How To: DWC

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theregulator

Member
Hey. I have a quick question concerning an ad I saw about a water pump used for Hydroponic systems. It's a "Supreme-Hydroponics" pump that claims to oxygenate the air while it recirculates. I was wondering if anyone has tried one of these, they're fairly inexpensive if they do the job, but considering the lack of information I've found on them, I'm not so sure.

Here's a link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Supreme-Hydroponics-Utility-Pump-190-GPH-/160953146445?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25798e1c4d

The ad claims:

"Supreme-Hydroponics Pumps Recirculate Nutrient-rich Water and Aerate in One Operation.
These magnetically driven pumps recirculate nutrient-rich water and aerate it through their uniquely engineered venturi action.
Think of it - recirculation and oxygenation all from one energy-efficient pump.
It just makes hydroponics that much easier and enjoyable."

Just curious what everyone's thoughts are about this..


EDIT: Looks like the "Fizzy Farm" also uses a "Venturi" styled pump and seems to get pretty decent reviews, I'm curious how well one of these type pumps would work in say a 4 bucket setup.
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
I have grown in every known hydro method. This is what I learned is wrong with most of them...

Let's say you are using a 5g bucket (see post #295 for pic), the net pot is roughly 14" above the water line, roots are drawn to grow down to reach them. That 14" would be much better served if the nutrients were coming from the top down (lateral roots are important to max growth). This allows for considerable lateral root development (search youtube for Air Pot video).

Now, the big obstacle is the media - rock wool need not apply. I use a combination of lava rock below with a cap of ornamental rock. Lava rock allows for some water retention between feed cycles, as well as being an ideal surface for tiny roots to form and take hold. I feed every 1-2 hours, depending on maturity of root system.

Drop by my thread to see it in action.
 
robbyindy

robbyindy

Member
I've been doin DWC for about three years now. I love it! I stumbled upon this tonight and just wanted to say thanks! This is great info for the beginner.
 
Malevolence

Malevolence

New Member
I have found large net baskets full of hydroton really slow my roots down getting started. 2" net pots with neoprene collars is zero hydroton, zero mess, and the roots hit the water almost immediately. If the faster growth isn't good enough, did I mention it's also cheaper, lighter, no clay balls to wash, no bumping a bucket and spilling hydroton, no little gap in your bucket to squeeze your fat hands into, more water can be used in your 5g bucket resulting in more stability / less topping up.

The roots took forever exploring the big basket of hydroton and after about 5 weeks from seed and the roots still weren't in the DWC res, I got disgusted with the slow growth and switched to collars. Growth resumed as normal.

In my garden - in DWC, smaller net pots with less hydroton = faster growth. You want the roots in the water, not noodling around in a big 1g basket of rocks.
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
Malevolence I totally agree, having learned the hard way about how long it takes for roots to break free. I switched ~ golf ball size lava rock. It still takes time, but roots are establishing a strong foundation as some cling to the LR.

Having 5 HPA grows, and seeing the difference between those roots (delicate cotton candy like= super efficient) and roots soaking in nutes 24/7 (every pic I have seen they look like overcooked spaghetti), I have been experimenting to find a way so that the majority of the roots do not make it into the nutes.

Again, taking a page from HPA, when the air space between the nutes and the bottom of the lid are properly oxygenated, the space is loaded with nutrients, and the plant grows just fine. Will look for pic of roots, but may have deleted it.

Here's the plant I grew this way. She was 43" tall, ~ 8" was naked stalk, so ~ 35" of buds

Pic 1 is 15L/m using 4 OXY air stones. When I harvested her, less than 2" was below the water line. This grow I am using 3g buckets, so more height above the water line to adjust. As root mass grows I lower the level to a point. Still want ~1g of nutes. See pic 4 for roots after 3 weeks. Pic 5; the plant on the right is that plant

IMG_1304.jpgIMG_1536.jpgIMG_1533.jpgIMG_1561.jpgIMG_1559.jpg
 
swazzy420

swazzy420

Member
Yea first time grower here was thing of the exact same set up for mine. I was pretty medicated the other day though and got to thinking about how to keep the res temp at bay. SO this is it what if you cut holes out the top of a water cooler and used that as the dwc?
 
