Guitar Man
Well-Known Member
I've also heard that you can tell if a plant is a male before it flowers. I've grown nothing but females, so I'm not sure if this is true or not.
Can Tell if Seed is Male or Female?
- Thread starter Guitar Man
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Guitar Man
Well-Known Member
Funny, I do the same thing with Labeling. After a while, the name of my grow can turn out like this: G II OD H. Better known as, G Bud number 2, Outdoor Grow, Herm. This Strain/Seed came from some dank bag weed my daughter had. Since she had mixed the seeds up, we weren't sure about the Strain, so I was left to label them with my own madness! lol
dbdweller
Active Member
You know whats so great about weed to me besides it's the best looking and smelling plant i know, that there are so many ways to grow depending on your location (high altitude, less co2) to the tropics and that everyone tries. 
Even though we all think we do the best we know that there is always something we can do better. Just like plasma lights now, nutrients,soil,hydro and the list goes on.
A hermi seed to me is not the same as a feminized seed or reg in the same strain. They all have a little different dna from the other just like what they do to auto flowers.
I am trying his video (started 3 days ago) and i have always gone by the rounded front nose of the seed i have had great results but who knows. Then i know no matter what anyone else says wether it works or not. Crap i have grow some indica of the same strain up above 7000ft and down at 0 and have even gotten different color from them. The same co2/humidity/temps i mean everything and it blew my mind. The high altitude was much stronger because of the plants normal reaction to pressure and defense but the color and way it grew was awesome.
So i am just saying i like to try what i think might work better. i am 52 and have been doing it a long time and i just love what i do. Why not thats the fun part of it to me LOL
Peace out.
Even though we all think we do the best we know that there is always something we can do better. Just like plasma lights now, nutrients,soil,hydro and the list goes on.A hermi seed to me is not the same as a feminized seed or reg in the same strain. They all have a little different dna from the other just like what they do to auto flowers.
I am trying his video (started 3 days ago) and i have always gone by the rounded front nose of the seed i have had great results but who knows. Then i know no matter what anyone else says wether it works or not. Crap i have grow some indica of the same strain up above 7000ft and down at 0 and have even gotten different color from them. The same co2/humidity/temps i mean everything and it blew my mind. The high altitude was much stronger because of the plants normal reaction to pressure and defense but the color and way it grew was awesome.
So i am just saying i like to try what i think might work better. i am 52 and have been doing it a long time and i just love what i do. Why not thats the fun part of it to me LOL
Peace out.
shishkaboy
Well-Known Member
I just name each plant individually. So I get crazy pheno names too.
calicocalyx
Well-Known Member
I have been growing from regular seeds through last year (between 3rd and 4th flower cycle) and off and on before that. I have always assumed 50/50 for male and females and usually it averaged out with slightly more females (maybe perception, maybe not large enough sample?). This last round I got 8 out of 10 females with 2 varieties and 7 out of ten with another. I did everything that I have read to get females except for the most part it was 24 hours of light instead of the recommended amount (I cut back the light to 16hrs for a week). Has anyone here tried to get female seeds with regards to adjusting temperature, light, or other environmental factors and not seen an increase in female or at least female phenotype plants?
shishkaboy
Well-Known Member
I think sex is a genotypical trait.
Heygurlll
Active Member
I started a batch a of reg seeds a few weeks ago (11 in proper conditions, plus 3 extra seedlings I really didn't have room for.) on 15/9.
2 weeks in I switched to 14/10. 2 weeks after that It got changed back to 15/9. I worked it up to 18/6 by end of week 5.
Some have started pre flowering. Out of the 11 so far, 5 have shown, withall 5 being female. With 7 more, I feel safe assuming I'll get 3-4 more females, but honestly would not be surprised if I got 90-100% only half-assing conditions. I recommend trying this kind of schedule (15/9 to start, 14/10 weeks 3+4, then either 12/12 or work hours back up) to get more females. I've heard similar results are achieved with 12/12 from seed, but haven't tried myself. All I know is I have too many females for my veg light. I only wanted ~6 to choose 2-4 from..... Damn luck, show me some male plant so I can lower my plant count already, sheesh.
Its both man. Most definitely written in the seed, but very obvious that gender can be "controlled by the environment",meaning its a phenotypical expression.
A phenotype results from the expression of an organism's genes as well as the influence of environmental factors and the interactions between the two.-wikipedia
An organism's phenotype is all of its observable characteristics—which are influenced both by its genotype and by the environment.- Evolution 101, UC Berkeley.
shishkaboy
Well-Known Member
But how many of those females were born female already (before the environmental conditions). You must set a standard, when you say "more females", more than what? Maybe it varies by strain, or time of the year, or whatever. No matter what you need a control group. That did not go through the funny light cycle to set a reference point for "more" and "less"
old shol4evr
Well-Known Member
i'm testing this therory myself ,i seen the same video ,plants are only week 1 of veg ,i don't consider veg until they get first set of 5 finger leaves, but i'm curious myself.
