sandmonkey
Well-Known Member
I doubt anyone here gets the point of the video(s), as in Shias/Sunnis coming together against "terrorism". They don't know Islam, so I doubt they'll understand our different schools of thought
Are they really terrorists or are they just plain mercenaries
- Thread starter thechoroid
- Start date
CrackerJax
New Member
Well, let's inform everyone right now of the differences between the two sects....
Question: What's the Difference Between Shia and Sunni Muslims?
Answer: Both Sunni and Shia Muslims share the most fundamental Islamic beliefs and articles of faith. The differences between these two main sub-groups within Islam initially stemmed not from spiritual differences, but political ones. Over the centuries, however, these political differences have spawned a number of varying practices and positions which have come to carry a spiritual significance.
Origins - A Question of Leadership
The division between Shia and Sunni dates back to the death of the Prophet Muhammad, and the question of who was to take over the leadership of the Muslim nation. Sunni Muslims agree with the position taken by many of the Prophet's companions, that the new leader should be elected from among those capable of the job. This is what was done, and the Prophet Muhammad's close friend and advisor, Abu Bakr, became the first Caliph of the Islamic nation. The word "Sunni" in Arabic comes from a word meaning "one who follows the traditions of the Prophet." On the other hand, some Muslims share the belief that leadership should have stayed within the Prophet's own family, among those specifically appointed by him, or among Imams appointed by God Himself.
The Shia Muslims believe that following the Prophet Muhammad's death, leadership should have passed directly to his cousin/son-in-law, Ali. Throughout history, Shia Muslims have not recognized the authority of elected Muslim leaders, choosing instead to follow a line of Imams which they believe have been appointed by the Prophet Muhammad or God Himself. The word "Shia" in Arabic means a group or supportive party of people. The commonly-known term is shortened from the historical "Shia-t-Ali," or "the Party of Ali." They are also known as followers of "Ahl-al-Bayt" or "People of the Household" (of the Prophet).
Distribution
Sunni Muslims make up the majority (85%) of Muslims all over the world. Significant populations of Shia Muslims can be found in Iran and Iraq, and large minority communities in Yemen, Bahrain, Syria, and Lebanon.
Differences in Religious Practice
From this initial question of political leadership, some aspects of spiritual life have been affected and now differ between the two groups of Muslims. It is important to remember that despite these differences in opinion and practice, Shia and Sunni Muslims share the main articles of Islamic belief and are considered by most to be brethren in faith. In fact, most Muslims do not distinguish themselves by claiming membership in any particular group, but prefer to call themselves simply, "Muslims."
Religious Leadership
Shia Muslims believe that the Imam is sinless by nature, and that his authority is infallible as it comes directly from God. Therefore, Shia Muslims often venerate the Imams as saints and perform pilgrimages to their tombs and shrines in the hopes of divine intercession. Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for a hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders, and certainly no basis for the veneration or intercession of saints. Sunni Muslims contend that leadership of the community is not a birthright, but a trust that is earned and which may be given or taken away by the people themselves.
Religious Texts and Practices
Shia Muslims also feel animosity towards some of the companions of the Prophet Muhammad, based on their positions and actions during the early years of discord about leadership in the community. Many of these companions (Abu Bakr, Umar, Aisha, etc.) have narrated traditions about the Prophet's life and spiritual practice. Shia Muslims reject these traditions (hadith) and do not base any of their religious practices on the testimony of these individuals. This naturally gives rise to some differences in religious practice between the two groups. These differences touch all detailed aspects of religious life: prayer, fasting, pilgrimage, etc.
Question: What's the Difference Between Shia and Sunni Muslims?
Answer: Both Sunni and Shia Muslims share the most fundamental Islamic beliefs and articles of faith. The differences between these two main sub-groups within Islam initially stemmed not from spiritual differences, but political ones. Over the centuries, however, these political differences have spawned a number of varying practices and positions which have come to carry a spiritual significance.
