Growers beware SUNSHINE MIX#4 is HORRIBLE

I've had 2 successful runs so far using promix for seedlings and transplanting to ocean forest in 5 gallon containers for the remainder of the grow. I've battled a little bit with fungus gnats (super easy to deal with btw), but all in all both harvests were exceptional.

I got mites on my last grow so I thought I'd go ahead and try this sunshine mix #4 which contains peat, perlite, dolomite lime (obviously not enough), and a couple other goodies.

So I'm about 3 weeks into my seedlings and all of a sudden I'm seeing crispy leaves and brown spots which have now affected all 5 plants. Perplexed by this new problem, I started investigating and my the result is that sunshine mix #4 is a piece of crap mix with quality control issues.

After finding several similar threads about this issue on ICMAG....everyone says the same damn thing - check your ph run-off and there's your answer. This shit is so damn acidic that my PH run-off is at 5.0 and I've only fed one damn time so far with 1/4 feeding. Apparently not everyone experiences this problem with the SS#4 but many people are getting hit with a batch of this stuff that is ridiculously acidic.

I still have my receipt and I am promptly returning this shit to the hydro shop this afternoon for an exchange to ocean forest. Live and learn but I'll never buy their product again.

I just found this post....explains everything better than I could.

https://www.rollitup.org/marijuana-plant-problems/266926-sunshine-4-low-runoff-ph-2.html

For each bale of Pro-mix/Sunshine mix, 3.75 cups of dolomitic lime (agricultural lime) should offset the low lime...........most people just don't add enough lime. Peat moss is quite acidic, obviously.

Anything with peat in it can be troublesome in the long run my friend , its all about buffers and control .. Buy a big bag of Dolomite lime and you will have no more worries but then again I recommend you grow with coco once as I doubt you ll go back to peat afterwards ..

it works just fine for me.going on only 2-3 yrs of usein it.
in fact that's all I really use anymore,i have never ph'd anything going in,or comeing out and my plants are just fine.

Anything peat based is like this... If the water going in isn't near 7.0 or above you're going to have a bad time.

ProfessorPotSnob said:

Anything with peat in it can be troublesome in the long run my friend , its all about buffers and control .. Buy a big bag of Dolomite lime and you will have no more worries but then again I recommend you grow with coco once as I doubt you ll go back to peat afterwards ..

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That^^ or chow mix 60/40 coco/hydroton if you are around to water twice a day. Use some enzymes and it is reusable for years.

Yep dolamite lime will help tremendously in keeping that ph balanced.

Thanks for all the responses fellas...this has been a rather unwelcome learning experience in growing with peat. It has to be supplemented with dolomite lime or else you get PH burn and nute lockout. I just went to the dro shop and picked up a couple bags of ocean forest and a little bag of perlite. I never had any significant problem with ocean forest other than a few fungus gnats which is about the easiest pest to rid yourself of, so I will continue to stick with what works for me. I don't have a large enough grow space to do this trial and error stuff allover again, because if I lose an entire harvest, I have to actually buy pot from someone else and jonny is not prepared to go back to that crap.

Its actually a very good product if used properly. Soil growers seem to forget that this is the first step to hydro and its not really soil. A little research on the product and additives can go a long way in not causing problems. I used it for years before moving to Rockwool slabs...sooo much cleaner...Good Luck

Sir.Ganga said:

Its actually a very good product if used properly. Soil growers seem to forget that this is the first step to hydro and its not really soil. A little research on the product and additives can go a long way in not causing problems. I used it for years before moving to Rockwool slabs...sooo much cleaner...Good Luck

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I'll reluctantly agree with you. I do however believe that the company that distributes that product should acknowledge the inherent problems of the product they produce and perhaps inform the growers of the extra needed care that's required to make their product perform as advertised. I will never buy their shit again because I feel deceived and had for a heal b/c they actually acknowledge the ph problem on the link I previously provided, so they know there is a ph problem with what they distribute. There is no reason why they should not be informing their customers that their product may need significant supplementation to reduce the acidity content of their product. They will never have me as a customer again. Viva la ocean forest

ProfessorPotSnob said:

Anything with peat in it can be troublesome in the long run my friend , its all about buffers and control .. Buy a big bag of Dolomite lime and you will have no more worries but then again I recommend you grow with coco once as I doubt you ll go back to peat afterwards ..

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Ive used promix, sunshine mix, metro mix and everything in between but for me coco has been the best medium ive ever used never had a problem with it never even PH the water perfect meds every time love the stuff

Lionden said:

Ive used promix, sunshine mix, metro mix and everything in between but for me coco has been the best medium ive ever used never had a problem with it never even PH the water perfect meds every time love the stuff

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I actually thought sunshine #4 was a coco mix which is my own dumb fault for not reading the ingredients on the bag.