Heygurlll
Active Member
I have no clue how many more females phenos I got. Obviously, you cant change genotype without turning it into a gmo. So I got 0 extra genetic females. The point was, I did the known tricks (light, humidity, temp, nutes were all "female friendly") to get 80-100% female, and what do you know, I have more females than i planned for. I am recommending the light cycle because humidity, temp, and nutes all fluctuated outside the range plenty of times, and while the light may not be the SOLE reason, it HAS been proven to be a determining factor. In my mind, light cycle alone likely increases chances of a female pheno by 10-20% (imo lacking synergistic effect of the rest of the environment.) This of course has no basis other than general observation+theoretics.
But these light cycle and environmental factors have been tested multiple times to my standards (and likely yours.) As have strain, and temp. The likelihood that time of year matters when in a controlled indoor environment is minimal as it would be something absurd like solar radiation or magnetism from the ground, which would more than likely have an exaggerated effect on a plant outside. Light cycle is considered time of year indoors.
Just look it up. The info is out there. So quit thinking you're so smart, you're being ignorant. 2 seconds found a thread just like this where people were making no progress (like me) in trying to explain that it is a mix of both genotype and phenotype. Why do people think its only one cause when absolutely no evidence supports it being a sole reason? Then I found this and suggest you read it before replying. Granted I only skimmed, so I am making the assumption it aligns with what i said. And granted I think a little of this WAS influenced by personal experience/opinion but that doesnt mean its wrong..... http://forum.grasscity.com/indoor-medical-marijuana-growing/741353-how-produce-mostly-females-standard-seeds.html
By more females, i was more specifically referring to phenotype. If you don't understand fully the difference of pheno vs geno, read 4-6 articles/essays on the difference, then come back. You might understand how annoying it is to keep seeing posts like this. I have not been arguing opinion, I was arguing facts. No "I think its this" bull shit...
I was just trying to say the same shit i've been saying since i joined this thread. Which you should re-read because I went on about control groups and proper procedure.
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Dannabis!
Active Member
Totally agree, stoner culture is known to grab on to a superstition and run with it.
Considering amidst the people with decent experience, there's wunderkinds running around pretending to know everything in the school yard.
Personally it seems that bad environmental factors will make males of the best seeds and well controlled conditions produce more females.
I'd call bs on seed shape.
calicocalyx
Well-Known Member
I only tried to get more female plants because on the round before I get 7 out of 10 males. At first I accepted that's just how the dice roll but then realized I gave them the right conditions to get more males. I have seen other people say they've tried to get more females and it seemingly worked. I haven't read of anyone doing this and it not working. In regards to environmental factors that is.
Sativied
Well-Known Member
calicocalyx
Well-Known Member
I'm in the same boat with too many females, not sure who to trust cause I don't want anything with a tendency to hermi, and these are for my outdoor.
Heygurlll
Active Member
same here. the tendency is not too bad to herm back, and ive read the pheno is usually hard-set after 4 weeks of flower as long as its not overstressed.
Maybe this technique is better for professionals....
shishkaboy
Well-Known Member
Maybe your on your period or something but, I thought we were having an intelligent convo. The name calling because I disagree with you, is just idiotic. Why is it that you say I "think im so smart," because I know how to argue my opinions?
You said yourself that its a theory and that some is based on personal experience/opinion, but that doesnt make it a fact. Just because theres a thread on grasscity doesnt make the information in that thread fact. The slope seems a little slippery. I totally understand your theory, but disagree. My theory is funky light cycles gonna give your more herms. Since it wants to herm anyway, according to you. Sorry, I dont have the time to read the link you posted right now, I know the rules were to read it before replying and all, but I got a lotta trimming to do.
Then I found this and suggest you read it before replying. Granted I only skimmed, so I am making the assumption it aligns with what i said. And granted I think a little of this WAS influenced by personal experience/opinion but that doesnt mean its wrong
yet later you say.
I have not been arguing opinion, I was arguing facts. No "I think its this" bull shit... I was just trying to say the same shit i've been saying since i joined this thread. Which you should re-read because I went on about control groups and proper procedure.
lol. Have a nice day.
shishkaboy
Well-Known Member
More than how many?
So, let me get this straight. Average conditions = 50/50 right?
Female conditions =80%-100% females right?
So to totally disprove this I just need to find one case where there were female conditions and less than 80% females? Too easy.
