Astir Grow Led Panel Project...

^^^^^Nice find on the reflectors...........never seen that before....is this something your looking into for the final design?/ it will cut your coverage/spectrum blending significantly.....

The 660nm that is within the NW diode is not enough (IMO/ha) for the late stages of flowering..........but wtf do I know/ we shall see through your tests! good luck grower

Some more interesting infos...

http://www.led-professional.com/products/led-phosphors-resins/sumitomo-metal-mining-tohoku-university-research-team-develop-new-oxide-based-red-phosphor

Wow..That's a nice red phosphor...Further to the "right" ..More red/far red...

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http://www.led-professional.com/products/led-optics/the-most-comprehensive-range-of-reflectors-for-leds-from-khatod

Reflectors...Instead of lenses ?

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http://www.led-professional.com/products/leds_led_modules/edison-opto-introduces-an-ultra-high-cost-performance-ratio-product-the-edixeon-c-series

Very good leds ( Have tested some of them..Great quality at that led "format" of 8mm )

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http://www.led-professional.com/products/leds_led_modules/led-engin-introduces-next-gen-multicolor-multi-chip-emitters

The future....

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http://www.led-professional.com/products/led-pcbs/celciontm-thick-film-material-system-that-outperforms-traditional-mcpbcs

Sounds costly,though...

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http://www.led-professional.com/products/led-simulation-tools
These are really powerful tools...

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Ah... I see what your saying ........I agree with you that reflectors are better than secondary (mag) lenses........but to me it's relative to the angle of the primary lenses on the diodes, you don't want more than a 10% difference between diode/reflector ........IMO

Nice find on the reflectors...........never seen that before....is this something your looking into for the final design?

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Yes...Many things are still .." fluid "...
These are experimental prototypes you are seeing..
Not a final grow led panel for commercial use...
Still, there're many "modifications" to be done...
Maybe utilising branded leds for some " high -end " models ..
Still they 'll be solid stuck to passive cooling,though...
And the use of lenses is totally ,out of discussion..
Lenses belong to other applications of leds...(Our humble philosophy...)
...
The main thing,considered right now,is the option of " STD series " (cheap pcbs'/ leds / drivers /non-anodised hs) offering low cost and great service-ability /upgrade-ability...
And the same spectums/powers at the "Signature Series " option...(high-quality pcbs or hs films / branded leds-mainly Osrams&Crees-/MeanWell drivers / Fischer blck anod. hs )..
For the top-quality freaks....(like me....)

it will cut your coverage/spectrum blending significantly.....

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No...Not that much...Not like lenses do,for example...

The 660nm that is within the NW diode is not enough (IMO/ha) for the late stages of flowering..........but wtf do I know/ we shall see through your tests! good luck grower

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I was referring to warm whites not neutral...But,anyway...Nobody knows it all...There are still ,many things to be discovered,regarding the use of leds for growing plants...
And yes...Thank you,very much ...We always need,all the luck we can get...

PSUAGRO. said:

Ah... I see what your saying ........I agree with you that reflectors are better than secondary (mag) lenses........but to me it's relative to the angle of the primary lenses on the diodes, you don't want more than a 10% difference between diode/reflector ........IMO

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Features:
• Fit for most of HB LEDs from 100 to 600 lumens and over
• Typical square-shaped beam
• Made of PC for special coating treatment
• Innovative vacuum coating treatment, specific for optical reflector systems
• High performance with warm white LEDs; yellow ring effect totally eliminated
• High lighting efficiency
• Excellent luminous flux
• No vibration problems
• Superior optical engineering for a perfect uniform light distribution
• Innovative design
• Positioning pegs: Easy fixing onto the PCB*
• UV protected and guaranteed for outdoor applications
• Complying with UL94 Specifications
• Patent pending


Ok,yes ...
You can't have a 120° led and expect from a reflector to concentrate the light into a 45° or 60° cone...

Reflectors mainly , " bound " the light ...Put " limits " to illuminating pattern of light source..
So I think "reflectoring" a 120° led,it may keep that same emission angle..
But without much light lost over the 120° cone...

http://www.led-professional.com/project_news/special-lighting/purdue-university-partners-with-rutgers-university-the-university-of-arizona-michigan-state-university-and-orbital-technologies-corp.-for-led-lighting-of-plants-project

.....The " interesting " part.....
"....and traditional overhead lighting doesn't reach the lower parts of many plants. Mitchell believes that using LED lights on the sides of plants will increase photosynthesis and flowering, improving yield."

Remember " diffused angled light " ?
Coverage ?
Or "multiple panels" ?
Or more leds instead of less in number powerful ones ?
Or nasa's "intracanopy led illumination " ?


http://www.led-professional.com/technology/light-generation/bridgelux-and-toshiba-achieve-world-class-performance-for-8-gan-on-silicon-leds


Who said Bridgelux chips suck ?