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TokinAllDay

Member
If i have limited space than I should just use soil and not do a DWC then right. I only have a 28" height in my grow box so is that not worth it even with a SCROG setup
 
O

onebaddoc

New Member
swazzy420 said:
Yea first time grower here was thing of the exact same set up for mine. I was pretty medicated the other day though and got to thinking about how to keep the res temp at bay. SO this is it what if you cut holes out the top of a water cooler and used that as the dwc?
Click to expand...
I was thinking along those same lines. Trying to find a cheap igloo cooler or maybe experimenting with some sort of insulation on whichever container I end up using.
 
Malevolence

Malevolence

New Member
Coolers are great... They have these at walmart right now and they make a good setup for DWC cloning and seedlings. For flower I wouldn't want to run less than 5g buckets for stand-alone DWC buckets because of ph stability and nutrient balance. Two gallon buckets are like balancing a broom on your finger; 3.5g buckets are the same diameter as 5g so all you lose is a couple inches of height... so that crosses out most cheap/small coolers. For 5g buckets, you can either go the gatorade cooler route at about $50 a piece... or insulate plain 5g buckets. If you can afford or find 5g-13g coolers then that would be my choice for individual DWC containers. However, I insulate my buckets with 3 layers of silver bubble wrap (Reflectix @ Home Depot). A roll is going to run you about $15 and you can only do like 2 (three layered) buckets with a roll; works very well. I also have a 30 gallon coleman cooler that is great for a res, but I currently just run DWC.

These seedlings are 7 days from when I dropped the seeds in a shot glass of water (red = sunshine daydream | blue = blue og). Previously I had been using rockwool, so I was surprised to see I already have roots. Normally in rockwool with rootbastic, I wasn't getting roots for about 2 weeks. I picked up a 50 bag of GH rapid rooters and they kick ass so far, although I do have some concern about the "organic" material in the rapid rooters causing problems later down the road, it is a very small concern with bennies.

20130707_213501.jpg

roots are white as paper despite the color in the picture (running 150w hps until payday)
20130707_213345.jpg

Reflectix
 
T

twistedwords

Well-Known Member
theregulator said:
Hey. I have a quick question concerning an ad I saw about a water pump used for Hydroponic systems. It's a "Supreme-Hydroponics" pump that claims to oxygenate the air while it recirculates. I was wondering if anyone has tried one of these, they're fairly inexpensive if they do the job, but considering the lack of information I've found on them, I'm not so sure.

Here's a link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Supreme-Hydroponics-Utility-Pump-190-GPH-/160953146445?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25798e1c4d

The ad claims:

"Supreme-Hydroponics Pumps Recirculate Nutrient-rich Water and Aerate in One Operation.
These magnetically driven pumps recirculate nutrient-rich water and aerate it through their uniquely engineered venturi action.
Think of it - recirculation and oxygenation all from one energy-efficient pump.
It just makes hydroponics that much easier and enjoyable."

Just curious what everyone's thoughts are about this..


EDIT: Looks like the "Fizzy Farm" also uses a "Venturi" styled pump and seems to get pretty decent reviews, I'm curious how well one of these type pumps would work in say a 4 bucket setup.
Click to expand...

This is called Venturi Jet Injection and has been used for at least a century. It is used in sewer treatment to inject oxygen into the water molecules and is the only way to enrich H2O with more Oxygen molecules grouped together. Here is a cool video link to show you how it works. You could turn a RDWC with a simple attachment in each intake to do this and you wouldn't need air bubblers anymore. There is a catch though and you need a strong pump that can last as it diminishes the life of the pump if it is weak as it has to work harder. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4czczYnuM_w
 
T

twistedwords

Well-Known Member
Malevolence said:
Coolers are great... They have these at walmart right now and they make a good setup for DWC cloning and seedlings. For flower I wouldn't want to run less than 5g buckets for stand-alone DWC buckets because of ph stability and nutrient balance. Two gallon buckets are like balancing a broom on your finger; 3.5g buckets are the same diameter as 5g so all you lose is a couple inches of height... so that crosses out most cheap/small coolers. For 5g buckets, you can either go the gatorade cooler route at about $50 a piece... or insulate plain 5g buckets. If you can afford or find 5g-13g coolers then that would be my choice for individual DWC containers. However, I insulate my buckets with 3 layers of silver bubble wrap (Reflectix @ Home Depot). A roll is going to run you about $15 and you can only do like 2 (three layered) buckets with a roll; works very well. I also have a 30 gallon coleman cooler that is great for a res, but I currently just run DWC.

