Electrical help please, need to make a timer board

matt7835706

matt7835706

Well-Known Member
Heres the plan

I have a room that is wired for a clothes drier 220 plug, i want to take the female plug off the dryer and connect it to a board and have 4, 4 x 110 plugs. i want to connect all my ballast and pumps and timers etc.. to all work on it.

Can someone help me with this process I know nothing about electrical but quick to learn.
I really don't need a fire so im looking for professinal help please!

plug.jpg
Does this make sence, please explain what need to happen to make this work.
Thanks!!!
 
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smokey mcsmokester

Well-Known Member
That drawing is a dangerous interpretation.... Get the sub panel and 2 breakers, and a roll of 14-2 romex wire(or however many feet of wire you are going to need) then we will go from there...
 
matt7835706

matt7835706

Well-Known Member
Hey great thanks for your help smokey!! Ok, you ahow me how to connect the 30a subpanel to the existing 220 box right? It would be very hard or near impossable to run the wire back to the main panel. Do i need breakers is that the 15 amp curcuits your talking about? can you explain why they are 15 amp max? Im trying to wrap my brain around it.
 
LT1RX7 Drifter

LT1RX7 Drifter

Active Member
all bad addvice he's not an electrician there is actually a fella here that has a thread for just this type of thing that is a licensed electrician that run his own business, search with the word electician with the forum search engine
 
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smokey mcsmokester

Well-Known Member
LT1RX7 Drifter said:
all bad addvice he's not an electrician there is actually a fella here that has a thread for just this type of thing that is a licensed electrician that run his own business, search with the word electician with the forum search engine
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All bad advice huh??? I happen to be a licensed journeman electrician who runs my own business drifter....lmao......Tell me what was bad about my advice?
 
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smokey mcsmokester

Well-Known Member
matt7835706 said:
Hey great thanks for your help smokey!! Ok, you ahow me how to connect the 30a subpanel to the existing 220 box right? It would be very hard or near impossable to run the wire back to the main panel. Do i need breakers is that the 15 amp curcuits your talking about? can you explain why they are 15 amp max? Im trying to wrap my brain around it.
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Yes breakers are what I mean by 15 amp circuits, you will need 2 15 amp circuit breakers.

There should be a 220 v dryer outlet , Is that what you mean by box? Because that's what I meant... If so, the dryer cable should be 10 guage wire which should be coming off of a 30 amp double pole breaker in your panel box. Go and trace the dryer wire back to the panel and make sure im correct. If this is the case simply hook the 30 amp sub panel up where the dryer plug was by putting the black and red wires under the load lugs and the white wire onto a bus bar (a long skinny bar with screws to place wires under)....
Now you have yourself a 30 amp load center....
The reason Im saying 2 15 amp breakers is because you only have 30 amps to work with... 15 amps + 15 amps = 30 amps....

Each 15 amp breaker will be able to handle 1400 watts safely, they can handle up to 1800 watts but the NEC code only allows 80% of the rated load, It's a safe rule to follow... This will give you a total of 2800 watts for your grow... Is that enough? If so, then get the items I told you to and we will go from there.....

Here's a 30 amp sub panel... http://www.hardwareandtools.com/Square-D-QO2L30S-CP-QO-30-Amp-Surface-Mount-Load-Center-6475958.html
 
LT1RX7 Drifter

LT1RX7 Drifter

Active Member
smokey mcsmokester said:
Yes breakers are what I mean by 15 amp circuits, you will need 2 15 amp circuit breakers.

There should be a 220 v dryer outlet , Is that what you mean by box? Because that's what I meant... If so, the dryer cable should be 10 guage wire which should be coming off of a 30 amp double pole breaker in your panel box. Go and trace the dryer wire back to the panel and make sure im correct. If this is the case simply hook the 30 amp sub panel up where the dryer plug was by putting the black and red wires under the load lugs and the white wire onto a bus bar (a long skinny bar with screws to place wires under)....
Now you have yourself a 30 amp load center....
The reason Im saying 2 15 amp breakers is because you only have 30 amps to work with... 15 amps + 15 amps = 30 amps....