"....Bridgelux and Toshiba have achieved the industry&#8217;s top class 8&#8221; GaN on Silicon LED chip emitting 614mW, <3.1V@350mA with 1.1mm square chip, just months after they have engaged in a joint collaborative agreement this year. Bridgelux and Toshiba will further accelerate their development efforts for LED chips, which have seen increasing demand for LCD panels and lightening systems world wide. ..."

Uh....Double the radiometric efficiency of a new HPS.....

So,there are ,some new powerfull whites ,on the way...

Probably,during 2013 ,with new dies & phosphors ,whites (specially warm ones ) are going to be even more efficient for growing plants ,under them....

....
Nice...

And some very usefull pdfs from the research mentioned above ....

http://leds.hrt.msu.edu/research/

http://leds.hrt.msu.edu/publications/

^^^ha yeah........never said bridgelux sucked/ said they are ok/good top bins==if real!...but those numbers are impressive....even epiled/epistar will obviously get better due to the industry evolving FAST.......looks like will have to upgrade our panels every year lol......DIY is getting more appealing every day..

That's what i was thinking maybe 100-110 degree diode lens in a 120 degree reflector.......should work well with a minimal loss/good coverage and a good spectral mix between them.....

^^^ha yeah........never said bridgelux sucked/ said they are ok/good top bins==if real!...but those numbers are impressive....even epiled/epistar will obviously get better due to the industry evolving FAST

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Com'on...I wasn't referring to you ....
(You 've said that bridgelux is ok /good ? I remember someone saying so...)
Yes... Those numbers are impressive..
And yes...Even the smallest ,asian,crappy,led factory ,follows the general improvements...Let alone Epiled,Epistar and others more renown...

.......looks like will have to upgrade our panels every year lol......DIY is getting more appealing every day..

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One of the main reasons,for us,at Astir, using cheap leds to experiment with....
But at one point,there is gonna be a " plateau " at led evolution...
Then,it's going to be a really,good idea to use expensive ,high-quality leds ,for led grow panels...

That's what i was thinking maybe 100-110 degree diode lens in a 120 reflector.......should work well with a minimal loss/good coverage and a good spectral mix between them....

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I think the same....

SDS, you are a wealth of information.

Thanks you.............

hi guys.. these 2 pics are from a test grow that we use panels along with hps but they light in specific buds.. 6th week of flowering 36th day .. strain white russian too.

Great work , psynobi

stardustsailor said:

Oh ,in that case ,you 'll probably need one FR at 720-740 ...( Like-for those ,kind of PCBs'/panels- an Edixeon "cherry red" 720-750 nm led...)
Probably,it 'll be the "right" thing to do...To compensate the adverse effects of 660-680 light..While keeping the "good" ones...
Far red provided by Warm Whites,is just enough ,to compensate the 650-700 red ,that is also there,from warm Whites...
It won't be enough ,to counteract the extra 660+/- light....


Anyway...

Something else now....

About concentrating light....

Want to "gather" light ?
Want to minimise side-over the given led's half-angle-light " losses " ?
Either you use lenses..
Or.....

The Old-good-all-time-classic.......Reflectors...
-3% max,power losses....
Not same like lenses ,but still it's a good ...light-boy,cosidering gathering the 'herd' of photons....

24 led .4 rows of 6 leds reflector ..

http://www.led-professional.com/products/led-optics/khatod-announces-pixel-optical-reflector-systems-for-high-brightness-leds

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what about if we use one big reflector round the heat sink corners? is this going to help or not?

PSUAGRO. said:

^^^ha yeah........

That's what i was thinking maybe 100-110 degree diode lens in a 120 degree reflector.......should work well with a minimal loss/good coverage and a good spectral mix between them.....

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maybe your last ... was bad?

psynobi said:

hi guys.. these 2 pics are from a test grow that we use panels along with hps but they light in specific buds.. 6th week of flowering 36th day .. strain white russian too.

View attachment 2360017View attachment 2360018

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i wanna dive in to your "forest"!!!
beautifull ladies!

psynobi, I bought a large nickel-chrome mixing bowl (~ 18" Dia X 8" deep= ~ 45cm X 20cm) for a different project, where I cut a 6" hole in the bottom. A smaller hole would accommodate a PC fan as a backup for passive cooling


I Did A Bad Bad Thing

As great as everything was in my led tent, I decided to push the envelop yesterday and bought a waterfall system for aquariums: the purpose was to gently splash nutes over lava rock, upon which the root mass rests. After a couple hours of fiddling I gave up, and returned it.

Alas, the plants suffered a heavy wilt. One mostly recovered over night, the other is still very wilted. I think I can salvage it, but all that momentum is lost.[/COLOR]

420 Likes / smoking time

guod said:

maybe your last ... was bad?

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Well I am smoking my BM auto's............I see what your thinking but reflector's by design have the light source recessed ......so it will still hit the sides and bounce out.....maybe

Hi guys...nice work &#913;&#931;&#932;&#919;&#929; led project team...

Hello and from here