chuck estevez
Well-Known Member
i grow with synthetic nutes and have NEVER opened a rootball to find a soilweb, so your fucking wrong dude.
DYNA GROW IS > (greater than) ADVANCED NUTRIENTS
- Thread starter ChroniSuierkush
- Start date
chuck estevez
Well-Known Member
READ RULE #13 from the book,so unless your smarter than the guy who wrote"teaming with microbes"???? please,STFU
....the 19 rules!
1) Some plants prefer soils dominated by fungi; others prefer soils dominated by bacteria.
2) Most vegetables, annuals, and grasses prefer their nitrogen in nitrate form and do best in bacterially dominated soils.
3) Most trees, shrubs, and perennials prefer their nitrogen in ammonium form and do best in fungal dominated soils.
4) Compost can be used to inoculate beneficial microbes and life into soils around your yard and introduce, maintain, or alter the soil food web in a particular area.
5) Adding compost/ compost teas and its soil food web to the surface of soil will inoculate the soil with the same soil food web.
6) Aged, brown organic materials support fungi; fresh, green organic materials support bacteria.
7) Mulch laid on the surface tends to support fungi; mulch worked into the soil tends to support bacteria.
If you wet and grind mulch thoroughly, it speeds up bacterial colonization.
9) Coarse, dryer mulches support fungal activity.
10) Sugars help bacteria multiply and grow; kelp, humic and fulvic acids, and phosphate rock dusts help fungi grow.
11) By choosing the compost you begin with and what nutrients you add to it, you make teas that are heavily fungal, bacterially dominated, or balanced.
12) Compost teas are very sensitive to chlorine and preservatives in the brewing water and ingredients.
13) Applications of synthetic fertilizers kill off most or all of the soil food web microbes.
14) Stay away from additives that have high NPK numbers.
15) Follow any chemical spraying or soil drenching with an application of compost tea.
16) Most conifers and hardwood trees (birch, oak, beech, and hickory) form mycorrhizae with ectomycorrhizal fungi.
17) Most vegetables, annuals, grasses, shrubs, softwood trees, and perennials form mycorrhizae with endomycorrhizal fungi.
1 Rototilling and excessive soil disturbance destroy or severely damage the soil food web.
19) Always mix endomycorrhizal fungi with the seeds of annuals and vegetables at planting time or apply them to roots at transplanting time.
....the 19 rules!
1) Some plants prefer soils dominated by fungi; others prefer soils dominated by bacteria.
2) Most vegetables, annuals, and grasses prefer their nitrogen in nitrate form and do best in bacterially dominated soils.
3) Most trees, shrubs, and perennials prefer their nitrogen in ammonium form and do best in fungal dominated soils.
4) Compost can be used to inoculate beneficial microbes and life into soils around your yard and introduce, maintain, or alter the soil food web in a particular area.
5) Adding compost/ compost teas and its soil food web to the surface of soil will inoculate the soil with the same soil food web.
6) Aged, brown organic materials support fungi; fresh, green organic materials support bacteria.
7) Mulch laid on the surface tends to support fungi; mulch worked into the soil tends to support bacteria.
If you wet and grind mulch thoroughly, it speeds up bacterial colonization.
9) Coarse, dryer mulches support fungal activity.
10) Sugars help bacteria multiply and grow; kelp, humic and fulvic acids, and phosphate rock dusts help fungi grow.
11) By choosing the compost you begin with and what nutrients you add to it, you make teas that are heavily fungal, bacterially dominated, or balanced.
12) Compost teas are very sensitive to chlorine and preservatives in the brewing water and ingredients.
13) Applications of synthetic fertilizers kill off most or all of the soil food web microbes.
14) Stay away from additives that have high NPK numbers.
15) Follow any chemical spraying or soil drenching with an application of compost tea.
16) Most conifers and hardwood trees (birch, oak, beech, and hickory) form mycorrhizae with ectomycorrhizal fungi.
17) Most vegetables, annuals, grasses, shrubs, softwood trees, and perennials form mycorrhizae with endomycorrhizal fungi.
1 Rototilling and excessive soil disturbance destroy or severely damage the soil food web.
19) Always mix endomycorrhizal fungi with the seeds of annuals and vegetables at planting time or apply them to roots at transplanting time.
