How common are herms?

oodawg said:

Close up of that node. Also found one that had opened.

View attachment 5107235View attachment 5107237

Click to expand...

Balls. Pluck them and keep growing. You might end up with a few seeds. No big deal.

mudballs said:

I saw this post once from meangene on IG...somehow hermies came up and he said "i used to sweat that stuff and then i realized all i can do is grow them out and if it doesn't happen there's nothing else i can do"
I personally do not stress test, but im leaning hard on the fact i grow outdoors. I know what a bad trait is so just gonna elem when it happens. Not sure how far an indoor needs to be taken, they're already under suprabiological life cycle. Shit id call that a stress test on its own to survive.

Click to expand...

Yeah indoors isnt great for plants apart from the ones that cant survive anywhere else each to there own i just think if your gonna breed with it u wanna use the best you can

I should emphasis i mean the heavy feed regime, super intense lights, that actually is some brute force tactics being deployed, so no hermie, no worry. Ok this guys getting hermies often? Time to kill off the line and start anew.

oodawg said:

My first indoor grow with feminized seeds. The plants are really impressing me finishing up 2 weeks of flower. All plants are already frosting up and have been praying everyday. Going through the plants over the last week though and I found at least 1 or 2 male flowers or balls on each plant. Pollen sack didn't open yet. They were all down low on some scraggly larfy branches.

I did leave my plants for 4 days on week 2 of 12/12. I made a gravity drip system and cracked it open to water them while I was gone. Came back and the plants were kicking ass but I'm sure it wasn't ideal not sure if I just flooded the hell out of them for a day ND a half and they dried back or what.

Either way I'm sure it's something I did and not just genetics as I found one on every plant, 4 different breeders. Just wondering how common people find a male flower or two on their indoor grows? These plants have been doing great compared to my outdoor last year which took a beating in the desert out here but I never found any herms in my outdoor. Is the larfy chit herming because the light just isn't doing it down there?

Click to expand...

I'm curious what you were feeding the plants and if you used any additives and if so what they were. It's odd that it would happen on 4 plants from 4 different breeders.

xtsho said:

Balls. Pluck them and keep growing. You might end up with a few seeds. No big deal.

Click to expand...

That's the plan and I'm sure I'll end up with some seeds after seeing that one had opened. I just wish I could figure out what happened to cause them. I'm sure it's something I did as it happened to all 4 plants.

Could it happen from wind damage? Maybe from when I was gone and they got over watered or dried back too much?

xtsho said:

I'm curious what you were feeding the plants and if you used any additives and if so what they were. It's odd that it would happen on 4 plants from 4 different breeders.

Click to expand...

Heres the mix I made, plants are in 4 gallon pots...
Soil:
10 gallons sphagnum peat miss
5 gal ewc
5 gal big rootz organic
10 gallons volcanic rock and clay pebbles
1 gallon biochar
Dr earth Homegrown 1/2c per 5 gal= 3 cups
Dr earth flower girl 1/4c

Mostly Water only with occasional Epsom salt one tsp per gal. Each plant drinks a but more than a half gallon ever other day. Top dressed with DE to try to help with gnats, probably used a bit too much. Top dressed with flower girl a week ago or so, maybe I did that too early or it was unnecessary.

oodawg said:

Heres the mix I made, plants are in 4 gallon pots...
Soil:
10 gallons sphagnum peat miss
5 gal ewc
5 gal big rootz organic
10 gallons volcanic rock and clay pebbles
1 gallon biochar
Dr earth Homegrown 1/2c per 5 gal= 3 cups
Dr earth flower girl 1/4c

Mostly Water only with occasional Epsom salt one tsp per gal. Each plant drinks a but more than a half gallon ever other day. Top dressed with DE to try to help with gnats, probably used a bit too much. Top dressed with flower girl a week ago or so, maybe I did that too early or it was unnecessary.

Click to expand...

You shouldn't need or use Epsom salt in that mix

Herb & Suds said:

You shouldn't need or use Epsom salt in that mix

Click to expand...

Alright I'll cut that out

oodawg said:

Heres the mix I made, plants are in 4 gallon pots...
Soil:
10 gallons sphagnum peat miss
5 gal ewc
5 gal big rootz organic
10 gallons volcanic rock and clay pebbles
1 gallon biochar
Dr earth Homegrown 1/2c per 5 gal= 3 cups
Dr earth flower girl 1/4c

Mostly Water only with occasional Epsom salt one tsp per gal. Each plant drinks a but more than a half gallon ever other day. Top dressed with DE to try to help with gnats, probably used a bit too much. Top dressed with flower girl a week ago or so, maybe I did that too early or it was unnecessary.

Click to expand...

I was just curious if you were using some bottled proprietary Bloom Blaster or something with unknown ingredients But you're not.

It is interesting to note that both of those fertilizers you're using contain 6% humic acid and both have a decent amount of kelp in them as well. Both are biostimulants. Probably nothing but over the years male inflorescences seem to be occurring more and more on plants as has the use of both kelp and humic products has increased. I'm not saying that's the cause. It's just something I've been thinking about for awhile along with other additives that have started to be more widely used that have benefits but also potentially some unwanted side effects as well.

I'm not in any way saying that would be the cause. I just look at things that have changed when troubleshooting anything. With cannabis the fertilizers people are using have changed significantly over the years to include substances that were not used before. But also with more people growing more opportunity for things to occur. It would take a lot of time and resources to prove or disprove any wild idea going through my mind and would require those more knowledgeable than me.

Pluck and grow is all you can do.

Apologies for your very fascinating pheno/hermie and for being wrong. Much better pics.

And I’m being sincere, or maybe a bit stoned, but that is a unique and fascinating hermie you got… maybe buy a lotto ticket.

