Biden mishandles classified documents

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Skillcraft

Well-Known Member
When you say the two cases are the same you are repeating right wing cable news sound bites. CBS is not making such a claim nor is any other reputable news source.

I’ve said consistently that we don’t know if Biden is guilty or not and I’m waiting for the results of the investigation before I make any judgments on his guilt. This brings another example of how the two cases are different. We know trump is guilty, not just because of the overwhelming physical evidence, but because he’s said so himself.
I myself have said there are glaring differences in the two cases. But there is also some similarities. I believe Biden is guilty because he had documents in his garage and a couple other places. I just don't buy that he didn't know they were there. Now is the Trump case more blatant and is he guilty? I believe so in my opinion. Now will either be convicted? I am not sure. I think they should in my opinion. The difference between you and me is that I believe both are guilty and you only believe trump is guilty. I just find it very partisan that you believe trump is guilty of mishandling classified documents but not biden. you act like you think I don't like Biden or I want him to fail. I do not. I hope his presidency is an overwhelming success because if he is successful it is better for our nation. I am just not married to any one political party.
 

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Thank you for the answer, though I was curious what he did that was so bad during his tenure, not after the election.
He was still president at the time he attempted his coup and overthrow of our democracy.

The majority of voters in the US, including a majority of electors selected by those voters to represent them in the Electoral College chose Biden over Trump. Trump's attempt to overthrow that election was the worst deed ever committed by a sitting US president. There were reasons why voters chose Biden over Trump. However if that act of sedition and treason isn't enough to convince you that Trump was the worst president ever, I don't think you'll find our reasons for not voting for him convincing enough to place him as the worst ever.
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Why do you keep changing the subject? Read the title of this thread again.
Well your perspective appears to be distorted and filtered, and that is fueled by strong emotion often associated with tribalism. So, instead of dealing with the torrent of mistruths and distortions I think getting to the root of the matter is best and that involves intention. We humans like to think we are rational actors, but we are not for the most part and most of thinking is mere rationalization of conditioned feelings and the feelings intern, invoke more complex socially based emotions, thinking comes last. One thing I find republicans have in common is they seldom reveal their true motives, it is most often some superficial culture war issue they claim that drives them.

So why do you really dislike Biden, or do you dislike what he represents? Because he represents the rule of law and liberal democracy to me and millions of other Americans. The republicans are not an option for patriots, even for dog catcher.
 

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
I myself have said there are glaring differences in the two cases. But there is also some similarities. I believe Biden is guilty because he had documents in his garage and a couple other places. I just don't buy that he didn't know they were there. Now is the Trump case more blatant and is he guilty? I believe so in my opinion. Now will either be convicted? I am not sure. I think they should in my opinion. The difference between you and me is that I believe both are guilty and you only believe trump is guilty. I just find it very partisan that you believe trump is guilty of mishandling classified documents but not biden. you act like you think I don't like Biden or I want him to fail. I do not. I hope his presidency is an overwhelming success because if he is successful it is better for our nation. I am just not married to any one political party.
They are two separate matters, Biden's problems are not Jack's concern, he's got republicans to bust, lot's of them starting with Trump and the documents case. Donald will go down long before anybody does over J6 and the rest will fold, if Mark Meadows squeals like a pig and Jack has got a firm grip on his balls. They won't need to give deals for Trump's ass, they will have it anyway soon enough.
 

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
It is less than 90% and you are ascribing motives to those who chose not to participate. Back it up with credible link and you might be taken seriously.
Think on it.
Legislative - hostage to the spite caucus
Judicial - Ginni as undeclared justice
Executive - DOJ is MIA

so his gripe makes good sense to me, without contradicting my general respect for Biden.
 

Grandpapy

Well-Known Member
Thank you for the answer, though I was curious what he did that was so bad during his tenure, not after the election.
Americans life spans shortened by 3 yrs.

In 2021, the average American could expect to live until the age of 76, federal health researchers reported on Wednesday. The figure represents a loss of almost three years since 2019, when Americans could expect to live, on average, nearly 79 years.
 

PadawanWarrior

Well-Known Member
Well your perspective appears to be distorted and filtered, and that is fueled by strong emotion often associated with tribalism. So, instead of dealing with the torrent of mistruths and distortions I think getting to the root of the matter is best and that involves intention. We humans like to think we are rational actors, but we are not for the most part and most of thinking is mere rationalization of conditioned feelings and the feelings intern, invoke more complex socially based emotions, thinking comes last. One thing I find republicans have in common is they seldom reveal their true motives, it is most often some superficial culture war issue they claim that drives them.

So why do you really dislike Biden, or do you dislike what he represents? Because he represents the rule of law and liberal democracy to me and millions of other Americans. The republicans are not an option for patriots, even for dog catcher.
I don't like him because he sucks. How about that.
 