Malevolence
New Member
Well I don't know dick about soil or soil webs or why they would be in my hydro buckets. Only guessing you are talking about housing which people use rockwool lavarocks japanese pond mats or even hydroton in hydro.
And I couldn't give a shit less what his book says when I put benes in my res and they work.
And I couldn't give a shit less what his book says when I put benes in my res and they work.
Malevolence
New Member
I wouldn't expect you to unless you went go like 6+ weeks without changing your res. Also if you're not in dwc your roots get too much air.
chuck estevez
Well-Known Member
this is a quote from heinsenberg.
- Most DWC setups do not require bennies. It is an unnecessary step with the exception of organics or if you are in an environment prone to root disease.
Malevolence
New Member
That quote has nothing to do with whether or not synthetic nutes kill benes.
Most people probably do fine with just keeping their buckets cold and dark and oxygenated.... maybe a little h2o2 for slime. Others like me have to use aquashield or I get root rot in like 2 days. I think it may depend on where you live and the general environment in your city.
Most hydro not in dwc do not get root rot or pythium even if it is in the res because the roots get too much air for the root rot to take hold. So no jeed for benes.
And yea if you are running organics you need benes to break down the nutrients so the roots can absorb it.
Most people probably do fine with just keeping their buckets cold and dark and oxygenated.... maybe a little h2o2 for slime. Others like me have to use aquashield or I get root rot in like 2 days. I think it may depend on where you live and the general environment in your city.
Most hydro not in dwc do not get root rot or pythium even if it is in the res because the roots get too much air for the root rot to take hold. So no jeed for benes.
And yea if you are running organics you need benes to break down the nutrients so the roots can absorb it.
hooked.on.ponics
Well-Known Member
True. I would temper this to say "Synthetic nutes do not necessarily kill benes." I'm fairly certain that if you run them hot enough you will kill beneficial microbes faster than you can replace them, but at those levels you'll probably burn the crap out of your plants anyway. The reason most people believe mineral nutrients kill benes is that they don't usually provide food for benes. They starve (as you go on to point out).
This actually isn't true. Just want to help you out by improving your argument here. First, there's no "carbon molecule". Carbon is an atom that can be part of many different molecules and in pure form can actually form several different kinds of molecules (like diamond, for example). It's also a common misconception that if you take an "inorganic" molecule and attach a carbon atom to it, it become "organic", or that any molecule that has carbon in it is organic. (This is actually the basis for the deliberately manufactured belief that crude oil is "fossil fuel" - it has a lot of carbon, and it was very beneficial to early oil barons to portray it as a very limited resource, so they petitioned/strong-armed to get it classified as organic when it's actually abiotic.)
Organic is nothing more than a label we as humans use to classify things. I'm not saying it isn't a useful label, but the problem is we don't all agree on what it means. Take beef for example. Is the steak organic? Well, not if the cow was given hormones. But what if the grain it was fed was grown using inorganic fertilizer? What if it was grown using organic fertilizer that came out of the business end of a cow that WASN'T fed organic grain? Different people have different ideas of how organic is "organic enough to be organic".
For the purpose of this particular discussion, "organic" is most usefully defined as "directly derived from what is/was living matter."
And, as you say, it doesn't matter because once it's broken down it's chemically indistinguishable from a mineral nutrient. Plants can't chew their own food, the microbes do it for them, and once that's been done it's no different from a mineral nutrient.
Exactly. Though not all synthetic (I prefer "mineral" actually) nutrients are fully broken down. The minerals in that form cost more to make, so they cost more for the nute companies to buy. Many of them cut corners by buying them in formats that are less useful or completely useless to plants. It still tests as having the right NPK according to lab equipment, but it doesn't really feed your plants. Another reason not to go purely by labels or price tags.
Interesting idea. Personally, I feed my benes with a carbohydrate supplement (the plants benefit from carbs too). It's like brewing beer - if you inoculate with a beneficial culture it will beat out the harmful competition. You just need to make sure it gets there first and gets a solid foothold and they do all the heavy lifting for you. For beer it's all about making sure that between the boil and pitching the yeast there's no chance for infection by foreign microbes. You crash the temp as fast as possible, keep it as isolated as you can, and so on. Then pitch the yeast as soon as the wort is cool enough. Same principle in hydroponics. Sterilize the hell out of everything before you start, and get the benes in before anything else can really even try to get started. They flourish, and kill of any intruders before they can multiply enough to do damage.
