Botanicare Nutrients Advice

N

Nugget1234

Member
Hi all,

Just wondered if any of the more seasoned guys on here have a bit of advice for me at all?

So I am using the full range of Botanicare KIND products for my 15 gallon DWC system.

I am wondering whether it is a good idea to introduce GROW back into the middle to late stage of flowering OR reduce the BASE and increase the BLOOM more than Botanicares recommended feed schedule; reasons to follow:

BASE
4.0% N
0.0% P
0.0% K

GROW
2.0% N
2.0% P
4.0% K

BLOOM
0.0% N
6.0% P
6.0% K

The Mg, S & Fe levels are the same GROW vs BLOOM.

If I leave the schedule as per Botanicares schedule, P & K against N is 2-1.

If I introduce GROW to the later stages of flower I can get that ratio closer to 2.5-1.

BASE does have 5.0% of Ca in it, but I figured I could up CalMag to offset that a little bit...

I am probably over thinking this but I wondered what peoples thoughts are ref above and what are the usual ratios people work from in the mid to late stage of flowering.

I read somewhere that too much N can cause too much stretching during flower, but it seems everyone has their own opinions/ideas on what this should be.

I have attached a screenshot of a spreadsheet I have where I have added grow back to the mix, might be a little easier for you to visualize...
Screenshot 2019-08-15 at 00.43.50.png
I appreciate any input you guys can give, cheers!

Nugget
 
TintEastwood

TintEastwood

Well-Known Member
I see the percentages. By chance do you have the elemental ppm breakdowns?

Not familiar with Botanicare, learning about Jacks currently.


Examples...
Jacks-Tinted.PNG

The-Matrix (1).PNG
 
N

Nugget1234

Member
TintEastwood said:
I see the percentages. By chance do you have the elemental ppm breakdowns?

Not familiar with Botanicare, learning about Jacks currently.


Examples...
View attachment 4379346

View attachment 4379347
Click to expand...
Hey TE,

Thanks for the reply!

Unfortunately as a noob, my spreadsheet only goes so far!

I read on another forum that NPK ratios should be as follows which mine are nowhere near during bloom, apparently K should always be 2-1 against P:

Vegetative Stage
N - P - K
3 - 1 - 2

Flowering Stage
N - P - K
1 - 1 - 2

Final Flowering Stage
N - P - K
0 - 1 - 2

I do have PPMs for each product, see attached:Screenshot 2019-08-15 at 01.29.58.png

Making my head spin :P
 
N

Nugget1234

Member
I guess you are saying that the NPK breakdown should be weighted towards PPMs per element rather than the volume that's in the solution?
 
TintEastwood

TintEastwood

Well-Known Member
I'm comparing and contrasting ppm feed numbers for a variety of nutrients. Some are straight from manufacturers feed charts, others custom. Interesting how much they vary.

My head spins too. Lol
 
N

Nugget1234

Member
TintEastwood said:
Took at stab at the 3 KINDs....Yet to be confirmed if correct.
View attachment 4379463


Me. Playing around with numbers, matching GH to Jacks.
View attachment 4379465
Click to expand...
I am pretty sure I am not as smart or as informed as you, so thanks so much so far, I just want to make sure I understand this right.

Even though Phos content and Potassium content are showing the same on the bottle, should I be using some kind of multiplier for each element?

Or does each type of molecule have a certain multiplier based on how easily it is absorbed?
 
TintEastwood

TintEastwood

Well-Known Member
Nugget1234 said:
I am pretty sure I am not as smart or as informed as you, so thanks so much so far, I just want to make sure I understand this right.

Even though Phos content and Potassium content are showing the same on the bottle, should I be using some kind of multiplier for each element?

Or does each type of molecule have a certain multiplier based on how easily it is absorbed?
Click to expand...
This is what I used...
Real pros use hydro buddy.

Calculator near bottom of page...
http://www.angelfire.com/cantina/fourtwenty/articles/profiles.htm
 
N

Nugget1234

Member
Hi mate,

Have had a read through, used the calculator vs the PPM when I did a test with RO water a few weeks back, adding 1ml to 1 litre of water and got the following results:

PPM for KIND BASE
RO 204 PPM
Calculator 95 PPM

PPM for KIND BLOOM
RO 166 PPM
Calculator 120 PPM

PPM for KIND GROW
RO 150 PPM
Calculator 103 PPM

I have attached a screenshot of the BLOOM calc.

Do you think the PPMs I have are higher due to the fact there are other additives etc that they add that aren't stated?
 
N

Nugget1234

Member
Aha, I just clicked on the link below, those PPMs on calculator is estimated total dissolved solids that the plant can actually consume?

So the other parts in the KIND solution are unusable solids?
 
TintEastwood

TintEastwood

Well-Known Member
Nugget1234 said:
Aha, I just clicked on the link below, those PPMs on calculator is estimated total dissolved solids that the plant can actually consume?

So the other parts in the KIND solution are unusable solids?
Click to expand...
Sorry, those questions are over my head. :dunce:

I see you mention litre.....I do everything based on US Gallons.
On the calculator, I leave the defaults of 1 and set the mixing volume to 1. (for 1ml)
It's entirely possible that I'm making mistakes as I learn.

Still learning, not making recommendations to anyone. :weed:
 
N

Nugget1234

Member
Haha I think you dragged me down the rabbit hole!

My spreadsheet has become even more complicated!

Yes, I am from Europe so metric prevails in my mind, there is 3.78 litres to a US gallon, so I think the math checks out, I have attached a screen shot of PPMs for each molecule/element. Looks like I need to seriously tweak it!

Overall PPMs at top in orange are according to bottles, PPM 3 rows down is based on the calculator link you gave me.

Screenshot 2019-08-15 at 23.29.04.png
 
N

Nugget1234

Member
Just need to convert above into gallons so I can match it up, which will now make it even more complicated...

If this works, I owe you a few beers, thanks man
 
TintEastwood

TintEastwood

Well-Known Member
lol. Ya, you can blame me. Just takes some time getting slapped around with all this stuff....then the light starts to come on.

Europe. So you also have to be careful about the whole EC to PPM conversion dealio.

Yes. I assume your nutes have many unlisted micronutrients but they don't add up to many ppm.
(like boron, zinc, etcc, and they matter, but most individually are way under 1ppm per.)
 
N

Nugget1234

Member
TintEastwood said:
lol. Ya, you can blame me. Just takes some time getting slapped around with all this stuff....then the light starts to come on.

Europe. So you also have to be careful about the whole EC to PPM conversion dealio.

Yes. I assume your nutes have many unlisted micronutrients but they don't add up to many ppm.
(like boron, zinc, etcc, and they matter, but most individually are way under 1ppm per.)
Click to expand...
Yeah, EC goes right over my head, but I think the recommended NPK ratios are in PPM on that link you sent me so have worked off of that. My schedule looks completely different now, had to use PK boost quite a lot, as those recommendations fly in the face of what a lot of other how-to's say online.

PPM's for each element below, overall PPM in orange as per bottles, it has me riding higher PPM's later in Veg, but lower PPM's during Flower:

Screenshot 2019-08-16 at 01.31.05.png
 
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