Anyone Made Biodiesel Before?

OregonMeds

OregonMeds

Well-Known Member
Wood gas or bio mass gasification seems more promising, simpler, and more efficient to me.
[youtube]yYGKn12Weu4[/youtube] That's a whole lot of electricity for electric cars or hho production or growing or whatever. You'd be doing a lot more work to make biodeisel to support a generator that big. You throw wood or other materials in and a few minutes later you have gas to power stuff.


People run cars straight off wood gas, have for many years. Though it's not the most efficient since it takes 10 minutes or better to get gasification up to speed before you can take off.
[youtube]hSgL0Ie4zrI[/youtube]


After looking over various options using wood gas to run everything and charge electric transportation at the same time seems like it would be the best idea. It's probably easier to get free wood than free cooking oils etc these days.
 
canuckgrow

canuckgrow

Well-Known Member
Used to give all my used cooking oil from the restaurant to a guy that made bio deisel. pretty simple process if I remember correctly he said it was simply a purification process using filters and gravity.
 
NoGutsGrower

NoGutsGrower

Well-Known Member
never made bio diesel but I had an old nissan/datsun maxima diesel that got converted. a custom turbo kit (worked at nissan had extra turbos laying around) some new fuel lines, glow plugs and tank heater and that thing ran like a top! A station by my house sold b99 in the summer and b50 in the winter. Ugly old beater but got great mileage
 
A

a dog named chico

Well-Known Member
Yeah, seen it made, cooking oil, a little race fuel, and some assorted chemicals, and your in business, they sell kits online that make any ware from ten gallons to 1000 gallons. you will defiantly see a return on your investment when it only costs you $0.98 a gallon to fill up.
 
S

saganist

Member
Used cooking oil need only be filtered of debris. As long as its clean you can burn it in any diesel engine, works best at about half and half with regular diesel.
 
L

Learning2Hydro

Active Member
saganist said:
Used cooking oil need only be filtered of debris. As long as its clean you can burn it in any diesel engine, works best at about half and half with regular diesel.
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Well, from what I read there's a bit more to it than that. It doesn't look like it'll take too much though. Just the startup costs. I'm sure you can make a setup for cheap if you know what you're doing. I'd lean more toward a kit. You can't beat $1 a gallon though.
 
S

saganist

Member
Drove big rigs for many years, the company I worked for bought a tank and filtration equipment and an old fuel truck. Once a month we'd go around and pick up used cooking oil at local restaraunts clean it up and mix it half and half. Cooking oil can run a diesel engine as is (filtered of course) with no problems with about the same mileage as diesel, lots of people doing this. Plus your exahst smells like french fries lol. While there were some start up costs they were well worth it as the restaraunts PAY to have used oil hauled away. Anyways good luck if you choose to try any kind of bio fuel.
 
L

Learning2Hydro

Active Member
Really? Gotta do some more reading. It's down the road, but why the hell not? You can save THOUSANDS every year by doing it. Of course, your selection on cars is limited. Have to find a good deal on a Jetta, as I'm sure the future wife isn't really interested in driving a F-250 to work.
 
A

a dog named chico

Well-Known Member
saganist said:
Drove big rigs for many years, the company I worked for bought a tank and filtration equipment and an old fuel truck. Once a month we'd go around and pick up used cooking oil at local restaraunts clean it up and mix it half and half. Cooking oil can run a diesel engine as is (filtered of course) with no problems with about the same mileage as diesel, lots of people doing this. Plus your exahst smells like french fries lol. While there were some start up costs they were well worth it as the restaraunts PAY to have used oil hauled away. Anyways good luck if you choose to try any kind of bio fuel.
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not doubting what you did, however i think if your just adding filtered cooking oil to reg diesel it's just filler...bio-diesel uses:
ay 1​
Fill tank with seived waste vegetable oil, warm to >40 °C, and leave to settle.
Day 2​
Pour off any water which has settled to the bottom.
waste vegetable oil​

Warm vegetable oil to 55°C
methanol​

If waste vegetable oil is used pour off a small sample of the oil.
sodium hydroxide​

Add 10ml of oil to 100ml of isopropyl alchohol (propan-2-ol)

Mix thoroughly until oil dissolves. Add a few drops of Universal Indicator solution (UI)

Measure how much sodium hydroxide solution (1g NaOH / 1 litre water) is required to neutralise the oil solution - ie. raise pH to 8 / turn UI blue/green

To calculate the number of grams of pure sodium hydroxide required per litre of waste vegetable oil : Divide the number of ml solution required to neutralise by 10, and add to 3.5

eg. If 17ml of sodium hydroxide solution was used, amount of pure sodium hydroxide required:

= (17 ÷ 10) + 3.5

= 5.2g NaOH per litre waste vegetable oil.