Origins - A Question of Leadership
The division between Shia and Sunni dates back to the death of the Prophet Muhammad, and the question of who was to take over the leadership of the Muslim nation. Sunni Muslims agree with the position taken by many of the Prophet's companions, that the new leader should be elected from among those capable of the job. This is what was done, and the Prophet Muhammad's close friend and advisor, Abu Bakr, became the first Caliph of the Islamic nation. The word "Sunni" in Arabic comes from a word meaning "one who follows the traditions of the Prophet." On the other hand, some Muslims share the belief that leadership should have stayed within the Prophet's own family, among those specifically appointed by him, or among Imams appointed by God Himself.
The Shia Muslims believe that following the Prophet Muhammad's death, leadership should have passed directly to his cousin/son-in-law, Ali. Throughout history, Shia Muslims have not recognized the authority of elected Muslim leaders, choosing instead to follow a line of Imams which they believe have been appointed by the Prophet Muhammad or God Himself. The word "Shia" in Arabic means a group or supportive party of people. The commonly-known term is shortened from the historical "Shia-t-Ali," or "the Party of Ali." They are also known as followers of "Ahl-al-Bayt" or "People of the Household" (of the Prophet).
Distribution
Sunni Muslims make up the majority (85%) of Muslims all over the world. Significant populations of Shia Muslims can be found in Iran and Iraq, and large minority communities in Yemen, Bahrain, Syria, and Lebanon.
Differences in Religious Practice
From this initial question of political leadership, some aspects of spiritual life have been affected and now differ between the two groups of Muslims. It is important to remember that despite these differences in opinion and practice, Shia and Sunni Muslims share the main articles of Islamic belief and are considered by most to be brethren in faith. In fact, most Muslims do not distinguish themselves by claiming membership in any particular group, but prefer to call themselves simply, "Muslims."
Religious Leadership
Shia Muslims believe that the Imam is sinless by nature, and that his authority is infallible as it comes directly from God. Therefore, Shia Muslims often venerate the Imams as saints and perform pilgrimages to their tombs and shrines in the hopes of divine intercession. Sunni Muslims counter that there is no basis in Islam for a hereditary privileged class of spiritual leaders, and certainly no basis for the veneration or intercession of saints. Sunni Muslims contend that leadership of the community is not a birthright, but a trust that is earned and which may be given or taken away by the people themselves.
Religious Texts and Practices
Shia Muslims also feel animosity towards some of the companions of the Prophet Muhammad, based on their positions and actions during the early years of discord about leadership in the community. Many of these companions (Abu Bakr, Umar, Aisha, etc.) have narrated traditions about the Prophet's life and spiritual practice. Shia Muslims reject these traditions (hadith) and do not base any of their religious practices on the testimony of these individuals. This naturally gives rise to some differences in religious practice between the two groups. These differences touch all detailed aspects of religious life: prayer, fasting, pilgrimage, etc.
SDSativa
Active Member
Why is it that so many muslims despise the jews? They consider Jesus a prophet, and he was a jew. He recognized the jewish bible, but I'm sure there is an argument he wasn't, right? I don't know how strapping a bomb to a child is doing Gods work. I just don't get it. They hate the jews and the west for all they stand for, and don't want their people to be free. I would love to here of some examples that show me otherwise. And if we are going to talk about religous people forcing their religions on others, muslims are ideal candidates. I know the history of christians doing so, but in todays world, muslims have been the ones killing and terrorizing others to spread the "religion of peace". Even if you disagree with the "war on terror", the ones who are actually fighting, atleast those in America, do so to stop terror and oppression. We are not going over there trying to convert others, or to cause chaos. We just want others to enjoy the same freedoms we take for granted in this great nation. We fight in the name of freedom, to put an end to tyranny. How can you say we are oppressing other people. We believe in the exact opposite.
thechoroid
Active Member
Thank you for clarifying the differences in a well organised manner. These differences are also present amongst catholics and protestants, so I guess it's just in the nature of man to dispute on what should be indisputable although religion tends to unify in the understanding that GOD is one.
thechoroid
Active Member
Sativa! do some reading for your sake!you're making yourself look like a ignorant, hence degrading the nickname you hold in this forum and what it stands for!