Each 15 amp breaker will be able to handle 1400 watts safely, they can handle up to 1800 watts but the NEC code only allows 80% of the rated load, It's a safe rule to follow... This will give you a total of 2800 watts for your grow... Is that enough? If so, then get the items I told you to and we will go from there.....

Here's a 30 amp sub panel... http://www.hardwareandtools.com/Square-D-QO2L30S-CP-QO-30-Amp-Surface-Mount-Load-Center-6475958.html
Click to expand...
lisenced huh lol right thats why you refered to a breaker as "15", or the fact you just told him to double lug a feeder cable at the breaker panel is against nec code, 2800w is not enough when the lights alone use 2000 watts, like i said bad addvice, now if you pig tail the power feed from the breaker this is acceptable,another thing as well a experienced electrician would asked is this 220v that you wanna use is it the main dryer breaker and if so use of the dryer is not possible if the lights are running as it would easily over load the breaker, if you are licensed then you need to go back to school, you do not feed a power sub-panel with 14/2 gauge wire nec code is 10/3, not to mention you havent even touched the issue with oulets yet
 
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smokey mcsmokester

Well-Known Member
LT1RX7 Drifter said:
lisenced huh lol right thats why you refered to a breaker as "15", or the fact you just told him to double lug a feeder cable at the breaker panel is against nec code, 2800w is not enough when the lights alone use 2000 watts, like i said bad addvice, now if you pig tail the power feed from the breaker this is acceptable,another thing as well a experienced electrician would asked is this 220v that you wanna use is it the main dryer breaker and if so use of the dryer is not possible if the lights are running as it would easily over load the breaker, if you are licensed then you need to go back to school, you do not feed a power sub-panel with 14/2 gauge wire nec code is 10/3, not to mention you havent even touched the issue with oulets yet
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Yes I am, There is no need to argue with you drifter.. So I called a breaker a 15 amp breaker...lol...Your point?
And what in the hell are you talking about double lugging at the main panel???

I never said feed the sub with 14- 2! 14-2 is the size wire needed for the 15 amp breakers to feed the outlets he's looking for his power board or whatever! lol....Go back and read , you will see that I told him to go and trace the 10 (did you hear me) 10 guage wire for the dryer back to the panel and make sure it is fed by a double 30 amp breaker...Any fellow electrician who reads my post above will understand what I stated is common knowledge in the electricle world.... Your making yourself look really stupid... Are you done attacking me? Would you like me to go through every word I stated step by step so you can understand it in a elementary way?
 
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smokey mcsmokester

Well-Known Member
Im still sitting hear banging my head trying to understand you drifter???? LOL... He already stated he wanted to disconnect his dryer plug , so why are you saying a good electrician would ask if you are planning on keeping the dryer???? LOL... Go back and read everything real slow ok?
Maybe then It will sink in..... Will someone else please help me out here, and let drifter know he's making himself look silly.... I don't want to argue drifter but your leaving me no choice..
 
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smokey mcsmokester

Well-Known Member
LT1RX7 Drifter said:
lisenced huh lol right thats why you refered to a breaker as "15", or the fact you just told him to double lug a feeder cable at the breaker panel is against nec code, 2800w is not enough when the lights alone use 2000 watts, like i said bad addvice, now if you pig tail the power feed from the breaker this is acceptable,another thing as well a experienced electrician would asked is this 220v that you wanna use is it the main dryer breaker and if so use of the dryer is not possible if the lights are running as it would easily over load the breaker, if you are licensed then you need to go back to school, you do not feed a power sub-panel with 14/2 gauge wire nec code is 10/3, not to mention you havent even touched the issue with oulets yet
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Who said he was using 2000 watts of light?????
I didn't read that anywhere....Even if he was using 2000 watts of light, why wouldn't that be enough??? That leaves 800 watts to be used safely... Unless he's going to run a ac unit... 2800 watts is plenty......
Again, where does he state he is going to be running 2000 watts of light????
 
