How far can "ripeness" be pushed?

Must be a U.S.-university regarding yourknowledge. No wonder. In germany you would have been sent to the special school for such level of ignorance.
Im arrogant, but you are ignorant ;=) "Understand the photoylases"
I only reepeat that from know on... until you learned what it means! Mister proffessor!

Lockedin said:

Probly right.
Guess I've been running hot lately.

One thing (among MANY) I've learned from all of my weed endeavors - generosity.

I usually leave any visit with at least one Mason jar.

I'm PROUD to say that last year was the first time that I returned one of their Mason jars filled with my weed!

My family friends and neighbors all get that from me - I can't think of any tokers that leave my house empty handed.
This is a big part of why I grow!

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Great vibe and that the exactly y I grow also .This wonder plant is meant to be shared to friends and family I not saying give everything out but the littlest amount would still easy one stressd

These claim yours that you would need 280nm...

Still they admit that UVA enhaces and lowers the amount of UVB needed to trigger the effect...

I say you dont need UVB at all, to trigger the response of the phytolyase increasing the trics... you want all the spectrum from 365 up to 420nm-... yes... also the exotic-violet 420/430 are important to trigger the secondary metabolites.... actually the white spectrum lacking 400-435 completely... no matter you add up UVA... you would need all of it.... the more you get down the spectrum, the less intensity is needed. When you have 430, have 405, have 395, have 385, have 365... YOU DEFINETLY DONT need UVB too to have EVERY secondary metabolites plus the THC higher too... because it absorbs that radiation too, not only UVB, and that UVA radiation is triggering more trics too! SIMPLE AS THAT

UVB cant replace 430, 405,395, 385,375.... but THOSE drive the metabolites, the flavonoids, the terpenes, and the THC higher.... needless to extra introduce tiny right intensity of UVB when you already have all of them other that drive it max.... that doesnt give shit extra anymore using additional UVB on the farest end of the spectrum... wich is by fact damaging growth!

CheGueVapo said:

Must be a U.S.-university regarding yourknowledge. No wonder. In germany you would have been sent to the special school for such level of ignorance.
Im arrogant, but you are ignorant ;=) "Understand the photoylases"
I only reepeat that from know on... until you learned what it means! Mister proffessor!

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Welcome to my ignore list, your royal rudeness.

Thats what ignorant people do... they ignore! Thanks for proving my initial statement!

Instead of ignoring each other, isn't this something that should rather easily be detectable when you actually grow plants?

If the effect is actually strong enough for this to be useful, we don't even need German Universities, can test it ourselves.

What I'd like to know is, which wavelengths have been proven to work, and in what amounts and when during the grow.

Its about people looking for the "one" wavelength.... but there is no such...
Look what the sun does:

See how tiny UVB is? Itls relatively so small.... that its energeticly nearly irrelevant.... except for the damage it does!
Therefore it is IN-effective


The people ignore... that the THC and resin is product of synthesis that requires energy. This process needs a lot of energy! In nature it comes from this range 300-430, UVB is simply not enough.... thats what the plant learned to react to the sun-levels, its there sensor... whenthere is high UVA, the plant assumes that there is also high damaging UVB... and that triggers, not the UVB damaging itself.... the UVA-photons energy drive the resin to protect from the UVB! Thats the correct order of how it works!

this range 300-430, is exactly what all LED-lamps LACK completely..... just ignoring... just ignorance! WHY?

How could you believe having nothing, just not a single micromole in the HOLE UVA range between the UVB and Royalblue could be fine! How can you BELIEVE that?

You have the choice between two triggers....
The damagingtrigger (UVB)
Or the repairing trigger (UVA)
You can take both... but ONE is enough to raise THC... pick wisely! What you pick? Damage or repair or both?

I choose repair for same time better grow and more MASS with MORE THC! Not less mass with more THC!

People think UVB can get them a shortcut, but it does not work this way! The energy for the resin-protection drives from the UVA-photons when there are high.... to protect from high UVB..... just damaging them with UVB without having the repair radiations energy to drive the resin synthezing is senseless.

