Have I introduced a virus in to my room?

I've had this ongoing problem for awhile. I've tried several solutions, and nothing seems to work. I've been growing for a long time and have never had problems like this.

Back story, back in the early 2000s I acquired a clone that is a legend locally. I ended up losing her, and it's taken me 15 years to reacquire her. I've been growing Katsu Bubba, and a mix of others I grew from seed for many years now.

When I reintroduced the old clone I decided to start running Hempy buckets using PBP for a while, which I've done before with great success, but I keep my mothers in Promix. The old clone had some twisty looking leaves, but generally looked healthy. But gradually it started looking a little unhappy. So I started changing things to see if I could solve it.

I changed lights, I flushed, I changed back from PBP to Jack's Classic, Nothing seems to help. And now it looks like Bubba is doing the same thing the old clone is doing. I'm not seeing any necrosis on the leaves, but any new growth looks all twisted and pointing straight up, and little to no growth. I was running under a 400 watt MH, and I changed to a 6 bank fluorescent with Natural light t8 bulbs. That didn't change anything, so I changed the bulbs to soft white bulbs. Still no change.

This has all happened in my veg. room. Now I'm seeing strange things in my flowering room. A few days ago I noticed a yellowing around the outside of the leave on Bubba that's in the flowering room. I'll attach some images.

Anybody have any ideas what might be happening here?

Have you checked for mites or thrips?

leather lungs said:

Have you checked for mites or thrips?

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Yes, I have a 30x microscope and have gone all of the plants looking for bugs. When I first reacquired the old clone it had spider mites, which I took care of before bringing it in to my grow room.

couple of those pics look like russet damage.not positive

thumper60 said:

couple of those pics look like russet damage.not positive

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I've searched and searched trying to find a solution, and some of the posts I found on Russet mites looked similar to what's happening. I took several leaves from different plants and gave them a thorough going over with my microscope and I can't find any signs of bugs on these at all.

What is your medium? What is your grow style? What is your feed pH? Sounds like you've eliminated pests as a problem.

That's no virus. This will come down to an environmental problem (bugs, temps, etc). I'm not seeing little white dots as you see with spider mite damage. But, if in doubt, get a 30x microscope and examine the under sides of your leaves. You will need one of these come late flowering time anyhow, amazon sells them for around 15$.

Also meant to say, in that last pic I see what looks like obvious N toxicity (leaf tip pointed straight down). This may just be a symptom of the core problem, I'm not sure yet, just thought I'd point it out!

Kndreyn said:

I've searched and searched trying to find a solution, and some of the posts I found on Russet mites looked similar to what's happening. I took several leaves from different plants and gave them a thorough going over with my microscope and I can't find any signs of bugs on these at all.

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from what I understand 30x is not strong enough,i could be wrong

Yup

No you did not introduce a virus in to your room

Thanks for the responses folks. I'm growing in both Hempy buckets with perlite and also running promix for mother plants. I've been growing for decades and have never had a problem like this. I usually just use Jack's Classic (Peters) nutes and have used them since around 2000. I've switched back and forth using PBP when running Hempy buckets and never a problem. This just started happening about 2 months ago, and I've tried everything I can think of to solve it. My temps are in the mid to high 70s fahrenheit, my humidity is around 55 - 60. I'm pumping massive fresh air through the room. The only thing that's different is, I haven't use PBP for a few years. Maybe they've changed?? But even when I switched them back to Jack's Classic, still no improvement. I've flushed and ran straight water for a few days, no change. Mixed a light dose or nutes, no change. I'm really hoping to save this old clone. It took me forever to reacquire it.

thumper60 said:

from what I understand 30x is not strong enough,i could be wrong

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I'll have to look in to this. Here is what I've been using forever.

thumper60 said:

from what I understand 30x is not strong enough,i could be wrong

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Yes ideally you'd want 30x-60x. But 30x will be fine, and I know it's perfect for checking trichomes! I wouldn't order a new one unless you actually have problems identifying whatever you may be looking at under the scope, a bug, trichome, whatever. I have a 30x-60x and rarely go over the 30x for trichomes.

Logan Burke said:

Yes ideally you'd want 30x-60x. But 30x will be fine, and I know it's perfect for checking trichomes! I wouldn't order a new one unless you actually have problems identifying whatever you may be looking at under the scope, a bug, trichome, whatever. I have a 30x-60x and rarely go over the 30x for trichomes.

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Yeh, when I bought the one I have, I ordered another one also. I can't remember but it was more powerful. I gave it to a friend because it was too hard to see with it. Just too much magnification for what I needed. I've gone over the leaves of several plants with the 30x. In fact I just came back from looking again, and I can't find anything on these. Very puzzling.

Yes higher magnification means waaay more messing around with focus...plenty enough of that at 30x zoom! I'm being pulled in 2 directions with the symptoms of your plants...on one hand, potassium deficiency can give the very outer, jagged edges a burned-type hue, such as yours. Heres some good info and pics on that: https://www.growweedeasy.com/potassium-deficiency-cannabis
Then I sort of also think of nutrient burn with leaves that dark green. If it were my own personal plants, I'd cut back on nitrogen and try to add just a little more of a PK booster. If symptoms ease off and stop progressing, you know you've found the issue. And if it doesn't, one more thing's crossed off. I'm thinking that this isn't a bug problem...just my opinion though.

Logan Burke said:

Yes higher magnification means waaay more messing around with focus...plenty enough of that at 30x zoom! I'm being pulled in 2 directions with the symptoms of your plants...on one hand, potassium deficiency can give the very outer, jagged edges a burned-type hue, such as yours. Heres some good info and pics on that:
Then I sort of also think of nutrient burn with leaves that dark green. If it were my own personal plants, I'd cut back on nitrogen and try to add just a little more of a PK booster. If symptoms ease off and stop progressing, you know you've found the issue. And if it doesn't, one more thing's crossed off. I'm thinking that this isn't a bug problem...just my opinion though.

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I probably shouldn't have posted the pics of the jagged edged plant. That one is in flowering and has just developed that issue over the last 3 or 4 days. The twisted leaf issue is in the veg room and has been going on for a couple of months. I really appreciate the help in identifying the problems.