Herms suck. It has caused me many months of wasted time, money & energy. Lately with bills going up I'm keeping my tried & true genetics.

I haven't seen any more since I trimmed them all up and cut out all the culprits. The plants have been happier with the increased airflow. I have been watering daily plain tap water. I think I was letting the plants go too long with inconsistent watering practices. I actually saw under one of the plants on top on the soil a couple of aborted unopened pollen sacs. Almost like when a pepper plant aborts a flower if it's not ready.

I'm chalking it up to a few things, inconsistent watering practices. My diy drip irrigation got me through a long weekend but I know it wasn't ideal. One plant showed damage on my return in clawing leaves. Not sure if it was from overwatering or too dry. Room is also controlled with a window ac/heat. I left the heat on as the first 2 days of the trip were below freezing to ~45. The last 2 days of the trip were around 70 and I know that Room was cooking with the light on.

So poor watering practices, poor airflow, and high heat. I think we're back on track now and the girls are happy and hopefully no longer confused.

If there are some seeds will they be feminized as well? If the herm was cause by stress and not a strong genetic tendency, will the next generation be more susceptible?

I few balls isn’t the end of the world. If it’s all
Over id chop and move on. I’ve only had to do that with two plants, they were from the same pack.

Overall they found 5%-10% hermied. Requires reading and re-reading for me. Some interesting information.

As to humic acid it’s included in this study. But it’s a deeper project and all should read this one.

“
In the present study, the effects of N, P, K, and humic acid supplementation on medical cannabis were studied. While the relationship between cannabinoid content and nutritional supplementation is not clear, the connection is probably a complex relationship involving a number of related parameters including nutrient availability, plant biosynthetic conditions, and other environmental and physiological signals.
Overall, the nutritional supplements significantly reduced cannabinoid variability throughout the plant, demonstrating the importance of developing agro-techniques for standardization of the chemical profile in the cannabis inflorescences. Most importantly, these results demonstrate the potential of environmental factors including mineral nutrition for regulating the concentrations of specific secondary metabolites in defined locals in the cannabis plant.”


Thank goodness for the Israelis in cannabis research.

hotrodharley said:

As to humic acid it’s included in this study. But it’s a deeper project and all should read this one.

“
In the present study, the effects of N, P, K, and humic acid supplementation on medical cannabis were studied. While the relationship between cannabinoid content and nutritional supplementation is not clear, the connection is probably a complex relationship involving a number of related parameters including nutrient availability, plant biosynthetic conditions, and other environmental and physiological signals.
Overall, the nutritional supplements significantly reduced cannabinoid variability throughout the plant, demonstrating the importance of developing agro-techniques for standardization of the chemical profile in the cannabis inflorescences. Most importantly, these results demonstrate the potential of environmental factors including mineral nutrition for regulating the concentrations of specific secondary metabolites in defined locals in the cannabis plant.”

Frontiers | Impact of N, P, K, and Humic Acid Supplementation on the Chemical Profile of Medical Cannabis (Cannabis sativa L)

Mineral nutrition is a major factor affecting plant growth and function. Increasing evidence supports the involvement of macro and micronutrients in secondar...

www.frontiersin.org

Thank goodness for the Israelis in cannabis research.

Click to expand...

That is a good read. Pretty wild too. The crazy thing is these are the best looking plants I've ever grown, minus the balls. I am going to have to rethink my mix, and try to eliminate the humic acid going forward. It was nice and simple with the premix complete amendments but I think I'll go something closer to coots amendments next time.

oodawg said:

That is a good read. Pretty wild too. The crazy thing is these are the best looking plants I've ever grown, minus the balls. I am going to have to rethink my mix, and try to eliminate the humic acid going forward. It was nice and simple with the premix complete amendments but I think I'll go something closer to coots amendments next time.

Click to expand...

I eliminated the humic after reading it decreases THC. But I’m with you. When I was using a fulvic/humic supplement I got bigger buds I think. Watching 7 dry now that didn’t get it once a week.

Nothing you did or didn't do. It's clearly a hybrid leaning heavy towards sativa. When you take into acct. it's a goofy fufu hybrid and leaning strong twords sativa strange stuffs going to happen from time to time. And sativa's can be a handful at times. Those long legged girls can get kind of twisted and have raging hormone issues. The problem now days is the breeders really can't go for long term programs getting to the 4th, 5th, 6th or even 7th run of plant grows for seeds like use to be common place. So there's a lot of young gen crosses out there that can wreck havoc.

Good information @hotrodharley thanks. Good reading material too

I know this is super late but,
OP I've been having similar problems with multiple strains here lately. Those are def balls like you said, I haven't figured out what's causing it, but my temps are good, RH is fine, they get watered every time when they need it, no light leaks, I'm stumped. First grow after my break, I thought maybe I could've caused it bc temps were pretty high for a little bit (HPS), so I chalked it up to learning experience. And had 2 plants out of 6 that didn't herm in that batch (aka pop balls and nanners). Second grow, same breeder, only had a few nanners pop up late in flower (seems to be the norm nowadays??). Third grow, same breeder diff strains each time btw, all 6 have balls popping up on every node almost, with some calyxes sprinkled in. These were slightly stressed super early in veg by over fert, but this was 7-8 weeks from when that happened until balls popped. I'm kind of at a point now where I'm almost convinced its just the slut mutt genetics todays strains are made with. Not knocking anyone's genetics but idk what it could be. I'm not a perfect grower but I have grown a good bit of fem seeds in Wayyyyy less than perfect conditions and never had issues with male flowers on female plants. Nowadays I'm damn near growing in a lab and cant get my plants to NOT herm..