It is more effective to have multiple wavelength for the hole range from 360 up to 430... that increases ALL secondary metabolites and also THC PLUS this is aiding the growth... far more than UVB can ever drive, thats not aiding the growth but damaging it...
You cant go high UVB energy.. because it is DAMAGING! No energy of any UVB-photon is used by plants.... they speculate about the evidence for some magic switch... but where should come the energy from.... from the black leaves you produce with high UVB? Fine do it, try it! Than you have more THC on a sick plant, wohoo, because you forgat the UVA-repair-radiation, haha.... UVA does not damage instead with moderate intensity.... like you see... like the sun!

UVB without UVA does not work... only damaging. So picking only UVB was thewrong decision.... plants dead, with UVB,you must have UVA too...
but UVA without UVB DOES work! Promoting metabolites and THC....

You dont need to be genius to see it... just start forgetiing about UVB and finally take a look and try at UVA.... you wont be disappointed from THAT.

It's good old mother natures recipe... i dont argue with someone who thinks beeing "employed at a university" is a qualification..... what beeing employed, cleaning the windows... emptying thetrashbins or cleaning the WC? Cant be anything else. He is not even able to argue upon UVA... he put me on ignore, not me him! I repeat, i am arrogant, but he is ignorant!

The theory that UVB is neccessary under artificial lighting to grow more THC is just false....this is NOT the way nature operates. The hole myth only exists because someone found a correlation between the UVB and the habitate where it naturally grows higher THC..... but theres more UVA too! This doesn't fit their BIAS, so they IGNORE IT and keep on trying prroving what UVB might do... simply ignoring UVA at ALL

They try to proof it since the 70s that there is a beneficial effect, it's more like a religion... but still it's not true! It's just damaging!

In fact its the same story than with MMS chlordioxine....suuuure it aids you, its help you, triggers your imune system, cleanse heavy metals out of you, but only in your imagination... by making you sick befor making you a popstar. Same argue they bring for the UVB theory.....

They claim +17% more THC with UVB but that they really mean is that a 15% THC strain before was now measured with 17,55% THC... lol thats their proof for UVB aiding, thats an increase of 17%... only really increased +2,55 percent-points lol... while the guys from Anesia grow 37% THC weed with the UVAs and get rich by tricking you its the strain, just buy it and you have it... NOOOOOO you need the UVA... not the UVB lulz and buying the strain is not enough.

Enough words wasted.

I have never used a UVA bulb, but I do consider Horticulture Lighting Group (HLG) one of the industry leaders for building amazing LED lights. They offer a UVA attachment for their HLG 550, HLG 600 Rspec, HLG 650R, Scorpion Rspec, and Scorpion Diablo lights. However from reading about it they use 365nm and 385nm chips.

Definitely something worth looking into in the future. Especially since you can have it on another timer.

CheGueVapo said:

The chemical splitting of 2 hydrogen from 2hydrogene with1 oxygene, called "water", via light, called "photosythesis"

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Whoa! again. first with the Socratic philosophy, now with the chemistry?

what's next? quantum field dynamics of resinous spin particles at the plank scale, and how they interact with vibrating strings that produce energy fluctuations in the Higgs field, which in turn produces psycho-concious dissipation effects in human synaptic neuron transfer after
Tetrahydrocannabinol molecules have passed through the blood/brain barrier?
looking forward to it.

No word back from urbandictionary, I don't think my definition was politically correct enough for them. Shoulda been approved already but cuckerbergs run the show now.

Token Dankies said:

No word back from urbandictionary, I don't think my definition was politically correct enough for them.

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I think that's not the reason unless you have crossed certain lines.

Their "review" should be nothing more than a quick check if the entry makes sense at all. Let's wait a few more days.

there's a considerable amount of consolidated information on light systems and light absorption in this post (that you would otherwise have to look up from multiple different source over several days), along with good open debate and opinions. <two thumbs up> count your blessings that we all live in countries and at a time when information like this can be shared, and that we have open forums like this.

phrygian44 said:

there's a considerable amount of consolidated information on light systems and light absorption in this post (that you would otherwise have to look up from multiple different source over several days), along with good open debate and opinions. <two thumbs up> count your blessings that we all live in countries and at a time when information like this can be shared, and that we have open forums like this.

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Seriously, when my delivery gets here I will spark up a big hooter in your name. Got some Mother Tongue drying right now that I won't give myself the opportunity to taste early cause I wanna enjoy her in all her glory.

ComputerSaysNo said:

I think that's not the reason unless you have crossed certain lines.
Their "review" should be nothing more than a quick check if the entry makes sense at all. Let's wait a few more days.

