to have a grounding wire and that 220 outlet is a 3 wire type .. so i know the building is less than ideal , but i cant do a ton about it now ..

my question is , can i get 2x20A 110v's off it ? is their a proper adapter i can get , would i need to run new wires from the box ( not really possible ) or am i screwed given that it's a 3 wire box ( 1 neut and 2 hot ) .. does anyone make a power strip or something that would plug into a 220 and have 110's on it ?
i'm mainly asking this because i believe the 110's i have in that room are already loaded up and i wouldn't want to overload it.
It's a small area and would most likely go CFL so 110 is better. ( of course they make a ton of 220 ballasts , but i'm trying to avoid the heat and size )
 

Slixxor

Well-Known Member
lucindrea,

As long as they are on the same phase you can run them in parallel, shame you cant just upgrade the breaker :P

- Slix
 

stoney917

Well-Known Member
hey silverhaze fiend i just typed a whole big step by step process to solve ur problem but it got erased but ill type a simple version and hope the man can explain it more to u . all u have to do to not run a cord is to piggyback another outlet on the reversside of the wall and u will have 2 circuits inside the one room very easy to do just alittle work. just make sure u can not have nething runnin in the hall go get some blanks cover plates cover every outlet on the circuit in the hall and cut a hole in the wall on in the room in the sam bay as your hall outlet assumin they share a wall. im gonna let iam5toned explain to u in further detail on how to do this i cant type it step by step over again. but it will work for ya.u will just have to sacrifice the hall circuit and rededicate it to the bedroom. and u will be good. i reccomend u pick up a book at homedepot wiring 123 great for a beginner. theres lots of things u need to find out before u do this so wait for more advice before u start cuttin holes
peace stone
 

silverhazefiend

Well-Known Member
hey silverhaze fiend i just typed a whole big step by step process to solve ur problem but it got erased but ill type a simple version and hope the man can explain it more to u . all u have to do to not run a cord is to piggyback another outlet on the reversside of the wall and u will have 2 circuits inside the one room very easy to do just alittle work. just make sure u can not have nething runnin in the hall go get some blanks cover plates cover every outlet on the circuit in the hall and cut a hole in the wall on in the room in the sam bay as your hall outlet assumin they share a wall. im gonna let iam5toned explain to u in further detail on how to do this i cant type it step by step over again. but it will work for ya.u will just have to sacrifice the hall circuit and rededicate it to the bedroom. and u will be good. i reccomend u pick up a book at homedepot wiring 123 great for a beginner. theres lots of things u need to find out before u do this so wait for more advice before u start cuttin holes
peace stone
I kind of get ur drift..but it would be hard ...
 

lucindrea

Member
lucindrea,

As long as they are on the same phase you can run them in parallel, shame you cant just upgrade the breaker :P

- Slix

what exactly do you mean by upgrade the breaker .. i can yank out the poled 20A breaker ( does that make it 40? ) and put in 2 20's .. i can pull out the plug from the wall and re-wire a new one , i just cant run new wire from the box to the plug ;(

FYI - the breaker i have looks almost excatly like this ( mine looks dirtier ;)

Siemens%20MP220.jpg

and how could they be the same phase , i thought a 220 was 110 from both sides of the breaker box and inherently 180' out of phase from each other.

here is what I'm assuming ( yes i will need to investigate further ) the wiring is

Code:
<--220 side | breakerbox -->
--------------   110 lead
       /--------   netural
-----
       \--------  netural
-------------- 110 lead
i was thinking i would be able to pull 110 off a 110 lead and a neut ... the biggest issue i have is the lack of ground. - of course i dont want to burn the place down either so i have asked
 

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
not having a ground, is not so much a fire hazard, its actually a life safety hazard.
the ground wire is what enables a breaker to trip during a fault condition.
if an appliance is 'floating' (an un grounded conductive object is said to be floating), if the frame because energized, there is no path to ground for the current, so the breaker doesnt trip.
then you come along, and touch the appliance, and zap! you get the shit knocked out of you, because you just completed a path to ground.
 

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
I see..2 run a cord into another room is not stealthy at all..I have outlets in my hallway maybe i can use one of those..I have another question..what is that test button u have 2 press on the ac plug..does that stop the ac from tripping everything?


I want to gorw in a closet but I don't have an outlet there, but there is one on the otherside of the wall where I want to put it. So could I just cut a hole in the wall where it is and install another wall outlet by splicing the ground wire and insalling the outlet on the other side?
yes! this is quite a simple operation

what you will need:
tools-
a tape measure
a keyhole/drywall saw
screwdriver
wire strippers/ cutters
stud finder (optional)
plumb level (optional)
material-
an 'old construction' style single gang cut in box (it has ears for easy installation)
a good 15-20amp receptacle (i would go with the 20. there tougher)
2-3 feet 14/2 or 12/2 romex type nm cable
depending on the wiring in your existing outlet you may need 3 red wirenuts
receptacle cover (optional)

all of this can be got at your local hardware store for cheap! (less than 10)

step one- shut the power off to your existing outlet at the breaker box. if your not sure which one, shut it all off. take no chances

step 2 shut the power off!

step 3- make sure its off

step four- are you SURE its off? double check.

step 5- now that you know the power is off, its time to get started. note the exact position of your existing outlet. it helps to use the tape measure to get a measurement off of a common wall to both rooms

step 6- where your going to be adding the new outlet, measure off of the common wall to get an exact idea of where your existing plug is on the other side of the wall. you will need to know this, as your new box will not fit directly behind the old, it has to sit off to one side by about 4 inches to be safe. you also want to be sure that your new outlet is in the same stud cavity as the old. cavities are typically 13.5 inches in width, but can vary so make sure you take time to verify your in the right spot, or else youll end up either hitting a stud when you cut in the box or even worse, ending up in the wrong cavity. then your gonna end up drilling holes to get the wiring in and that is not the purpose here. this is where the stud finder helps

step 7- now that you know where the new box is going to sit, use a level to position it on the wall where its gonna go and use a pencil to trace the outline of the box.

