Bio bizz in sunshine mix 4

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Yetimeister328

Member
Hey everyone. Couple questions and things going on over here.. We run bio bizz full bottle line in sunshine mix #4 in 7-10 gallon fabric pots. We have led lights and drain to waste tables. We go by the bio bizz feed chart for inert media growing. We feed bio bizz every watering for the most part. We water in until full saturation but not much run off as they advertise.. Plants once established tend to want fertigation every day to every other day. They get big (tall) by the end of a run. We run 80 plants at a time and our grow room is dialed at roughly 80f and 55ish humidity. 800 umols-1200 umols on the lights at canopy and we ramp up to 1200ppm of co2.

questions are, is anyone else here growing similar? Bio bizz and sunshine? We tend to see what appears to be either a lock out or under/over fertilization at around week 4. Assume over fed maybe vs under. Brown spotting, lighter green colored leaves at the top of plants but darker green middle to bottom and sometimes yellow tips and bluish/purple leaves. We use filtered water and organics alive calcium and organics alive micro 7. 1-2ml each per gallon. Added some pics.
 

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StareCase

StareCase

Well-Known Member
Yetimeister328 said:
... Plants once established tend to want fertigation every day to every other day ...
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Coco likes daily water/feed but not peat. I will water 5 U.S. gallon buckets every 4th day once the plants get established. How much do you give them each time you water/feed?
 
Y

Yetimeister328

Member
StareCase said:
Coco likes daily water/feed but not peat. I will water 5 U.S. gallon buckets every 4th day once the plants get established. How much do you give them each time you water/feed?
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Plants are in 10 gallon fabric pots and get on average fertigated every other day based on dry back once established in fabric pot. At finally transplant at the start of 12/12 they may go several days after fertigation to dry back some before another fertigation establishing root zone. Once established around a gallon and a half per plant. That fully saturates the medium with some drip through. They dry back within that time frame plenty based on weight and soil touch. If anything we may be on the side of needing more frequent watering and lower amounts is my opinion. Being bio bizz we can’t run irrigation ideally. We manual water.
 
Y

Yetimeister328

Member
Yetimeister328 said:
Plants are in 10 gallon fabric pots and get on average fertigated every other day based on dry back once established in fabric pot. At finally transplant at the start of 12/12 they may go several days after fertigation to dry back some before another fertigation establishing root zone. Once established around a gallon and a half per plant. That fully saturates the medium with some drip through. They dry back within that time frame plenty based on weight and soil touch. If anything we may be on the side of needing more frequent watering and lower amounts is my opinion. Being bio bizz we can’t run irrigation ideally. We manual water.
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It’s probably closer to 2 gallons actually week 4 on. We run a hose/wond on a timer system.
 
Beeswings

Beeswings

Well-Known Member
80 degrees and "55ish" humidity, how much variation on the humidity we talking? In my opinion you're riding the line for VPD and one the stomata are closing from being dry it sucks to nurse them to be able to be open comfortably. If you are letting it get under 50 percent at all at 80 degrees that is not got. 60 ish with maybe a dip to 58 percent would be way more comfortable.
 
Y

Yetimeister328

Member
Beeswings said:
80 degrees and "55ish" humidity, how much variation on the humidity we talking? In my opinion you're riding the line for VPD and one the stomata are closing from being dry it sucks to nurse them to be able to be open comfortably. If you are letting it get under 50 percent at all at 80 degrees that is not got. 60 ish with maybe a dip to 58 percent would be way more comfortable.
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It never gets under 55. We’re probably averaging 60%. Looking at the TrolMaster now and the room is 63%. I’ll drop it slightly lower for night time and at the very end of the run right before harvest. We start at around 70% at the start of 12/12 and in veg.
 
Y

Yetimeister328

Member
Yetimeister328 said:
It never gets under 55. We’re probably averaging 60%. Looking at the TrolMaster now and the room is 63%. I’ll drop it slightly lower for night time and at the very end of the run right before harvest. We start at around 70% at the start of 12/12 and in veg.
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I guess I should have explained it better. The humidifiers are set currently at this stage of weeks to never let it go under 55. Has around a 5 percent band with the dehu.
 
chuckeye

chuckeye

Well-Known Member
And Sunshine Mix #4 is ph buffered.