Again and again I repeat! Muslims do not insist on spreading the word of Islam for it is in GOD's hand to guide whomever he wishes, whereas I can't say the same for the christians that are planning to put up a cross on the moon, of course planned by none other than NASA and ordered by a wealthy christian community.Go figure!
CrackerJax
New Member
This is the entire problem with most religions..... there is no true WORD of G*D. Anything made by man (religion) is open to interpretation which brings about conflict.
Green Cross
Well-Known Member
Is there anything man hasn't screwed up? The more reason Man needs salvation, and your statement in no way disproves the existence of God.
sandmonkey
Well-Known Member
Yeah but Sunnis and Shiites don't disagree on the word of Allah, but the words and intentions of the prophet Muhammad.
CrackerJax
New Member
I'm not trying to disprove G*D. Just the invented "man G*D", which is false. The point of origin G*D does exist. The man religion G*DS do not, and this maniacal adherence to those myths are a great source of conflict globally, for no good reason.....we kill each other over myths....lawdy.
Green Cross
Well-Known Member
What conflict? The terrorist, who are envious of the USA, and who feel threatened by our freedom? That conflict?
There is good and evil (in constant struggle) that much is obvious isn't it?
CrackerJax
New Member
no the unending conflict between the religions which are integrated into a nation state ethos.
Think G*D which is "supposed" to be infallible......right?...... think an infallible G*D would set up DIFFERING religions? For what purpose? So we can kill each other over it? That's what we've been doing you know.
Each religion believes themselves to be the TRUE religion.
Why would an all knowing G*D set us up for such torment, and not simply clarify it for all??!! Sounds a bit flawed....unless G*D truly hates us and wants us to war over him.....because that is just what we do.
Think G*D which is "supposed" to be infallible......right?...... think an infallible G*D would set up DIFFERING religions? For what purpose? So we can kill each other over it? That's what we've been doing you know.
Each religion believes themselves to be the TRUE religion.
Why would an all knowing G*D set us up for such torment, and not simply clarify it for all??!! Sounds a bit flawed....unless G*D truly hates us and wants us to war over him.....because that is just what we do.
thechoroid
Active Member
Your thoughts are correct but slightly misleading to those who base their knowledge about religion on what they hear from other people or what they see on tv
and not those who have actually read the religious books, which might be 5-10% of all earth's population.
GOD has given us one religion for he is one. Each religion was the rectification and continuation of the latter. The koran was the last warning and straight path to repent for what we have made with humanity and Earth( that does not belong to us for we are only part of it). In the Koran, a true believer is that who believes and does not deny the existence of all the prophets: Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Mohammed.
So, as you can see, GOD is not misleading us, we are doing that to ourselves by considering that there is a difference in religion.
CrackerJax
New Member
One need only look at the basic tenants of Christianity and Islam to see that they are VERY different religions, not variations of the same message.
Each religion was meant for the ppl in that area. Religions start locally and spread outward.
Religion isn't the word of G*D handed down from above. It is a pre science explanation of mans world around him. It's a coping mechanism....and these religions worked for those local populations. Now, however, things have changed and religion has been spread out all over the globe in a race for converts to prove one side over the other. When the religions came into existence, this spreading was not possible. There is no ONE true religion...... but just try and tell that to a Christian or a Muslim. Hence, all the conflict.
Christianity and Islam are CULT religions, and the world would be a far far better place without them both.
Each religion was meant for the ppl in that area. Religions start locally and spread outward.
Religion isn't the word of G*D handed down from above. It is a pre science explanation of mans world around him. It's a coping mechanism....and these religions worked for those local populations. Now, however, things have changed and religion has been spread out all over the globe in a race for converts to prove one side over the other. When the religions came into existence, this spreading was not possible. There is no ONE true religion...... but just try and tell that to a Christian or a Muslim. Hence, all the conflict.