Click to expand...

i think the entire weight of RollItUp needs to bear down on UDic, as we use this word in our forum (3 occurrences in the last two days, if I'm not mistaken), and need a direct, definitive, definite definition if we are to understand what it means and use it correctly.
; )

Avoid Alliteration, Always

Slartibart4242 said:

Definitely something worth looking into in the future.

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Must correct you: Definitely something worth looking into NOW. DIY dont need to wait for commercial products, dont need to wait for scientific detailed proof and explanation about how this at that, what counts is only one thing: In practice, in THE FIELD, it turns out to work. Thats proof enough to have it... now, dont wait until you are last one getting it

Usually anyone who fidns out, shuts the fuck up.
Breeders are silent, just getting the laboratory prrof for their new high thc strain... but they know it but are silent about HOW to do it, of course, because its their business interest. They are in advance, ahead the others. Why should they tell everyone?

So if you want a proof anddont believe all the peopl that tell you UVA is working.... you must wait for bugbee connecting the dot and delivering the stochastic approval and for lamp manufactures to bring it to you.-... hey just wait another 5 years until market integration, cool bro! I dont need to wait that! I find out myself in the field practicing!

@PJ Diaz

The UV4Plants managing committee

Prof. Gareth Jenkins (President), Glasgow University, U.K.
Prof. Éva Hideg (Vice-President), University of Pécs, Hungary.
Prof. Marcel Jansen (Former President), University College Cork, Ireland.
Dr. Frauke Pescheck (Secretary), Christian-Albrechts-Universität zu Kiel, Kiel, Germany.
Prof. Susanne Neugart (Treasurer), Georg-August-Universität Göttingen, Göttingen, Germany.
Dr. Justyna Łabuz (Communications Officer), Jagiellonian University, Kraków, Poland.
Dr. Gyula Czégény (ESR member), University of Pécs, Hungary.
Dr. Qing-Wei WANG (overseas member), Chinese Academy of Sciences (CAS), Shenyang, China.
Prof. Javier Martínez Abaigar (member), Universidad de La Rioja, Spain.
Dr. Shyam Pariyar (member), University of Bonn, Germany.

Instead of just coming up with this Association "to read" i would have been better if you had posted a conrete issue to read and not some general blabla of them without sources links mentioned, just some text and claims without scientific measure.

For example why haven't you posted this link of them:

It contains a lot of good information from a scientific standpoint, and i dint meant to undermine these guysimportant work.

They are just not in the field because they are not the crop gardeners, neither are they the lamp-manufacturers. They miss view from those perspectives.

I just say introducing the ALL the chips 370nm, 385nm, 395nm, 405nm and 430nm is MORE than just enough to rise the secondary metabolites and the cannabinoids to lot higher stake, than you can at all only do by adding just UVB to a standard royalblue-pumped white.... because that Lamp still would miss the complete range from 360-420... not a single photon. But THAT range is the repair radiation range with energy aids the photolyases process AND the photosynthesis too. Its facts... these information of them in detail proof it! Theres a lot of talking about the "blue" spectrum... and they dont mean just royalblue..... youcant just add up more ands more royalblue and ignore the range 400-430.... thats a third of the visible blue range, actually missing any photons in LED-grow lights, not talking about the near end of UVA at all...... that photons aid the photosynthesis... bugbee sees that, because somespecies found to take high use of it in grow chamber... now think about helmp/cannbis a high intense light plant. Of course it does take use of it... the hole resin is in fact an absorber for just this reason... to catch that energy and take use of it to protect the seeds from UVB and the UVA too.

Im sorry that this is just field knowledge, working in the field with plants, constructing lamps for the field.... and my claim is: Forget about the UVB, think about yourself security first!!!... get UVA/deepblue emission well raisingly balanced like the sun intensities before you think about UVB first! If you got that... then try with additional UVB... im FINE with that and i recommend you to not make any mistakes at any time with your high intensity cancer beamers! Otherwise... Just dont cry if shit happens, in the FIELD with your actual crop and with your SKIN and EYES! You have only one life! One skin and two pair of eyes... there is NO REPLACEMENT parts.

