Buds quality LEDs VS HPS

MichiganMedGrower said:
I agree that the diy lighting is viable and of course part of the conversation but I don’t want to build lights. I spend enough time with my Grows already.

So any cost structure I consider will have a complete new and warrantied in America lamp.

That doubles the prices you all quote.

Also the new tech coming won’t be cobs. I believe it is more like QB lamps but with all the right ratios of colored diodes. Done right this will make cobs seem as inefficient as hps. No wasted light spectrum when customized properly. So more growth still and less watts again.

The more I read and see about cobs and the real numbers and quality produced I know it is best to wait. In my situation anyway.

If I blow a ballast and need to buy 2 new ones I would consider building a lamp to cover the area while I wait. That would free up $300. But I would want to upgrade power and run 600 watts of led for the increased yield and f the heat is less enough so that would double my entry fee again.

They obviously grow great pot at reduced cost. (If you don’t have to pay for them all up front). The usage watts and results that keeps being stated in these threads is all over the place. Just like Growers results always are. And I am sure the builds are pretty variable in tech and quality too.
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I hear you, man. DIY most definitely is not for everyone, and I do get irritated with those DIY'ers who behave as if everyone should just shut up and build their own light. Hell, if I hadn't wanted to build my own, I'd still be using HPS, because I sure as shit couldn't afford a ready-made fixture.
 
Humple said:
To pretend that DIY has no place in the conversation is just wrong though, man.
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No, it isn't.

99% of people want and buy turn-key solutions.

Besides, even in a DYI environment, HPS is cheaper than LED/COB, so you once again lose the argument.
 
Dave455 said:
Check out Amare LED with built in small UV lamp that probably does next to nothing for the plants. California
light works 880 - similar deal. All there UV is only window dressing to drop big bucks on their lights.
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Those are the brands being blown out at 40% off lately.
 
There is only one state in the union where LED/COB saves you that much money: Hawaii.

Nobody else in the U.S. pays enough to make that kind of difference.

In Hawaii, you're almost REQUIRED to go COB. It's the only thing that makes any sense at all.
 
TacoMac said:
No, it isn't.

99% of people want and buy turn-key solutions.

Besides, even in a DYI environment, HPS is cheaper than LED/COB, so you once again lose the argument.
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You're talking to a bunch of builders, telling them that HPS is superior to their fixtures because a retail version of that fixture would cost twice as much. It just doesn't compute. A better way to phrase your point would be to say that - for someone who wants a ready-made light - HPS is superior. But even that is arguable. As is everything...

Nice avatar, by the way. That's a great record.
 
see4 said:
Of course there will be better tech right around the corner.

If I could buy a quantum board for $25 each and heatsinks for $15 each, and an hlg-320 costs me about $60... I feel like that would be a good investment. One, three panel setup, would cost $190 total. Most hps bulbs, good ones are like $80 or something aren't they?
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quantum board 120....no heat sink !!!
 
hillbill said:
I never said LEDs will not continue to become lower in price, simply that from the performance provided they are intrinsically more valuable.
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Sorry. I read it wrong then.

Do you think any electronic tech will keep its value?

When much better and more efficient lighting arrives will you invest again?

Or will you be like the hps stubborn ones now?

I can see in a couple more years the new multi color diode guys with built in far red and uva/b talking about the old diy warehouse lights people used to build to save money. :-)
 
I do not buy lights for later value retention but for performance/value. However, COB chips can be upgraded fairly easily if a much more efficient one is available. Upgrade friendly solid state lights are sure to come.

A huge factor in all this is that white light was not easy to make efficiently with LEDs until a few years ago. LED arrays have dramatically reduced 5he labor needed for grow lights to be built.

If I was selling LED Grow lights with discreet diodes I would be slashing prices too!
 
hillbill said:
I do not buy lights for later value retention but for performance/value. However, COB chips can be upgraded fairly easily if a much more efficient one is available. Upgrade friendly solid state lights are sure to come.

A huge factor in all this is that white light was not easy to make efficiently with LEDs until a few years ago. LED arrays have dramatically reduced 5he labor needed for grow lights to be built.

If I was selling LED Grow lights with discreet diodes I would be slashing prices too!
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The new tech is already going to use discreet diodes.

All of these lights are in an infant stage. I posted university tests on Led diodes. They are nailing down the colors for specific plant growth.

Cobs are going to remain lighting for streets and warehouses.

Who is going to build a complex multi diode grow light at home?

I bet diyers are only 1% of the market now. I am guessing at that number but I know no one in person that would even consider building their lamps.
 
wouldnt the LED end up being cheaper in the long run though since you dont have to change out bulbs every 6 months? Also we have the savings in air conditioning too. This of course assumes you dont buy the newest best chip every time it drops lol
 
Buba Blend said:
@MichiganMedGrower
Is his statement above suggesting we are correct to wait a little longer while prices come down and technology improves?
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No 2-3 more years you will have broken even on a quality led anyways. Bulb changes and overall electrical usage reduction will measure the switch worth it. Kinda like waiting to buy a PC. At some point you will just have to buy in lol.

Quality drivers are not coming down so much and honestly I see labor costs rising in the USA. Savings in the LEDs is only 1 of the factors. Aluminum (which is heavily used) is going up in price as well. Metal always goes up when the economy is growing.
 
Stephenj37826 said:
No 2-3 more years you will have broken even on a quality led anyways. Bulb changes and overall electrical usage reduction will measure the switch worth it. Kinda like waiting to buy a PC. At some point you will just have to buy in lol.

Quality drivers are not coming down so much and honestly I see labor costs rising in the USA. Savings in the LEDs is only 1 of the factors. Aluminum (which is heavily used) is going up in price as well. Metal always goes up when the economy is growing.
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I here you! I replaced my computer every year a while back when they were new. I was into computers when they 1st were developed. Worked for Philips and visited their facility in Hilversum, Netherlands for a couple of weeks. Bought their 1st CD player for $300 before they were released to the public in the 80's. For me it is not RIO that is holding me back. I am glad guys are doing it and sharing results.
 
Stephenj37826 said:
No 2-3 more years you will have broken even on a quality led anyways. Bulb changes and overall electrical usage reduction will measure the switch worth it. Kinda like waiting to buy a PC. At some point you will just have to buy in lol.

Quality drivers are not coming down so much and honestly I see labor costs rising in the USA. Savings in the LEDs is only 1 of the factors. Aluminum (which is heavily used) is going up in price as well. Metal always goes up when the economy is growing.
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Growers with only a few lights will never recover the money in the time you suggest. I have it worked out and it is more than twice the time you say for me.

And the outlay is huge if already equipped and have no need to worry about power savings. Plus money doesn’t really recover like that. Future expense is a factor but not a justification. That’s a sales pitch.

You can sell facts but emotions is what parts people with their money.

I have a pretty good handle on sales. I sold, managed teams and stores and taught sales and customer service during my 20 year career.

I wish I had fans helping me sell for free like you do during my career. ;-)
 
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