Christianity and Islam are CULT religions, and the world would be a far far better place without them both.
thechoroid
Active Member
By tenants you mean ethnicity? if so, then it doesn't fit, because both religions have spread throughout the world to such an extent that you cannot relate it to one continent.
the area of all 3 religions remains almost geographically identical.
Agreed, had there not been distinct information that science only now is proving and no man could have known them. try and google the scientific miracles of the koran. Many scientists have became muslims when the work of their lives was already fortold 1500 years ago.
Don't you sense man's hand in this? starting from the days when christianity spread to europe and religious people acquired great power, and where there is power there is greed for more power, etc..
Actually the world would have been a much better place had they been practiced properly. Again, we only have ourselves to blame
sandmonkey
Well-Known Member
Funny enough I was just looking through my copy of Dr Zakir Naik's book "The Qur'an and Modern Science: Compatible or Incompatible?". One can't deny the miraculous, divine nature of the Qur'an. But those who are stubborn disbelievers will remain so...
CrackerJax
New Member
That works both ways.... for believers as well. Some will never see religion for what it truly is.... a controlling mechanism.
Tenants means core values....the building blocks of a religion. Islam and Christianity have shared commonalities, but the messages are quite different. If they were in deed very similar, there would not have been fighting for the last 1500 years between them.
The religions areas have not remained identical. Islam has spread all over the globe as has Christianity. They started in ONE place and radiated outward.
Qaran miracles/prophecies are the same as Christians.... wide generalizations INTERPRETED to modern events. Also, believers only tend to count the hits and not the misses.
To say to me that way back at the beginning of all of these religions... the space time continuum had been broken and the futures revealed to these folks..... sounds a bit much. Religion RELIES on the underpinning that the world is predestined. Yet, if you actually look at nature and the way things REALLY happen..... no plan is evident. Man already new this instictively....hence the need for religion..... order had to come from somewhere, and if it couldn't be found here on earth, why we just simply made it up above us. Life was and is a big mystery for lots of ppl..... so comforting to think that all the answers will be forthcoming AFTER you die. It's a great trick..... worthy of the best vegas magicians..
thechoroid
Active Member
Well, we can go on with this forever but the fact that whenever anything bad happens to you or your family and I hope that it never does, in those weak moments when you don't know what to do, I don't think you'll be asking vegas magicians for help. A tradition? maybe so, maybe so..That works both ways.... for believers as well. Some will never see religion for what it truly is.... a controlling mechanism.
Tenants means core values....the building blocks of a religion. Islam and Christianity have shared commonalities, but the messages are quite different. If they were in deed very similar, there would not have been fighting for the last 1500 years between them.
The religions areas have not remained identical. Islam has spread all over the globe as has Christianity. They started in ONE place and radiated outward.
Qaran miracles/prophecies are the same as Christians.... wide generalizations INTERPRETED to modern events. Also, believers only tend to count the hits and not the misses.
To say to me that way back at the beginning of all of these religions... the space time continuum had been broken and the futures revealed to these folks..... sounds a bit much. Religion RELIES on the underpinning that the world is predestined. Yet, if you actually look at nature and the way things REALLY happen..... no plan is evident. Man already new this instictively....hence the need for religion..... order had to come from somewhere, and if it couldn't be found here on earth, why we just simply made it up above us. Life was and is a big mystery for lots of ppl..... so comforting to think that all the answers will be forthcoming AFTER you die. It's a great trick..... worthy of the best vegas magicians..
thechoroid
Active Member
Time will only tell my brother. Although once in a while I think about the content of some verses where the description of heaven and so on... I mean, lying around on pillows wearing some silk clothes and drinking wine FOR ETERNITY is not what I expect to earn by not sinning and believing. Where's the logic?
CrackerJax
New Member
No, I won't. i won't ask a mythical creature for it either. Superstition is a Darwinian defense mechanism and hard wired in the brain. It takes a certain discipline to resist it. Most cannot.....fewer even try.
Green Cross
Well-Known Member
Good morning terrorists
Keep up your propaganda and the USA will be more than happy to bomb you right back into the stone-age again.
In other words, play nice!
