F2 Pheno Hunt Advice

budolskie said:

These untouched landraces do we mean

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BongerChonger said:

I think the better question for the seed maker is, why make the seed in the first place?
What's your objective?

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Blutri said:

Would you go to the pound and pick out a dog to use as a basis of a breeding program?
Most will say hell no.
Then why would you purchase a plant composed of 4 different parental lines?¿
Wouldn’t that plant be the equivalent of mutt dog?¿. Hold that thought.
lets see a show of hands from those who thinks that you can create an awesome line of dogs just by breeding 2 mutt puppies together.
In one breeding I might add…
for real, do anyone think that that they can pull that off?¿.
To everyone who say “no, it can’t be done”, then why do you make post claiming such awesome plant genetics when in fact you have the plant equivalent of a mutt dog.
What happens when 2 of those mutt pups grow up and have a litter together?¿ ever pull up to a house that has 15 or more scraggly dogs running around the yard? Of course you have.
I chuckle every time I see posts where someone talks about how many different phenotypes that their line of plants produces.
Grow up, because I’m not talking about the slight differences in taste and smell. I’m talking about complete structural differences in size, height, bud production.grow time. Hell even the high from plant to plant is so different, that you can barely tell that those plants where produces from the same seed pack.
You say genetic diversity, however I say mutt. But call it what you like because it’s your hard earned $$$. So spend it how you want to.
Consider this, those mutt plants take the same resources and effort to grow as better breed ones. That’s what I tell my buddies who choose to raise $50 dogs. For real, why do that when those $50 dogs eat the same dog food and take the same amount of time and effort to raise as higher end dog.
Ever try selling a mutt?¿ My email is filled with half off, or buy one get one free bean. Labor Day sale? Every day must be Labor Day then. It’s all good though.
How many of you are growing $35 bean packs?¿.
How many of you think there is no difference in plants produced from $35 beans and plants produced from $3,500 beans.
That’s because most of you have never seen such a plant. Therefore you think that all the plants are the same.
That’s the reasoning behind those 1 of 100, 1 of 1,000 pheno hunts for that unicorn.
I guarantee that you want see a mutt produce an akc champion. Nor a unicorn?¿ Pound bound… did I say that out loud?¿
Searching $35 seed packs for a keeper is the equivalent of going to the pound for breeding stock of dogs. So why keep doing that grow after grow. Oh yeah those beans are cheap. What’s not cheap is the resources that it takes to complete a grow. So do that several times only to end up in a worse breeding situation than where you started because someone told you that’s a gelato, oreoz, or gg4 cross. Then why aren’t they growing it. Better yet, why aren’t they growing it any more.
For real, even if you did find something nice deep within the pile of cross breeds, it will take you even longer than it took to get luck, to get lucky again and produce something that just as nice as the original find.
That’s something we all know. Well those who do actual breedings know. But for some reason, those who are buying experimental seed packs, can’t figure this concept out and understand that breeding doesn’t work like that.
Do enough breedings and you don’t have to wonder why they produce bx1. I see some go all the way up to bx 3. It’s done to make that find better. So how great could it have been id breeder is still adding other crosses to it. F1 with a 1,000 phenos. And very few of them worth growing.
I take that back, because they grow awesomely, however the don’t smoke worth a flip. Still searching, still crossing, and back crossing and s1’ing. For that ever elusive unicorn. That marketing game better be on fleet. Oops.
It takes hard work and dedication to create great strains. It also takes a lot planning and as well as plant knowledge. Which should include more than where a plant comes from or at what altitude it grows at.
For instance, a plant growing high up in the kush mountains would have a very short growing season, thus making said plants very small, as well as very fast so that it complete its life cycle before harsh weather moves in. Said plant would also be purple due to reduced metabolism caused by the colder temperatures. I’m will to guarantee that it wouldn’t look dank…
Try this one. What happened when you light deprive an equatorial strain?¿ Don’t know? Try it and see.
Wanna know if you are smoking a pure sativa? Are you waiting 45 minutes for you high to kick in. Of course not, because most people aren’t willing to wait that long to feel the effects of the bud. As stated by DJ Short said in the now infamous pot cast where he also said that blueberry was originally an auto flower.
He also made another very important comment in that same pot cast that makes it very worth checking out. It’s good reference material for anyone who plans to be serious about breeding cannabis.
How can one be out chasing unicorns when they don’t even know what one looks like, or where it lives, or what it eats. It makes no sense or me,
However, if you say it’s an unicorn, who am I not to believe you. Especially since you say that they are all over the place. Must be a new type of non magical unicorn that everyone is raging about. You know, the boring 15 min to 2 hr one dimensional buzz where more time is spent smoking than enjoying the fruits of one’s labor. Good night. Or should I say good morning.
[/QUOTE

Yo dude are you talking to me? I appreciate the message and theory but that delivery is written in pure "drunk uncle shits on Thanksgiving with unrighteous anger again" energy.

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Cannaclysmic Events said:

I suppose my original question really centered around something like the Chem plants. Is it really just an outlier in standard deviation that what, 4 bag seeds were so righteous they became breeding stock for just about everything at some point in it's lineage? Or the happy accident that made Gorilla Glue? I'm sure there are more examples. I often wonder how many strains were just different phenos of Northern Lights. At the end of the day it's just a curiosity I have, not worth going drunk uncle over.

As far as dogs go, probably not the best comparison. If I want a def Dalmatian I'll most certainly go to a breeder for pure inbreeding. And I'm definitely going to avoid mutts to get me some hip dysplasia and achalasia in a German Shepherd. Isn't genetic diversity the rule not the exception? The Habsburgs might think so.

There could really only be a few regions in Asia that could possibly have an untouched land race. It spred across the globe because ancient man liked to get right just like us (and rope, I suppose he made some rope too). But regional isolation is certainly the makings of genetic islands, and alot of plants get it on regularly with kin folk, it's not just an Appalachia Gypsy thing. Hybrid Vigor is even considered by some to be an error in observation; mistaken for the positive effects of diversity, the release from inbreeding depression by means of out cross.

Honestly I'm struggling to even care anymore while writing this. However we got here, this is where we are, and I'm gonna go out on a limb and bet I find a heater in three packs of this poly breath cross and a nice bumper crop of head stash. A unicorn? Who knows, maybe, maybe not, probably not. The whole event worth 90 bucks, almost certainly.

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Blutri said:

^^^ for real bro. Don’t forget the boxer, lab, Doberman, bulldog, even the Dachshund. Once great working dog, now nothing bud show pieces what have breed into statues. All the do is eat, crap, and cost you a lot at the vet.
In many ways, the same has been done to cannabis.
For real I only used the mutt as reference that hopefully cannabis breeders could relate too.
I’m wasn’t meant to be nitpicked.
Believe me when I say that I know some mutts that will outperform the most expensive akc dogs that are being passed off as purebred.
The akc breeders will change dogs in order to generate more money than the next breeder. Those guys/gals don’t have time to do field trials or do real word functions. Everything concerning them is always staged. And always about money. In that way, they are very much like commercial cannabis. Its surprising how many people don’t see it.
Like brother above who mentioned the breath. If breath does it for you, then by all means enjoy yourself. I’m an old school stoner with an old school stoner attitude. We don’t really care much about what others have to say about us. Your vibe is your vibe and we respect that of one another. cool man< That’s real shit.
Unfortunately, there are those who don’t know what that means. Which ain’t very stoner like. Peace bros.

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