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smokey mcsmokester

Well-Known Member
Randm said:
I'd go with 12 gauge wire
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He can use 12 guage wire, I was just sizing the proper wire guage with the size breaker (15 amps)...... 12 guage wire is fine to use on a 15 amp breaker, however 14 guage wire is in no way safe to use on a 20 amp breaker unless for lighting.... Most common receptacles found in hardware stores are 15 amp receptacles which means there only rated for 15 amps max.....
 
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mrmadcow

Well-Known Member
god I hate pissing contests.Matt, stick around, you are getting good advice.I think drifter is misunderstanding what smokey said & is trying to protect you from screwing up & if he misunderstood, you could to. never fear, when someone posts bad advise, he will get bit. its better for someone to question good advice mistakenly than to let bad advice go unquestioned
so far smokey is correct except, ASSUMING it is a 30 amp, 220volt circuit,their will be 60 amps of 110 available.I would get a larger subpanel that will fit 6-8 breakers.you can run 4-5 20 amp breakers off that line w/ no problem as it is assumed you will not be running at full load on all breakers all the time.you will only have 30 amps available on each leg so you will have to balance any loads out but that isn't hard.
a good place to start would be a basic house wiring guide found in most hardware stores. what you need is not hard to do but detailed instructions will fill a book. post back w/ more details & questions as needed.
my guess is it will cost you about $50-60 to DIY (+timers)or you could get a power controller already made for a couple hundred.

http://www.hydroponics.net/i/133091
 
LT1RX7 Drifter

LT1RX7 Drifter

Active Member
mrmadcow said:
god I hate pissing contests.Matt, stick around, you are getting good advice.I think drifter is misunderstanding what smokey said & is trying to protect you from screwing up & if he misunderstood, you could to. never fear, when someone posts bad advise, he will get bit. its better for someone to question good advice mistakenly than to let bad advice go unquestioned
so far smokey is correct except, ASSUMING it is a 30 amp, 220volt circuit,their will be 60 amps of 110 available.I would get a larger subpanel that will fit 6-8 breakers.you can run 4-5 20 amp breakers off that line w/ no problem as it is assumed you will not be running at full load on all breakers all the time.you will only have 30 amps available on each leg so you will have to balance any loads out but that isn't hard.
a good place to start would be a basic house wiring guide found in most hardware stores. what you need is not hard to do but detailed instructions will fill a book. post back w/ more details & questions as needed.
my guess is it will cost you about $50-60 to DIY (+timers)or you could get a power controller already made for a couple hundred.

http://www.hydroponics.net/i/133091
Click to expand...
well said, which is what i was getting @ in my pm's with the op, and i to also suggested the exact same power control panel
 
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smokey mcsmokester

Well-Known Member
mrmadcow said:
god I hate pissing contests.Matt, stick around, you are getting good advice.I think drifter is misunderstanding what smokey said & is trying to protect you from screwing up & if he misunderstood, you could to. never fear, when someone posts bad advise, he will get bit. its better for someone to question good advice mistakenly than to let bad advice go unquestioned
so far smokey is correct except, ASSUMING it is a 30 amp, 220volt circuit,their will be 60 amps of 110 available.I would get a larger subpanel that will fit 6-8 breakers.you can run 4-5 20 amp breakers off that line w/ no problem as it is assumed you will not be running at full load on all breakers all the time.you will only have 30 amps available on each leg so you will have to balance any loads out but that isn't hard.
a good place to start would be a basic house wiring guide found in most hardware stores. what you need is not hard to do but detailed instructions will fill a book. post back w/ more details & questions as needed.
my guess is it will cost you about $50-60 to DIY (+timers)or you could get a power controller already made for a couple hundred.

http://www.hydroponics.net/i/133091
Click to expand...


