Bernie Sanders Is Wrong

ginwilly

ginwilly

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
Your own libertarian messiah disagrees with you...

"I think the Austrian business-cycle theory has done the world a great deal of harm. If you go back to the 1930s, which is a key point, here you had the Austrians sitting in London, Hayek and Lionel Robbins, and saying you just have to let the bottom drop out of the world. You've just got to let it cure itself. You can't do anything about it. You will only make it worse. … I think by encouraging that kind of do-nothing policy both in Britain and in the United States, they did harm." -Milton Friedman

So are you wrong, or is Friedman wrong?

..as do the facts of reality. The Great Depression began for the exact opposite reasons you believe, and recovered for completely opposite reasons you believe. I just posted objective, verifiable data to support it; 21-32 All republican control, all "hands-off", like you support > then the Great Depression > then FDR and the democrats implemented a "hands-on" economic policy > then BOOM, unprecedented recovery for 2 decades. Same thing with the 07-08 crash, except it wasn't enough, which is why you see measurable recovery, but at a growth rate much slower than what we saw after the Great Depression. Reagan - Bush 2, including Clinton all supported the same kind of deregulation that led to the GD.
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If you are going to try to claim Hoover was a hands off type of president then you are making a fool of yourself. Ever heard of the Hoover Dam? You think maybe it's called that for a reason? He was the biggest deficit spender in history to that point but it doesn't fit your argument so you keep saying he was hands off.

Again, FDR campaigned against the deficit spending of Hoover but you are too locked into your one side is bad the other side is good to get through to you.

Hoover started it, FDR doubled down on it. We started recovering for real after the war. Look at the NASDAQ pre-crash and how long it took to get that high again. This was while the FED was doing a monetary injection (like now) too.

Also, you know what Friedman was referring to don't you? Friedman and Anna Scwhartz wrote a book on the Great Depression and the austerity he is referring to is the Federal Reserve allowing banks to go belly up when they were created to prevent such a thing. He blames the Fed for not only causing the great depression through their monetary policy, but blames them for keeping us in it.

If you are actually interested...
http://fee.org/freeman/the-great-depression-according-to-milton-friedman/

I bet you thought you scored points with that Friedman quote, shame.
 
ginwilly

ginwilly

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
Do you believe structural stagnation is a myth made up by the toothfairy?
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No, I believe it's a theory. I doubt the tooth fairy had any input though.

Headin out. I know we are not done yet and I'm enjoying the back and forth so if I don't respond it's because I'm not here. Post away about your religion and I'll counter with mine when I can.
 
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abandonconflict

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
Dumb ass republicans and their dumb ass Austrian economics. Deficit spending... Budgets are not ONLY about spending, they're also about revenues. This is why Keynesians always have better economies. I'm just saying it, don't kill the messenger. Republicans are fucking stupid. That doesn't make me a democrat. The point is, there's a reason the Keynesians always preside over surpluses and at least shrink deficits while increasing spending.

With Austrian economics, it's all about the gov't budget and not at all about the economy. Cut spending too much and you also cut revenue.
 
Rob Roy

Rob Roy

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
Expansionary monetary policy is the correct decision to make in an economy facing structural stagnation. That's what FDR did to pull Americans out of the great depression and into the most prosperous period in American history

So yeah, you'd be wrong on that one
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Are we talking about the racist thief FDR? The same guy that put some innocent Americans in concentration camps after he started a war with Japan ? The same guy that stole peoples gold and forbid Americans to own it?

The same guy that tried to stack the Supreme Court so he could implement dictator policies? The same guy that thought of murderous Josef Stalin as a special friend and ally? Yes, a real piece of smiling shite.

If expansionist monetary policy is a good decision, why not just give everyone a check for one million dollars and solve all the problems? How could that go wrong?
 
Rob Roy

Rob Roy

Well-Known Member
abandonconflict said:
Dumb ass republicans and their dumb ass Austrian economics. Deficit spending... Budgets are not ONLY about spending, they're also about revenues. This is why Keynesians always have better economies. I'm just saying it, don't kill the messenger. Republicans are fucking stupid. That doesn't make me a democrat. The point is, there's a reason the Keynesians always preside over surpluses and at least shrink deficits while increasing spending.

With Austrian economics, it's all about the gov't budget and not at all about the economy. Cut spending too much and you also cut revenue.
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Shouldn't you replace that dim light bulb in the corner of your mom's basement you live in? You'll hurt your eyes squinting in the dark like that hunched over your laptop, spilling cookie crumbs into the keyboard crevices Comrade.
 