I do it all the time, so I know first-hand that it's completely doable in a non-organic system. Saying that you have to run organics because everything else kills benes is just a myth perpetuated to make organic growers happier with lower yields - IMO.
This is one of the funniest things I've read. Google Images for "soil web".
So you're telling me you've never opened a rootball to find a diagram of the various metabolic processes of many different kinds of microscopic life? Hang on a second, I need to sit down from the shock.
WTFH would a "soilweb" look like? Are you imagining that if the same or similar microbial life were present in a hydroponic reservoir you'd pull up your plants and find a big ball of dirt in the roots? Dirt's useless. It's just the stuff everything else lives in. Decaying organic matter, stabilized organic matter, tons of microbial life, and tiny little rocks. That's pretty much it. Take away the stuff you don't need and you have water, nutrients, and microbial life. Hydroponics.
If I had a microscope I could pull a sample out of my res right now, look at it, and see lots of little microbes swimming happily about. They don't need dirt any more than the plants do.
And that doesn't even get into the whole logical fallacy of "it hasn't happened to me so it can't happen to you". I have, tragically, never walked into my bedroom to find Claudia Black naked in my bed with a come hither look in her eyes. You probably haven't either. In fact I'd wager the vast majority of the Earth's male population can't honestly claim to have had that happen to them.
But that doesn't mean it hasn't happened to someone else. And it doesn't mean it won't happen to me someday. (fingers crossed)
bluntmassa1
Well-Known Member
I agree AN is way over priced and a joke for them to say their made for cannabis as you will kill your plants just by following the directions what kind of bs is that? if I'm buying nutes made for weed I wan't to follow the directions but I doubt you can find a strain/ pheno that can handle AN at full strength. you would think with all their talk about scientist's mixing their shit they might actually get their labels right so you don't need to play a guessing game to know how much of what nute should be used.
but I'm not bashing them completly cause people do great with it but I don't think their any better than any good nute company.
but I'm not bashing them completly cause people do great with it but I don't think their any better than any good nute company.
Sir.Ganga
New Member
My Shark runs at 1800-2200ppm on AN my friend, and my Cheese is at 1400-1600. There again the problem isn't the product it how people precieve it. That statement alone shows the actual strength of AN when compared to what ever other nutrient line he is using is much stronger and probably the reason for failure.
You can't blame a product due to a lack of knowledge, equipment and or practices, blame the grower.
When proper practices and equipment are used not only is AN a top of the line product but is one of the most cost effective on the market. I have tried quite a few and dollar for dollar it is worth it IMO
potpimp
Sector 5 Moderator
I'll admit to being sucked in by urban grower's videos and all the hyper hype in the AN advertising. I bought about $450 worth of their shit and used it on a few grows til I got tired of playing chemist. I had the chart, all the nutes, a pipette, a small graduated cylinder, a calculator, a pen and pad - everything but the lab coat. It took a good 30 - 45 minutes to feed my plants. When I found a simple, cheap product that did even better than AN, I felt like I had hit the lottery. They will NEVER get any more of my money - for anything.
Alexander Supertramp
Well-Known Member
You dont have to use a different bulb on different settings if you dont mind shortening the life of your bulbs. and slowing the growth of your plants by giving them subPAR light! Smart and informed growers know better and understand these basic things. I am guessing you are not in the aforementioned group...
potpimp
Sector 5 Moderator
Yeah he has two posts so cut him some slack.
Sir.Ganga
New Member
With this statement alone...AN is not for you. What did you do...go out and buy all of them? I have never burnt my plants using AN, never seen a lockout and I rarely use more than their 3 part, carbo, sensi for my flower. I wonder why my plants look so good when I'm only using 2 essential additives. AN is not for everyone and there are quite a few decent products but just because you have had issues using it tell me you will have other issues using a different brand. Its not the nutrients...Its the grower
beuffer420
Well-Known Member
I say use what u use and b happy. All this back and forth is getting real old. I use AN, I like my results and don't have probs. someone else uses dyna they have good results with no probs. why not just leave it at that.