I use ProMix HP which is a similar product and do not ph my water...

Cheers
 
Y

Yetimeister328

Member
chuckeye said:
Check your ppm's, feed charts don't work for every strain !

Cheers
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In organics/veganics you don’t really go by ppms although I do monitor it.. bio bizz formulation doesn’t register ec like salts do as far as I’m aware. Is anyone running organics/veganics in sunshine? I’ve also noticed when adding up bio bizz NPK in grow, bloom, and heaven it’s 5/2/9 which is a strange NPK in my opinion for flowering.. most of the N is in the grow. I’m considering going around half on the grow to bring the N down and let the pk take a bit of a lead. It’s showing these signs on almost all of the 10 strains in the room.
 
chuckeye

chuckeye

Well-Known Member
Yetimeister328 said:
In organics/veganics you don’t really go by ppms although I do monitor it.. bio bizz formulation doesn’t register ec like salts do as far as I’m aware. Is anyone running organics/veganics in sunshine? I’ve also noticed when adding up bio bizz NPK in grow, bloom, and heaven it’s 5/2/9 which is a strange NPK in my opinion for flowering.. most of the N is in the grow. I’m considering going around half on the grow to bring the N down and let the pk take a bit of a lead. It’s showing these signs on almost all of the 10 strains in the room.
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As I understand it, Bio Buzz is an organic fertilizer that you are using in a mostly inert ph buffered soilless medium.

I use Mega Crop one part (9-6-17) which is also derived from organic materials and ppm's is a useful measurement.

A ppm reading would at least tell you if you are under or over feeding.

Pretty sure that is your issue, not ph !

Cheers
 
Y

Yetimeister328

Member
chuckeye said:
As I understand it, Bio Buzz is an organic fertilizer that you are using in a mostly inert ph buffered soilless medium.

I use Mega Crop one part (9-6-17) which is also derived from organic materials and ppm's is a useful measurement.

A ppm reading would at least tell you if you are under or over feeding.

Pretty sure that is your issue, not ph !

Cheers
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I believe it’s a fert issue as well and not ph. I feel as though if we were in soil we would be a bit better off than inert media using bio bizz. Being we don’t use the fish mix we’re considered veganic which is what the company I grow for is known for. Tough way to grow in my opinion. What’s your rough guide on bloom weeks for target ppm in organics?
 
chuckeye

chuckeye

Well-Known Member
Yetimeister328 said:
I believe it’s a fert issue as well and not ph.
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Yes, you have been overfeeding. The plant is only using a portion of the feed at each watering and you are adding more. Over time an excess of one element causes a lock out in another.

I stopped using ferts that allow you to change the ratio's, I could get close but not close enough :wall:

Mega Crop one part has everything needed in One powder form. Feed by weight per gallon.

And about the least expensive ph buffered nutrient line you would find. ~$125 for 25# I feed lower than their recommended amount. 5g/gallon, you do the math ;)

I feel as though if we were in soil we would be a bit better off than inert media using bio bizz.
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Not necessarily, you are already having issues with dialing in the amount of feed. I found it a bit harder in soil to find the sweet spot :mrgreen:

Being we don’t use the fish mix we’re considered veganic which is what the company I grow for is known for. Tough way to grow in my opinion.
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Is Bio Bizz certified organic by anyone other than themselves ? ;)

What’s your rough guide on bloom weeks for target ppm in organics?
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Not sure I understand your question?

I consider dirt, you know, the stuff you find in a outdoor garden to be organic !

I don't measure ppm's anymore because I know 6g/gallon is around 950 ppm. Anymore and tread lightly, he, he...

I "read" my plant before increasing food and have enough grows with this product to "know" where I should be.

At the start of yellowing on the bottom fans and a lighter green on new growth, I up the nutrients by .5g/gallon.

Anything over a hint of leaf tip burn, hold or slightly reduce the nutrients.

This is a Cafe Racer photoperiod from my current grow @5g/gallon and no plans to increase food.

600w MH/HPS in a 42" parabolic reflector. 5 gallon pails with GroBuckets and ProMix HP, feed is Mega Crop one part and Nothing Else !

