DIY PH Down from Sulfuric Acid. (Battery Acid)

Yesdog

Well-Known Member
Eh, it looks like Potassium Silicate is actually really happy as a gel lol. Won't likely chelate as it's already in its own complex/colloid- apparently Fulvics can strip Si ions from straight insoluble silica though... wonder if you could just soak the fulvic and some silica sand together.

It does sound like you can chelate potassium silicate with PEG, another clear gel... so theres a chance the commercial Si supplements already use that (and I don't think you have to put it in the MSDS/GA either).

But I guess that's one of the main vehicles that dissolve Si in dirt- fulvics/humics.
 

churchhaze

Well-Known Member
The liquid [silicate] stuff is usually already ionized with Mg or K- that's why most of the liquids have an NPK value
It's also why it does something. Mg++ and K+ ions are macro nutrients while Si is sand. The only thing better than potassium silicate for pH up is potassium hydroxide. It's better because it doesn't pollute your res with needless silicates.
 

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
It's also why it does something. Mg++ and K+ ions are macro nutrients while Si is sand. The only thing better than potassium silicate for pH up is potassium hydroxide. It's better because it doesn't pollute your res with needless silicates.
Lol- you'd be amazed at how many people are trying to figure out how to get those 'useless' silicates INTO their res!
 

Yesdog

Well-Known Member
It's also why it does something. Mg++ and K+ ions are macro nutrients while Si is sand. The only thing better than potassium silicate for pH up is potassium hydroxide. It's better because it doesn't pollute your res with needless silicates.
@churchhaze i meant "the liquid [humics/fulvics]" usually comes with Mg or K. I think you mostly find Si in the forms of silic acid or Na/K silicate complexes.
 
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Yesdog

Well-Known Member
Lol- you'd be amazed at how many people are trying to figure out how to get those 'useless' silicates INTO their res!
and yeah, honestly still trying to get that shit into my res. It precipitating as a clear substance is probably less noticeable, vs the milky/sandy/shitty
Cal/Mag precipitates you can easily see.... so who knows. Might all just be on my hoses by now.

EDIT: I did find some interesting pdfs about humics and silica oxide (the sand)- basically titrates in small amounts directly.... might just throw some sand in my res lol
 
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Yesdog

Well-Known Member
It's also why it does something. Mg++ and K+ ions are macro nutrients while Si is sand. The only thing better than potassium silicate for pH up is potassium hydroxide. It's better because it doesn't pollute your res with needless silicates.
I am really curious about how organic acids, HA/FV, etc might play a role in "buffering" available ions for Si and any other cations. I'm pretty wary of adding potassium silicate to my rez right now anyways, would be interesting so to see if there's other ways. I guess there's some silica test kits, might have to play around and see what/if anything works.

For right now, I finally got my rez ph stable- and that's new in the last 2 weeks. Humics, precipitates, full nutrient batch, bunch of acids... finally stable. Sulfuric definitely helped get me there. Now that its stable, its GH pH Down for a nice dose of P and a little ammoniacal N.

Plants look ready to get back to business, and pH is on an ever-increasingly stable curve:




Sorry for the misquote.
im not great at typing things out lol
 
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THE KONASSURE

Well-Known Member
I am really curious about how organic acids, HA/FV, etc might play a role in "buffering" available ions for Si and any other cations. I'm pretty wary of adding potassium silicate to my rez right now anyways, would be interesting so to see if there's other ways. I guess there's some silica test kits, might have to play around and see what/if anything works.

For right now, I finally got my rez ph stable- and that's new in the last 2 weeks. Humics, precipitates, full nutrient batch, bunch of acids... finally stable. Sulfuric definitely helped get me there. Now that its stable, its GH pH Down for a nice dose of P and a little ammoniacal N.

Plants look ready to get back to business, and pH is on an ever-increasingly stable curve:





im not great at typing things out lol

Add potassium silicate to your water at stage one of conditioning, I then go with fulvic acid, then add the bennies, I ph before adding the bennies...... It`s called brewing up a basic mold/bacteria and what it needs to thrive I add around 10g per 100L of my powder 1-2-3 feed and I hope the bennies breed up to be able to break that down when I mix that water with the plant food but you could just use the water for hydro

I went ph5 last week found the butt at ph6 this week just right for me to use powder food did`nt have to fook around with any A and B today :)
 

churchhaze

Well-Known Member

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
That's not what weak acid means.