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
I myself have said there are glaring differences in the two cases. But there is also some similarities. I believe Biden is guilty because he had documents in his garage and a couple other places. I just don't buy that he didn't know they were there. Now is the Trump case more blatant and is he guilty? I believe so in my opinion. Now will either be convicted? I am not sure. I think they should in my opinion. The difference between you and me is that I believe both are guilty and you only believe trump is guilty. I just find it very partisan that you believe trump is guilty of mishandling classified documents but not biden. you act like you think I don't like Biden or I want him to fail. I do not. I hope his presidency is an overwhelming success because if he is successful it is better for our nation. I am just not married to any one political party.
What crime do you think Biden is guilty of? Specifically, what crime? Is that crime listed in the application for the search warrant that the DOJ submitted in order to obtain a search warrant at Mar a Lago?


Statutes Identified in the Mar-a-Lago Warrant

The warrant authorized the government to seize all physical documents and records connected with three offenses defined in Title 18 of the U.S. Code.

18 U.S.C. § 793 The first statute identified in the Mar-a-Lago warrant is 18 U.S.C. § 793. This provision is part of the Espionage Act of 1917. The affidavit supporting the warrant focuses on subsection (e), which applies when an individual is in unauthorized possession of certain national defense information. Section 793(e) creates penalties for willfully disclosing or attempting to disclose that information. It also prohibits willfully retaining national defense information and failing to deliver it to the proper official.
18 U.S.C. § 2071 Another statute cited in the Mar-a-Lago search warrant and affidavit is 18 U.S.C. § 2071, which generally prohibits, among other things, willfully and unlawfully concealing, removing, mutilating, obliterating, or destroying a “record,” “paper,” or “document” that is “filed or deposited with any clerk or officer of any court of the United States, or in any public office, or with any judicial or public officer of the United States.”
18 U.S.C. § 1519 The Mar-a-Lago warrant and affidavit also lists 18 U.S.C. § 1519—a statute criminalizing certain acts of destruction of evidence in obstruction of certain federal investigations or proceedings.
I've read no accounts that claim Biden did any of those things.
 

Skillcraft

Well-Known Member
They are two separate matters, Biden's problems are not Jack's concern, he's got republicans to bust, lot's of them starting with Trump and the documents case. Donald will go down long before anybody does over J6 and the rest will fold, if Mark Meadows squeals like a pig and Jack has got a firm grip on his balls. They won't need to give deals for Trump's ass, they will have it anyway soon enough.
If they can prove trump is guilty I hope they convict him. But i have the same sentiment about Biden. And as far as anyone who had anything to do with the attack on our capitol jan 6th I hope they are all identified and found guilty and sent to prison.
What crime do you think Biden is guilty of? Specifically, what crime? Is that crime listed in the application for the search warrant that the DOJ submitted in order to obtain a search warrant at Mar a Lago?


Statutes Identified in the Mar-a-Lago Warrant

The warrant authorized the government to seize all physical documents and records connected with three offenses defined in Title 18 of the U.S. Code.

18 U.S.C. § 793 The first statute identified in the Mar-a-Lago warrant is 18 U.S.C. § 793. This provision is part of the Espionage Act of 1917. The affidavit supporting the warrant focuses on subsection (e), which applies when an individual is in unauthorized possession of certain national defense information. Section 793(e) creates penalties for willfully disclosing or attempting to disclose that information. It also prohibits willfully retaining national defense information and failing to deliver it to the proper official.
18 U.S.C. § 2071 Another statute cited in the Mar-a-Lago search warrant and affidavit is 18 U.S.C. § 2071, which generally prohibits, among other things, willfully and unlawfully concealing, removing, mutilating, obliterating, or destroying a “record,” “paper,” or “document” that is “filed or deposited with any clerk or officer of any court of the United States, or in any public office, or with any judicial or public officer of the United States.”
18 U.S.C. § 1519 The Mar-a-Lago warrant and affidavit also lists 18 U.S.C. § 1519—a statute criminalizing certain acts of destruction of evidence in obstruction of certain federal investigations or proceedings.
I've read no accounts that claim Biden did any of those things.
The crime I think Biden is guilty of is mishandling classified documents. I don't think it was a conspiracy or anything like that. I don't believe he has obstructed anything as of now.
 

Skillcraft

Well-Known Member
Without intent or obstruction, that is not a crime.

The case deserves investigation. Not saying it doesn't. Am saying there should be an investigation in order to correct a system that fails to ensure classified documents are secure.
Let's say I mishandled classified documents when I was deployed and in the performance of my duty, I would have been brought up on charges and would have faced a court martial.
 

Boatguy

Well-Known Member
Without intent or obstruction, that is not a crime.

The case deserves investigation. Not saying it doesn't. Am saying there should be an investigation in order to correct a system that fails to ensure classified documents are secure.
Maybe something simple like documents are read, then destroyed?
 
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