Even main stream breeders in laboratories have theories based on experience, they cannot be called fact.
calicocalyx
Well-Known Member
Well let's see that link for less than 80% females with "female" conditions. Of course everyone here can claim what they want, but it seems like plenty of people trying to get more female/female expressed plants have reported altering condtions and achieving desired results. I'm not definitively saying one way or the other but since I have become a big fan of seed growing and pheno hunting, and I like having females around, I'm gonna keep trying to get those. Well you know what in a few rounds if it seems to be working, I might try and get males, see what happens. Most sample grows (at least mine) are pretty small so growing 10 seeds out once, is not going to be enough of an answer for most. I think there already is at least an experienced breeder that has chimed in to support this on this thread. What do any of the commercial breeders have to say? Even in humans there are people of either sex that identify as the opposite of what their genitalia are. I know it's apples and oranges, but that's kind of how I think of genotype and phenotype in regards to the sex of the plant. She might wear a dress and look like a girl but stress her out and she'll lift up her skirt an show ya balls (heygurl says he read different with regard to hermies I hope he's right for my own sake). Reptiles' sex can be influenced by temperature, is it such a leap to say that a plant can? There's too much shouting and name calling and dogma here for so called advanced cultivation. Pretty much every revolutionary scientific discovery flies in the face of what was previously known and I'm with you on proving and verifying but it seems like it's already been done. I see noobs teaching noobs and can understand the immediate rejection of someone's conjecture/misunderstanding (which is usually where the problem lies) and even earlier in this thread people seemed to be yelling at each other and arguing the same points from different points of view. Ask questions, clarify, refine, when in doubt grow it to know it. I have yet to meet someone that knows everything and doesn't make mistakes, I have seen plenty of people that act like they think they do.
Heygurlll
Active Member
Dude, its because the evidence is empirical; so overwhelming that you are pissing me off. We aren't running tests anymore, we are following technique at this point. Its not our job to do these tests every fucking time. We get much better results EVERY TIME by controlling environment, as most of us were in the same 50-60% female boat. Just fucking read around, then try it yourself. You ARE being ignorant. This (environment affecting gender) occurs in many plant (and amphibian, reptile, fish, and insect) species. While species like crocodiles can have the geno decided before hatching by temp, cannabis can change its pheno after popping.
To totally disprove this, you must provide overwhelming and reliable evidence (much more than one fucking time.)
Intelligent conversation my ass..... For that to happen, the two parties need to actually understand what they are talking about, no need to ACT smart yet resort to "Even main stream breeders in laboratories have theories based on experience, they cannot be called fact." Definitely arguing your opinion successfully.... Why dont you go do all the work reading 1000 seeds dna code(at 2-5 different stages in plant life), then accurately grow/label/log them. Have fun learning what we already know. Its been tested. Do the reading yourself. Then ask experienced growers on ANY cannabis forum.
You are the kind of person who doesn't even fully understand the definition of theory vs law. You made me realize i misspoke by even mentioning the word theory. These personal statements are hypothesis. They are based on scientific observations (well at least mine and everyone else who says yes on environmental factors. Where's YOUR basis for these light cycles causing higher hermie rates.... A few personal grows.....)
Once tested to the point where the answer/results are deemed accurate do hypothesis become theories. This can take 15 repeated controlled experiments. It could take 10000. Theories postulate why something happened, laws say what happens no matter what (no explanation of why). How to get more females is a full blown tested and "proven" theory.
Yes, drastic light cycle changes AFTER week 4 have proven increased chances of herm. thats why i either 12/12 from week 5 on, or work back to 16/8, 18/6, or 24/0 quickly. Not like the sun keeps consistent hours or even angle in the sky anyways.....Personally when I really want a lot of hardy females, I clone a plant. Screw seeds.
Well first, that LONG ass grasscity thread was a combination of cluttered reposts mixed with sensi-seeds report on "more females." So of course I think some of the post will be affected by human errors,assumptions, etc.
And by "I think its this" I literally meant people posting their 100% unfounded opinions. At least my opinions/theories/hypothesis aren't unfounded.
"I think its geno.." or "I think its pheno".......
Actually its BOTH. Just use google... If geno had nothing to do with it, fem seeds would not be possible. But if geno had EVERYTHING to do with it, explain how people get pure "males" from fem seeds. Do your reading. Im done with this thread. For real this time. Following this thread is a nightmare. Almost every new poster has made it clear they skipped the beginning of this thread to post an incomplete half-assed answer about the video. I though I explained these plant BASICS rather well, but who knows. Already got a bigger thanks than i felt my short temperedness deserved, thanks guys who actually read my posts and could comprehend them.
Sorry for repeating the same shit 100 times sativied. Wish I just knew how to let things go. I mean why do I feel the NEED to help people grow better. It doesn't affect me? Let these fuckers drive nails through their stems, boil the roots, cultivate/add citrus mold. I say screw the superstition. I only call my plants "girls" after pre flower. Its just another superstition to put a new grower in the right mentality. I have sat there and called all my plants males/boys just for fun,and OMG, I still got the same ratios I was getting.
Thanks for a post that is based in REALITY. This thread is so aggravating, sorry if I came off as fitting into that bit.
I am no expert. I am experienced. But I have been wrong plenty of times. I have realized that i was arguing sometimes unnecessarily, but trying to help and getting the same nonsense for 10 days is much past my level of tolerance. I know that I for sure said both the whole way, and thats all that matters to me now.
And I'd like to make the point, this SHOULD be under NEWBIE CENTRAL. Absolutely NOTHING advanced about this thread.