Day 17 of flower, a total of 66 days. Currently stretching 2 - 3" per day !

20 Mar Cafe Racer day 17.jpg

My suggestion to you first is to get a ppm reading !

And then do a 3x flush.

Should be interesting with 80 plants :o

The idea is to run your normal watering amount through without nutrients. Do that again.

The third time add the nutrients at 75% or less than what you've been giving. The ppm reading of the current feed should give you an idea of how much to lower it.

Don't do this and you will be limping to the finish line with an inferior product....

A reading of 800 to 1000 depending on the strain works for me..

BTW > the idea of run off with fabric pots is to do a mini flush at each watering. Chances are that would have only delayed what is happening.

But, it is good preventive maintenance for the future !

Cheers
 
Y

Yetimeister328

Member
chuckeye said:
Yes, you have been overfeeding. The plant is only using a portion of the feed at each watering and you are adding more. Over time an excess of one element causes a lock out in another.

I stopped using ferts that allow you to change the ratio's, I could get close but not close enough :wall:

Mega Crop one part has everything needed in One powder form. Feed by weight per gallon.

And about the least expensive ph buffered nutrient line you would find. ~$125 for 25# I feed lower than their recommended amount. 5g/gallon, you do the math ;)



Not necessarily, you are already having issues with dialing in the amount of feed. I found it a bit harder in soil to find the sweet spot :mrgreen:



Is Bio Bizz certified organic by anyone other than themselves ? ;)



Not sure I understand your question?

I consider dirt, you know, the stuff you find in a outdoor garden to be organic !

I don't measure ppm's anymore because I know 6g/gallon is around 950 ppm. Anymore and tread lightly, he, he...

I "read" my plant before increasing food and have enough grows with this product to "know" where I should be.

At the start of yellowing on the bottom fans and a lighter green on new growth, I up the nutrients by .5g/gallon.

Anything over a hint of leaf tip burn, hold or slightly reduce the nutrients.

This is a Cafe Racer photoperiod from my current grow @5g/gallon and no plans to increase food.

600w MH/HPS in a 42" parabolic reflector. 5 gallon pails with GroBuckets and ProMix HP, feed is Mega Crop one part and Nothing Else !

Day 17 of flower, a total of 66 days. Currently stretching 2 - 3" per day !

View attachment 5380492

My suggestion to you first is to get a ppm reading !

And then do a 3x flush.

Should be interesting with 80 plants :o

The idea is to run your normal watering amount through without nutrients. Do that again.

The third time add the nutrients at 75% or less than what you've been giving. The ppm reading of the current feed should give you an idea of how much to lower it.

Don't do this and you will be limping to the finish line with an inferior product....

A reading of 800 to 1000 depending on the strain works for me..

BTW > the idea of run off with fabric pots is to do a mini flush at each watering. Chances are that would have only delayed what is happening.

But, it is good preventive maintenance for the future !

Cheers
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Plant looks healthy! My salt room looks on par to that. So from my understanding megacrop one part is a salt based fertilizer from looking it up briefly. This would be why a ec/ppm reading using it would be a good source of information. I guess it could be considered ‘synganic’ as well. I do agree with you that they are being over fed though. I’ve seen the ppm when checked go 2k plus going by the chart towards the end of flower and the run off ppm at times on other runs almost double that. It’s kind of a false reading being were truly organic feed with really no salts. The tricky part in my opinion is we’re veganic but hydro because of the inert Media and bottle feeding. We’re basically feeding the soil/microbial life to allow the plant to uptake the nutrients we’re providing. They don’t pick up bio bizz nutrients the same way a salt line does. It relys on the microbial life to break it down and make it availabile much more. It can take days like a super soil could. That’s why I think people in general from my research have better luck with bio bizz when they use a soil with it. It’s pretty hard to find veganic soil or at least in my area. My current plan is to back off the grow bottle and see what how they react and keep the bloom bottle and stimulator bottles at the same for now. I think it’s just too much over all but to heavy on nitrogen vs pk. The grow bottle keeps stepping up in ml/g all the way through bloom and it’s n is much higher than pk. I may dial back the bloom bottle as well if I don’t see much change. I appreciate your advice! Also, bio bizz is certified organic and clean by seven different outside companies.
 

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