These seedlings are 7 days from when I dropped the seeds in a shot glass of water (red = sunshine daydream | blue = blue og). Previously I had been using rockwool, so I was surprised to see I already have roots. Normally in rockwool with rootbastic, I wasn't getting roots for about 2 weeks. I picked up a 50 bag of GH rapid rooters and they kick ass so far, although I do have some concern about the "organic" material in the rapid rooters causing problems later down the road, it is a very small concern with bennies.

View attachment 2729371

roots are white as paper despite the color in the picture (running 150w hps until payday)
View attachment 2729372

Reflectix
Click to expand...


You will have issues later down the road with rapid rooters, been there done that. I do like your design with the neoprene, I never thought of that before. I do wonder though how are you going to stabilize them when they get bigger and you have to remove the neoprene? Are you just going to surround the 2.5 inch pot inside with hydroton when you move them into a bigger net pot?
 
Malevolence

Malevolence

New Member
They stay in the 2" collars and net pots until harvest. You can support it with a scrog tomato cage pull ties string etc. Same way you would support branches not strong enough to hold up the bud. What probs did you have with rapid rooters?
 
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twistedwords

Well-Known Member
Malevolence said:
They stay in the 2" collars and net pots until harvest. You can support it with a scrog tomato cage pull ties string etc. Same way you would support branches not strong enough to hold up the bud. What probs did you have with rapid rooters?
Click to expand...

Root rot with rapid rooter down the road, it creates the dreaded pythium. it breaks down over time and goes down in the buckets. I have done it twice now and not going to do again as I strayed away from what I know, hence rockwool. I have been trying to think of a way to go completely without rockwool or anything else besides hydroton, but a problem arises with seedling and the large hydroton rocks damaging the roots in the beginning. So you presented to me a solution so thank you. I am going to do an old technique of putting the seedling in the neoprene collars and let them float on the top of the water for 5 days until the roots get a hold in a bubbler mini system. It is what water farmers do in aquaponics. Then transfer them directly to the 6 inch net pots, the roots will be able to handle the rocks then at that stage and now I have a complete non-organic way from beginning to end minus the roots as they are always organic in the system. This should keep everything clean.
 
VoidObject

VoidObject

DWC/Bubbleponics Mod
Hey guys I'm still here.. I still get on and browse the DWC section, this thread especially ;)

Oilfield work leaves me with barely any home time to take care of plants so I can't grow right now.. gotta save up money for growtronix I guess LOL
 
M

MrCopmton734

Member
Thanks VO for this. I had been trying to decide between soil/rockwool/etc etc and some sort of hydroponics setup. Definitely going with the DWC method. It's SOOOO cheap compared to what I would have thought and since I'm already into the aquarium hobby, I have everything pretty much.
 
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tylerdavid

New Member
should i leave my water pump on 24 hours a day or have it come on in 30 min intervals? can you cut the roots if they get to long?
 
*Vegeta

*Vegeta

New Member
Hello guys..

I got a 80cm x 80cm x 160cm tent, 250w hps dimmeable to 400w , two 5 galons Buckets, air pump and air stones.

Im planning to veg a little bit more and do a scrog with it..

Can I use one 4" netpot in each bucket or its too small for my setup??
 
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unclegix

New Member
Hi I leave my pump on 24 hours a day. Make sure you have good quality air stones. This is essential to your success. The large ceramic stones are great and produce a large area of fine bubbles which your pkants will love. I use air valves to regulate the air so all stones get the same amount of air and so I can adjust to produce the nice fine air bubbles that I require. Hope this helps.

Good luck
Unclegix :)

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Rollitup mobile app
 
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