ASCIIGHOST

ASCIIGHOST

Well-Known Member
spandy said:
Not really, but 1 out of 2 fortune 100 companies are invested in NASCAR.

sounds like money and fast cars to me.
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Joke is on him. I went with my mulatto friend. The tickets were free, we were hoping to get laid after a year in Afghanistan. Later in the year we went and saw Digital Underground (tupacs original group) live near the UNC campus. They're just mad at me because im transracial and they're not. Clearly they have enormous guilt for being privileged whites. Not me tho, the man has been holding me down for as long as I can remember.
 
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schuylaar

Well-Known Member
ginwilly said:
No, I don't think we are out of it in reality, in how we measure things? Of course we are, it's BOOMING up in here.

If we go by UE numbers we are given then the economy is awesome, if we go by the amount of people not working, we are in trouble. If we go by the stock market we are rockin and rollin, if we consider the trillions pumped into the market by the feds then we probably should go by the stock market.

Two periods in our history where the economy stayed down this long, both times saw unprecedented government intervention. Maybe lawyers and elected officials don't understand how these cycles work. The ego that thinks the law of supply and demand can be manipulated by central planning is devastating, people who fall for it are sheep.

I can make the claim that when governments use a more hands-off approach we recover more robustly. I can make that claim because history backs it up. The countries that recovered the best during the recession took the opposite approach we did.

I think we beat this horse to death already here, every year in fact. Your side keeps insisting it would be worse if we hadn't spent 1/2 a trillion on bullshit because, ya know, aggregate demand. It's a circular argument because we'll never know how much better or worse we would be. My claim is we'd be better off based on historical outcomes. The claim that we would be worse off is based on faith.
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I agree with most of the first portion, what I disagree is the hands off approach mindset..who got us into this and who did we bail out?

Hint: not the 99%..the greedy gluttony that exists, that continues to exist is what got us there taking the world economy with it. What comes first, chicken or egg? One thing is for sure, until a -45% effective tax rate on the profitable is a thing of the past, we are destined to repeat history..
 
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schuylaar

Well-Known Member
ASCIIGHOST said:
Joke is on him. I went with my mulatto friend. The tickets were free, we were hoping to get laid after a year in Afghanistan. Later in the year we went and saw Digital Underground (tupacs original group) live near the UNC campus. They're just mad at me because im transracial and they're not. Clearly they have enormous guilt for being privileged whites. Not me tho, the man has been holding me down for as long as I can remember.
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What is it with you and transracial/mulatto name tags?

using the term mulatto is a put down..someone transracial should know..consider yourself enlightened.
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
Rob Roy said:
Are we talking about the racist thief FDR? The same guy that put some innocent Americans in concentration camps after he started a war with Japan ? The same guy that stole peoples gold and forbid Americans to own it?

The same guy that tried to stack the Supreme Court so he could implement dictator policies? The same guy that thought of murderous Josef Stalin as a special friend and ally? Yes, a real piece of smiling shite.

If expansionist monetary policy is a good decision, why not just give everyone a check for one million dollars and solve all the problems? How could that go wrong?
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FDR "started" the war with Japan? Japan attacked Pearl Harbor on Dec. 7, 1941, Roosevelt declared war on Japan Dec. 8..

Gee, all that and he still ranks in the top 3..



I wonder why..

Goddamn liberal rankings...
 
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schuylaar

Well-Known Member
UncleBuck said:
the white supremacy crowd clearly does not understand how economics work.
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Bernie even stated this on last nights forum..to the poorer struggling whites of the south: why are you voting against your own interest? his answer: because you wish that much to disassociate with gays and others who are different..who are not you.

I was totally hoping he would come out and say it: because of racial divide that the GOP promotes.

We will continually be short changed on social services until the poorer white south understands that they are sharing (and expecting it as a citizens right) the same pot they are voting to defund.
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
schuylaar said:
Bernie even stated this on last nights forum..to the poorer struggling whites of the south: why are you voting against your own interest? his answer: because you wish that much to disassociate with gays and others who are different..who are not you.

I was totally hoping he would come out and say it: because of racial divide that the GOP promotes.

We will continually be short changed on social services until the poorer white south understands that they are sharing (and expecting it) the same pot they are voting to defund.
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Got any highlight clips from the forum?
 
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schuylaar

Well-Known Member
Suggestion: social safety net services should require proof of the vote for same..you must be a registered democrat to receive services.

You don't get into Magic Kingdom unless you pay the ticket, are part of Make A Wish Foundation or win the Super Bowl.
 
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