Thanks mr, I was just starting him off easy by explaining the 30 amp max. I didn't want to confuse him anymore than I had to....After he wired it up I was going to explain he could pull 60 amps off the whole sub... I just wanted to give him a quick example the safest way I could.... I wasn't trying to start a pissing contest here, Drifter just started attacking me telling me I was giving bad advice in which I wasn't.... Thank you again for clearing this up....
 
matt7835706

matt7835706

Well-Known Member
Ok... First, thank you all so much. Second, I had a private IM with drifter and he got information about the setup that no one else did and that caused confussion.. i'm sorry.

Now i'm starting to understand what i need to do... let me put it in my word and correct me if im wrong, please

60 amp sub panel for safety over the 30, make sure the current curcuit breaker in the main panel in 30 amps, could be 60 or 110 and we need to be sure. If the wire running from the main is 10 guage the max i can run is 30 amps, and if that correct should I not just stick with the 30A sub so not to confuss anyone down the road?

Safe, correct and to code... thats all I want

I would like to get everyone to agree on the parts list.

30 amp or 60 amp sub panel?
10 guage or 12 gauge,
15 amps brakers x 2?

Lastly... I was wanting to make the panel mobile,( if possible, if not , fine ) if I move. I wanted to take the male plug ( sorry, i called it female before )off the back of the dryer and use it as the connection from the panel to the main power source. I want to be able to plug my board in to and 220 plug ( checking it a 30 amp first ) in any house. Does that make sense or is that a crazy uninformed idea ( I'm ok if you tell me im a moron for asking that question )

If that can't be done, i'm assuming I need a new face plate for the 220 box that currently house's the the female plugin to cover the new connection between the existing line and the new cable? Sorry for the lack of technical terms and knowledge on this subject, but I do understand what you guys want to happen here.

Thanks a ton for all the help this is what RIU is all about for me and i hope i can pay it forward to others!!

End note: i will be running two 1000w ballasts of the panel and want to hook the one 4 x 110 box to a time, the rest i will use just store bought times for the fans and pumps and c02 reg. , i can't emagine the draw off those items would overlaod and cause a fire.

Again thanks for all the help!!

Matt
 
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mrmadcow

Well-Known Member
a subpanel is rated 2 ways, max amps and # of breakers. the max amps determines the size of the wire lugs so you would have trouble cramming 6 gauge wire in a 30 amp panel but 10 gauge wire will fit in a 60 amp panel so going bigger won't hurt.what you want is a panel that will take more breakers than you think you will ever need. you will regret buying a 30 amp 2 breaker panel.
as for breakers & wire, they have to match or use a smaller breaker. 14 gauge wire need a 15 amp breaker or smaller,12 gauge needs a 20 amp breaker (a 15 will work) & 10 gauge will need a 30 amp breaker. personnally, I would use 12 gauge wire w/ 20 amp breakers but 14 gauge w/ 15 amp breakers will work.
mobile could work. I would take a piece of 3/4 plywood and mount the subpanel & outlet boxes to it. 1 outlet to a breaker for each light and 2-3 more outlets to a 3rd breaker for everything else. (meybe a 4th breaker w/ outlet for a heater). you could take the dryer cord and feed the sub w/ that or if you have enough wire at the 220 outlet to work w/, just remove the dryer outlet & hardwire the sub in. either way, I would attach the plywood to a wall w/ a few screws so it could be removed but is secured & wont get pulled over.
in the US, 220 is really not 220 but 2 seperate 110 legs so if you open your main panel you should see a black wire going to 1 side of a double breaker feeding 1 phase of 110 & a red wire going to the other side of the breaker feeding the other phase of 110.a white wire will go to the neutral leg.(& a ground).
your main is fed by 2 seperate 110 legs and distributed through the panel on 2 alternating sets of busbars that the breakers plug into.
what this means to you is that you want each light to be on a different leg to spread the load out. if both lights are on the same leg and you add a heater to it, you will trip the breaker (2 10 amp lights and a 15 amp heater= 35 amps) but if the lights are on seperate legs, you will still have almost 20 amps available on each leg.

final thought, use GFI breakers or outlets for safety
 
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