Just that... see the BIG PICTURE of it all, like me! These professors dont see it... sorry! They just trying to proof the theories the have in mind with their clues in theories.... they are not practisioning crop growers, they are not manufacturing of lamps, and they are not the doctors in the hospitals aiding the patients, the victims of themselves stupidity regarding experementing this kind of radiation, UVB.... but I am, i learned lessons, and I am experienced with my DIYs and high intensity cannabis grows over decades, i had anything HPS, DIY-HP-Monos, then DIY-COBs plus monos, then strips plus monos... and anytime I add up another range of deepblue or UVA a chip... it improves! the resin, the smell. They are just scientists and mathematics looking for a quick-cheat proofing with evidens theres angenetic trigger on UVB.... fuck that shit.... because EVEN IF THATS CORRECT but just adding a little bit of UVB does not work without having the UVA/deepblue energy to protect from that. Than you triggered it but damaging your plant... finally killign it continuing without UVA... thats stupid. Damn you dont need to be genius to understand these processes. They are less a brainer then liming agents and ph buffer capacities

Simple and easy:
Primarily you want UVA its a non damaging extra energy delivering TRIGGER. primarily too, you want to protect yourself as thegrower.
If you have that and secured your protection.... then you may want the extra damaging UVB trigger... because you can afford it, since the UVA energy repairs the damage.
If you do so.... stay sober before you open up the box.... "forgetting it beeing so high or stoned" is a NO-GO!!! could lead you to cancer, blindess and finally death! No JOKE! So think about it first!

I'm a wanna-be botanist so, i know how plants absorb light and use photons and photosynthesis and all that, and im an electronic engineer, plus physics is one of my hobbies, so i totally know about emf and spectrum and photonic energy, etc.

what i know absolutely nothing about is how good or how not so good these new led light systems are.
I read all the marketing collateral, and their products all sound so wonderful, and that they know exactly what they're doing, so the bandwidth and intensities of their led's are just perfect for what you need. They even have a couple of extra IR and Blue leds added to the panel, covering every bit of spectrum and energy levels that your plant can ever want.

Again, this i all know and understand - it all makes sense to me.

So what i want to know is, and i know im going to get a backlash for asking such a newbie question on these entry-level products, but i dont have the coin to get these higher-level systems that we've been taking about here, but it's a good question to ask, as there are many newbies and long-term growers that are just transitioning to LEDs that don't know shit about this.

Therefore, how good are these entry-level led panels on Amazoniatron, from Mars Hydro, Spider Farmer and the like?

They seem like industry reputable companies, dedicated to providing exactly what they say they're offering, and the prices are very attractive, with nice, solid, expandable configurations.

So what's the lowdown on these?

Usually they dont state the total System Efficiency or the total radiant Power in Watts only electrical power and Photonefficiency.
Thats not the same.

Most lamps are far below 3 PPE Systemeffiecies, not higher than 60% efficiency. There is better possible with lower currents and lots of chip you can reach higher than 70% efficiency conversing electrical power into PAR radiation the desired spectrum.

Finding out what a commercial LED light is really capable of isn't easy to determine. You need a lot of knowledge and you need data from those lamps.

The Mars panels are well established. Can't say anything bad....

But ALL commercial lamps in my eyes are "not good fixtures", the blackdogs and the migro are the best example for CRAPLAMPS....
not the best chips is the normal, dont caring fixture standard, its just a chipholder, theres plenty of room left for improvement... that you can have TODAY with a DIY!
If you want the best possible, you must build it yourself. They take it slow to exploit you constantly buy new lamps, year by year a little improvement buyable commercially, because the learn slow and the establishing of new tech and ideas takes soooo long to reach the market even if anything is available... FIRST they must sell off their old chips.... but you can get everything today, not relying on those commercialists that are only interested in your money... not into giving you the best lamp! What they sell you tomorrow then whhen you have the best lamp already that keeps up working 90% luminance the next 13 years... they DO NOT WANT THAT ..... only your money! They proceed slow ON PURPOSE! They usually sell "high AMP" ON PURPOSE... you can throw that away after 3 years because lumince decreases significantly :/

I like to create my own LED-lamps from scratch to reach further than anyone except me can imagine.
Follow me crafting a high tech lamp-fixture for a ultraefficiency LED-lampsystem here:

CheGueVapo said:

to reach further than anyone except me can imagine

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I like your ambition!

I stayed always down on the carpet.... it's just my carpet.... it can fly!
Let me try the impossible to find out whats really possible. Limits? Thats not in my vocabulary!