(Virgin vegetable oil requires 3.5 g NaOH per litre)

The quantity of methanol required is one fifth the volume of waste vegetable oil being used.

Safety is paramount. Methanol is highly flammable + toxic, Sodium hydoxide is caustic.

Add the calculated quantity of sodium hydroxide to a separate tank containing methanol, and agitate until it has completely dissolved. For example if 100 litres of waste oil was used, 20 litres of methanol will be required.

Add this mixture (sodium methoxide) to the tank containing the waste vegetable oil, and agitate for at least an hour until completely mixed. The resultant mixture is biodiesel and glycerol and will settle into two distinct layers...Glycerol is more dense and will settle to the bottom of the tank. Leave to settle.
Day 3​
Pour off the glycerol which is noticably darker and more viscous than biodiesel.
Additional processing​

The biodiesel can now be purified and filtered to use as fuel.

However, to make biodiesel to meet commercial standards such as ASTM / EN a more complex process must be employed. This involves additional steps such as oil pre-treatement, further purification / washing, drying and often addition of several additives... http://www.biofuelsystems.com/biodiesel/process.htm
 
racerboy71

racerboy71

bud bootlegger
i loved your breakdown chico, but my question always is where on earth do you get methanol from to add to the oil mixture?? i'm sure there are places, but it's not like i can go to the local gas station and pick up a few gallons of methanol to make bio diesel with right?? idk, i'd love to do something like this, but i'm not so sure how easy it is to obtain some of these chemicals that are required to make the synth with..
even the used veggie oil and all can't be that easy to get i would think as bio diesel becomes more popular the chances of your getting your hands on the veggie oil seems harder and harder in my eyes.. maybe i'm wrong, who knows, just thinking out loud is all..
 
L

Learning2Hydro

Active Member
racerboy71 said:
i loved your breakdown chico, but my question always is where on earth do you get methanol from to add to the oil mixture?? i'm sure there are places, but it's not like i can go to the local gas station and pick up a few gallons of methanol to make bio diesel with right?? idk, i'd love to do something like this, but i'm not so sure how easy it is to obtain some of these chemicals that are required to make the synth with..
even the used veggie oil and all can't be that easy to get i would think as bio diesel becomes more popular the chances of your getting your hands on the veggie oil seems harder and harder in my eyes.. maybe i'm wrong, who knows, just thinking out loud is all..
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There are 3 separate ways to make it. You don't have to use methanol. Supposedly, it isn't hard to get the supplies you need. May have to mail order them of course. I've read about getting the oil and they say it is in fact hard to get from corporate places or chains. And yeah, as more people get into it, it will be harder to obtain. Their advice is to negotiate contracts with the local mom and pop restaurants. Now how easy that is, I have no clue.
 
racerboy71

racerboy71

bud bootlegger
Learning2Hydro said:
There are 3 separate ways to make it. You don't have to use methanol. Supposedly, it isn't hard to get the supplies you need. May have to mail order them of course. I've read about getting the oil and they say it is in fact hard to get from corporate places or chains. And yeah, as more people get into it, it will be harder to obtain. Their advice is to negotiate contracts with the local mom and pop restaurants. Now how easy that is, I have no clue.
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nice.. i wasn't trying to deflate your dreams or anything, but i was just curious as to how difficult that it would be to obtain the things that would be needed to complete the process..
and of course i don't know how much i would trust what the people who are trying to sell you a package deal tell you as after all, what do they care how many problems you have getting the required ingredients after you have already purchased their packaged deal and all.. not that i'm saying some people would be out to rip anyone off or anything, lol..
 