I'm transplanting today into the 5 gallon containers with the ocean forest so hopefully this ph damage would recover quickly in their new 5 gallon homes.

This has me worried...I use ss#4

what should I be looking for in terms of plant appearance?

Ant soil needs to be properly mineralized. I would only use peat and that's all I suggest for a new soil.

jonnynobody said:

.....So I'm about 3 weeks into my seedlings and all of a sudden I'm seeing crispy leaves and brown spots which have now affected all 5 plants. Perplexed by this new problem, I started investigating and my the result is that sunshine mix #4 is a piece of crap mix with quality control issues.

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I seriously doubt if it's the mix. For starts, your crispy leaves and brown spots strongly suggests you over fertilized. I know professional growers (these aren't stoners, but actual commercial horticulturists/growers) who buy pallets of this mix. Any credible manufacturer is gonna balance the pH of their mix, as they've stated here:

The foundation of the growing mix is Canadian Sphagnum peat moss, sustainably harvested from carefully managed bogs in rural Canada. The peat moss is screened to remove large clumps and sticks and is blended with horticultural grade perlite and coir (a by-product of the coconut industry). Peat moss reduces the leaching of nutrients from the growing mix allowing them to release slowly over time. Perlite keeps air spaces open while coir combined with peat allows good water retention. This provides a balance of air and water that results in good root growth and the foundation for good stem and flower growth. Dolomitic lime, a starter organic fertilizer, mycorrhizae and an organic wetting agent are added to complete the mix. Lime adjusts the pH for optimum fertilizer availability; the starter organic fertilizer helps transplants establish; mycorrhizae assists in fertilizer uptake and the organic wetting agent helps peat moss absorb water better.

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http://sunshineadvanced.com/sunshine®-advanced-growing-mix-4-how-its-made

...and....

And…the #1 most-asked question is…

What pH do I want in my indoor growing situation? What is the recommended pH of runoff?
Our Sunshine® Advanced #4 is formulated to stabilize at pH range of 5.8 – 6.2. This is the pH range that nutrients are most available to the plant.

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Begs the question, what foods were you using? Your seedlings don't need additional food now as this mix has a nutrient charge. For starts, seedlings (and late flowering plants) require very little food as opposed to a large plant undergoing the stretch and quickly bulking up.

Good luck,
UB

Ive used ss#4 with no issue's whatsoever, now only switching due to access here to promix, but I only use these as base soils to work with I never buy a bag of soil and think ok kool im good to go from bean pop to harvest! For me its all about going into my tent for at least at 25 minute timeframe EVERYWEEK, to get an idea of how they're doing, there new growth and anything else this fine site has taught me to look or to tend to during vital periods of my ladies lifecycles. Maybe your water is throwing things off? IDK but I do hope things get better for you and by that you find a solution that works for you.

If you are not using large quantities... try Fox Farm Light Warrior. Or, House and Garden/Canna/ReadyGro Coco coir

Both of these work well for seeds. I prefer coco. More moisture retention in those coco brands than the Light warrior.

I've used sunshine #4 in the past. Also the inert #4... Not my favorite, but worked just fine for me.

Uncle Ben said:

I seriously doubt if it's the mix. For starts, your crispy leaves and brown spots strongly suggests you over fertilized. I know professional growers (these aren't stoners, but actual commercial horticulturists/growers) who buy pallets of this mix. Any credible manufacturer is gonna balance the pH of their mix, as they've stated here:


http://sunshineadvanced.com/sunshine®-advanced-growing-mix-4-how-its-made

...and....



Begs the question, what foods were you using? Your seedlings don't need additional food now as this mix has a nutrient charge. For starts, seedlings (and late flowering plants) require very little food as opposed to a large plant undergoing the stretch and quickly bulking up.

Good luck,
UB

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It was a bad batch of their mix plain and simple. I didn't nute the youngin's at all prior to experiencing the ph burn. Since transplanting into 5 gallon containers of ocean forest, the plants have rebounded and are no longer showing signs of ph burn. Thanks for the info though.

HeartlandHank said:

If you are not using large quantities... try Fox Farm Light Warrior. Or, House and Garden/Canna/ReadyGro Coco coir

Both of these work well for seeds. I prefer coco. More moisture retention in those coco brands than the Light warrior.

I've used sunshine #4 in the past. Also the inert #4... Not my favorite, but worked just fine for me.

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I usually start in happy frog or light warrior but I wanted to try my hand at coco this time and mistakenly wound up buying a peat product. That's what happens when ya get in a rush and don't double check shit.