step 8- now your ready to cut. using the drywall saw, you want to cut about 1/8-1/4 of an inch to the OUTSIDE of the line you traced on the wall. start with the horizontal cuts first. this will help you out in case your to close to a stud or the old device or any other surprises inside the wall and will allow you to shift the location left or right as needed.

step 9- yay you have a hole, and a mess! now its time to disassemble your old plug. remove the cover by the single screw in the center. remove the two screws located top and bottom of the plug. stop. is the power off? triple check. pull the old plug gently away from the wall after you triple checked the power being off.leave he wires hooked up.

step 10- this is the pain in the ass part, getting the wire from the old to the new. use the screw driver to remove a knockout in the back of the old box. these are removable tabs in the back of most outlet boxes

step 11- with your 2-3 foot peice of wire, stick it in from the new hole on the other side and do your best to fish it into the old box through the knockout you removed. this always seems to be the funnest part. it helps if you have a person on the other side to pull it up into the box ALOT. you need 12-16 inches of wire in the old box

step 12- take the new box you picked up the local hardware store and remove a knockout in the back. take the end of the wire coming from the old box and get 12-16 inches in it. once you have this done, shove the box and all the slack wire into the hole you cut and turn the two screws to tighten the box down... tadaa!

step 13- strip back the wires in the new box and install the receptacle. the black wire should connect to the gold screw, the white wire to the silver screw, and the green/bare wire to the green screw. if your color blind see the package the plug came in for a detailed diagram. they are usually there. take care to not leave any exposed copper on the hot and neutral, and make sure your connections are almost too tight. loose wires cause fires. remember that.

step 14- screw in the new plug to the box. it helps if you get the top and bottom screws started a few turns, then push the plug up tight against the wall. make sure you dont pinch the wires. then tighten down the top and bottom screws all the way. put a cover on if you decided to buy one. it looks good and there cheap.

step 15- connect the new wiring to the old. is the power off? you better check first. often this is as simple as just connecting the new wires to the screws on the old receptacle. just remember that only one wire per screw, if theres not space you will need to use the wirenuts to tie all the wires together (new and old) and make jumpers (we call em pigtails) to feed the old plug. make sure you connect the hot wires to the hot, the neutrals to the neutral, and the ground to the grounds. if you screw that up you will have a neat little fireworks show when you turn the power back on!

step 16- put the old receptacle back in the wall and put the cover on. almost done

step 17. turn the power back on. if the breaker holds, odds are you did something right. if you happen to have one, use a meter or plug tester to make sure your connections are good. if not a simple lamp is a good tester. if it comes on when you plug it in at both plugs than you did good!
bongsmilie
and the button is for a GFCI, as someone said.
 

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
what exactly do you mean by upgrade the breaker .. i can yank out the poled 20A breaker ( does that make it 40? ) and put in 2 20's .. i can pull out the plug from the wall and re-wire a new one , i just cant run new wire from the box to the plug ;(

FYI - the breaker i have looks almost excatly like this ( mine looks dirtier ;)

View attachment 1064093



and how could they be the same phase , i thought a 220 was 110 from both sides of the breaker box and inherently 180' out of phase from each other.

here is what I'm assuming ( yes i will need to investigate further ) the wiring is

Code:
<--220 side | breakerbox -->
--------------   110 lead
       /--------   netural
-----
       \--------  netural
-------------- 110 lead
i was thinking i would be able to pull 110 off a 110 lead and a neut ... the biggest issue i have is the lack of ground. - of course i dont want to burn the place down either so i have asked
try this-

http://www.plantlightinghydroponics.com/30-amp-240v-power-box-p-1397.html
 

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
now i have a ?
this will be temporary like 2 months of use. while i finish my basement
i have a 20a breaker with a 14-2 wire to it for a bedroom circuit. i know it should be 15a for 14-2 so im gonna treat it as a 15a breaker not 20 so max continous load would be 1440w correct?
mathmatically it works out for me but would like another opinion.
1000whps- 1200w
6infan- 150w
4infan- 70w
airpump- 20w
------------------------------
comes to 1440w exactly which is 80% of 15a should be fine right? i added extra watts about 225 for start up surge to get 1440. once start up is over it will be runnin about 1200-1300 continous. if i can get away with it i may plug a circultion fan in aswell but that will fire up once everything been runnin so it wont be on the inital start up . will this work for me or do i can add temp run through the house out of some 12 or 10 wire but it dont want to if i can get away with it like that . it would be obvious to ppl if they see an bright yellow or orange wire runnin up stairs when all the work in bein done down stairs and the pannel is on the groundfloor. im sure u can help me out with the info i provided but if u need more just ask. safety is key always and so is the temporary .
thanks for your help brotha
stoney
your right at the max..... really and truley its worng to have #14 even hooked to a 20 amp breaker, but i guess if your the only one that will be in the grow room messing with things,you could get away with it, but your still playing with fiore man, imho. thats the type of setup that could work fine for two weeks and then suddenly burn one day.
 

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
Im lost myself..what i dont undestand is why..i have 4 outlets..totaling 9 wall jacks..and i cant even use them...i have 2 find more OUTSIDE my room..THEREE IS NO STEALTH WAY 2 RUN A BIG ORAnGE CORD..maybe stapling it 2 the corners of the wall and door wont make it look bad..
theres also wiremold....
 
Top