"A strong acid is one that completely ionizes (dissociates) in a solution"

"In contrast, a weak acid only partially dissociates."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acid_strength

A weak acid will work as a buffer when used with a strong base, but it doesn't make a good pH down like strong acids do.
I didn't give the chemistry lesson, but your last sentence says the same thing I did.
 

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Would sulphuric acid help with the up take of silica ?
Not according to the man I spoke to who manufactures dry nutrient salts for agriculture. He suggested running the silica at high pH by itself for a day, then dumping and running the standard nutes.

His explanation was that silica will drop out of solution at lower pH.
 

Enigma

Well-Known Member
HOW TO MAKE IT:

Buy sulfuric acid at the auto parts store for 7 dollars. Just ask them for battery acid. Get the 33% kind (that means its already partially diluted)

Get a gallon of distilled water, pour out 2 cups.

Put 1 cup of battery acid in your gallon jug of water. Wait a minute or two. Put top back on. Lightly agitate to mix.

Thats it, you have just made a gallon of PH down for a maybe a dollar or so.

SAFETY:

Never pour water into an acid. Always pour acid into water. Wear gloves. Wear safety glasses. If you get it on you, wash it off. Don't drink it.

BENEFITS:

Availability: You can buy sulfuric acid anywhere in the world no questions asked.

Cost: Sulfuric acid is many times cheaper than ph down from the store.

Stealth: Sulfuric acid is used in batteries, and people will assume you are using
it for batteries. If you buy hydroponic ph down they assume you are
growing something hydroponically.

Ease of use
for large
growers: If you have a large res you can use battery acid straight into the
remote res, you wont have to dump cups of ph down into it any
longer, as a small amount of sulfuric acid undiluted(33% is undiluted)
does the same thing.

MYTHS AND FACTS:

Sulfuric acid has Lead in it - FALSE: There is no lead in battery acid, there is lead in batteries. No one is saying to drain batteries and use the acid from it.

Sulfuric acid is Very Dangerous and you will die a horrible death and your hand will melt off and your penis will shrivel - FALSE(mostly): We aren't dealing with pure sulfuric acid, if it was 100% sulfuric acid it would be bad, but you aren't going to find 100% acid anywhere. Haven't any of you ever had battery acid on you? Ive had car batteries explode on me, and I get my homemade battery acid ph down on my skin all the time. Its not like its going to eat you alive, it just itches. If you get it in your eyes, it will be bad, so wear eye protection. Sulfuric acid you will buy at the auto parts store is most likely 33%, which means its already diluted, so you end up with a 3.3%. Household bleach in your eyes sucks too. Are you afraid of bleach? When I get it on my hands when concentrated(33%), I just wash my hands. Unconcentrated, I just rinse it off with water. Ask any mechanic, you wont see them wearing safety glasses while changing batteries or filling them with acid unless their boss makes them simply because it isn't that big of a deal. You don't dress up in a space suit to pour chlorine or shock into your swimming pool do you? You will die, but probably from cheeseburgers and sodas (sodas contain phosphoric acid lol)

Phosphoric is much safer than Sulfuric - FALSE In diluted form the difference is minor. Either one will make your skin itchy. They use Phosphoric acid in tile cleaners, rust removers, and things of that nature. Phosphoric acid is made from Sulfuric acid. They put rocks high in phosphate into sulfuric acid to make it.

Fact: Many people use sulfuric acid as a ph down. Not just marijuana growers, also berry growers, people who run orchards. They also use sulfur, which breaks down into sulfuric acid in the ground. This is a naturally occurring acid in the ground. Its not like you are pouring antifreeze into your res.

Fact: Most people who say using sulfuric acid for PH down doesn't work have never used it, don't understand what ph down does, and don't know why they are using it. They only know what someone else told them or they are reacting to the term 'battery acid'

https://www.rollitup.org/t/diy-ph-down-easy.292221/

January 13th, 2010; just nine (9) months to the exact day before this thread.

-E
 
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