NoGutsGrower

NoGutsGrower

Well-Known Member
a dog named chico said:
not doubting what you did, however i think if your just adding filtered cooking oil to reg diesel it's just filler...bio-diesel uses:
ay 1​
Fill tank with seived waste vegetable oil, warm to >40 °C, and leave to settle.
Day 2​
Pour off any water which has settled to the bottom.
waste vegetable oil​

Warm vegetable oil to 55°C
methanol​

If waste vegetable oil is used pour off a small sample of the oil.
sodium hydroxide​

Add 10ml of oil to 100ml of isopropyl alchohol (propan-2-ol)

Mix thoroughly until oil dissolves. Add a few drops of Universal Indicator solution (UI)

Measure how much sodium hydroxide solution (1g NaOH / 1 litre water) is required to neutralise the oil solution - ie. raise pH to 8 / turn UI blue/green

To calculate the number of grams of pure sodium hydroxide required per litre of waste vegetable oil : Divide the number of ml solution required to neutralise by 10, and add to 3.5

eg. If 17ml of sodium hydroxide solution was used, amount of pure sodium hydroxide required:

= (17 ÷ 10) + 3.5

= 5.2g NaOH per litre waste vegetable oil.

(Virgin vegetable oil requires 3.5 g NaOH per litre)

The quantity of methanol required is one fifth the volume of waste vegetable oil being used.

Safety is paramount. Methanol is highly flammable + toxic, Sodium hydoxide is caustic.

Add the calculated quantity of sodium hydroxide to a separate tank containing methanol, and agitate until it has completely dissolved. For example if 100 litres of waste oil was used, 20 litres of methanol will be required.

Add this mixture (sodium methoxide) to the tank containing the waste vegetable oil, and agitate for at least an hour until completely mixed. The resultant mixture is biodiesel and glycerol and will settle into two distinct layers...Glycerol is more dense and will settle to the bottom of the tank. Leave to settle.
Day 3​
Pour off the glycerol which is noticably darker and more viscous than biodiesel.
Additional processing​

The biodiesel can now be purified and filtered to use as fuel.

However, to make biodiesel to meet commercial standards such as ASTM / EN a more complex process must be employed. This involves additional steps such as oil pre-treatement, further purification / washing, drying and often addition of several additives... http://www.biofuelsystems.com/biodiesel/process.htm
Click to expand...
I met a guy waiting to get fuel behind me. he said he ran straight veggie oil in the summer! would go pick it up from food joints he had 2 tanks in his truck one labeled veggie one labeled bio. He said all he did was filter it! Not saying I know for sure that you can but he had no reason to lie! just a couple guys bs'ing at the gas pumps.
 
NoGutsGrower

NoGutsGrower

Well-Known Member
oh yeah some vegin farm use a jett on biodiesel, saw it on the 30 days series (not that I put any faith into the validity of those shows!)
 
L

Learning2Hydro

Active Member
racerboy71 said:
nice.. i wasn't trying to deflate your dreams or anything, but i was just curious as to how difficult that it would be to obtain the things that would be needed to complete the process..
and of course i don't know how much i would trust what the people who are trying to sell you a package deal tell you as after all, what do they care how many problems you have getting the required ingredients after you have already purchased their packaged deal and all.. not that i'm saying some people would be out to rip anyone off or anything, lol..
Click to expand...
No problem at all. FWIW, that site I linked doesn't appear to be selling anything outright, but yeah, the companies that sell the systems are in it to make money after all. Still, worth looking into at least. It'll always require more than what they say and nothing is every as easy as they claim, but with a little experience and knowledge, I think it is possible.
 
L

Learning2Hydro

Active Member
Also, I'm not even taking the environmental approach. I'm looking at it purely in terms of my pocketbook. If I can realistically save 4k or so a year, that's 4k I can invest or just splurge on seeds and equipment. ;)
 
MrEDuck

MrEDuck

Well-Known Member
I made small batches of biodiesel when I was working in R&D trying to improve the process. It works, but nowhere near as well as they say. Expect to spend twice as long as they say when you start. It often takes two or three trial batches for every new batch of used oil you get. But financially it is definately viable, but I'm not sure about the $1/gallon price tag. But even twice that is still an amazing price.
 
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