newworldicon
Well-Known Member
Still waiting for someone to disprove the existence of aliens....
If Area 51 Held Aliens At One Time...
- Thread starter Luger187
- Start date
Tenner
Well-Known Member
So your correlating aliens being on earth with the alien investigation from the 50`s and all that by NASA being funded by organisations.
And it gets a little waddled up when you start using terms such as "the elite". Who are the elite? What would there outcome be by doing such things, what happens when they find aliens? If you want to build up a theory, there has to be a point and profits to be made. This is so damn unknown. What if the government wanted to have a look in the 1950`s before sparking off so much attention. Why is the file declassified now? Does that not mean its no longer important?
Well prove the giant spaghetti monster doesn`t exist!
Luger187
Well-Known Member
our earth is a giant mix of 'random' materials. think of how rock deposits are just scattered around. theres one kind ontop another, and another ontop of that. think of all the different elements that we have here on earth.
now... what if the alien planet simply had different elements, formed in different ways? look how different jupiter is, and its pretty damn close. what if they were able to take advantage of these elements, in ways we cannot, simply because we do not have them? what if there is materials that can withstand crazy amounts of heat, or can be turned into an extremely powerful fuel source, or even does things that our physicists dont even dream of?
i think their world would be a lot different than ours, but also has similarities. like liquid water for example.
so it is a possibility that they have crazy technology that we could NEVER get on our own, because we dont have the necessary materials. also, it could work the other way. what if we have elements here that their planet does not? what if they are stuck in a rut technology-wise? we were able to industrialize because of these elements, maybe they cannot even if they had the brains for it.
IMO, there is probably a vast mix of life. some can succeed, some cannot(what is success to them?). their story depends on the materials at hand
now... what if the alien planet simply had different elements, formed in different ways? look how different jupiter is, and its pretty damn close. what if they were able to take advantage of these elements, in ways we cannot, simply because we do not have them? what if there is materials that can withstand crazy amounts of heat, or can be turned into an extremely powerful fuel source, or even does things that our physicists dont even dream of?
i think their world would be a lot different than ours, but also has similarities. like liquid water for example.
so it is a possibility that they have crazy technology that we could NEVER get on our own, because we dont have the necessary materials. also, it could work the other way. what if we have elements here that their planet does not? what if they are stuck in a rut technology-wise? we were able to industrialize because of these elements, maybe they cannot even if they had the brains for it.
IMO, there is probably a vast mix of life. some can succeed, some cannot(what is success to them?). their story depends on the materials at hand
Heisenberg
Well-Known Member
Typical strawman. Science does not make the claim that humans have got all the secrets to the universe locked down.
Here you make a claim without the slightest attempt to explain why you believe it. The best you can do is belittle others for not sharing your belief. If you can not defend your claim with reasonable logic and evidence, then you have no real business putting it on the table.
Smoke doesn't always equal fire, as many years of systematic and careful observation have taught us. I don't see how having more theories makes it easier to discredit all theories. More theories means more time, experimenting, ect, and in fact, the goal of ALL theories, regardless of number, is to prove themselves right by failing to prove themselves wrong. In other words, surviving attempts to discredit is a goal of any theory.
The burden of proof falls to the party making the claim. I can claim there is a unicorn living inside the sun, does it become true until you disprove it?
There is nothing wrong with requiring substance for a belief, having consistent standards for evidence, and asking other to defend against doubt.
Tenner
Well-Known Member
Though you just stated that there are elements/compounds we don`t know of. Its mainly theorietically estimated and making artificial elements have been tried in the lab. Firing particles at noble gasses and forming weird elements have been tried too.
View attachment 1656429
"Stable nuclides, if plotted on a graph of number of protons vs. number of neutrons, would all fall in an area enclosed by two curved lines known as the band of stability. The band of stability also includes radionuclides because smooth lines cannot be drawn to exclude them. The band of stability also stops at element 83 because there are no known stable isotopes above it. Elements lying outside the band of stability would be too unstable to justify the time and money for an attempt to make it."
Looking at the band of stability, we know the limits of which elements we can have. Don`t be so eager to fly off the wall becase we don`t know everything.
Also, these aliens could travel smaller distances than all the way to earth to find these materials. Unless your claiming they are in our solar system, which seems quite unlikely to me.
In fact it all seems unlikely. I`m with you on this Heisenberg!
Above all things, please do agree with me that there is a temptation to belive in conspiracy theories =) Daily bongtokers seem to be a massive fan of conspiracy theories for some reason, I used to love following them too. I belive in some of them like 9/11. Thats off topic and please don`t drop in to discuss it, but the point I want to make here is that with 9/11 there is a scenario of profits to be made and things to be achived, thats why its more valid than the aliens one where there are no true goals you can point out.
newworldicon
Well-Known Member
I can tell that you have researched and read very little about the subjects I mention...this will give you a teaser of what and who the elite are and what they have done to your country.....http://dev.republicoftheunitedstates.org/what-is-the-republic/history/ This by no means covers the others, look into the bilderbergers for more on the elite and their plans for the world.
The Rothschilds are responsible for the dropping of the A-bomb by your government in Japan, read the whole article and be amazed by it....http://www.rense.com/general90/whyhir.htm. Feel free to look into the credibility of the author as well.
What makes you think they are looking for aliens, I am saying I believe they are in bed together...yes I said it!! why though I am not sure from the point of view of the alien race here, that is muddled. The elite want to be at the top, nothing more than continuity of power for there family/dynasty. Thousands of years ago families "royalty" did exactly that so why should it be any different now..?
Correction: I was not correlating aliens to a specific 50's incident as you assumed and misinterpreted, I was saying that officially according to the US government they have ceased to investigate alien subject matter...why...maybe because if they were to continue then the public would at some point expect answers, this way they can flatly refute and discredit any existence.
And for the record of all the sightings that are made and reported I think that most of them are human built craft from reverse engineering.
Experience a UFO sighting first before dismissing it altogether my friend...I have and I can tell you straight up that I was as sceptical as you are before it happened...but now it is all game as far as I am concerned..
newworldicon
Well-Known Member
What makes you think materials are the most valuable commodity on earth? How about human beings? We are afterall the most incredible thing on Earth without sounding arrogant...why because we have a soul!!!
Heisenberg
Well-Known Member
Conspiracy theories do have common traits which set them apart from other theories. The most problematic is probably the conspiracy of silence. Especially with something huge like JFK or 911. You are expecting a government that couldn't cover up Clinton's blow job to remain completely silent on other subjects. Some conspiracy theories involve hundreds and thousands of people, and out of all the theories and all the people, not one person has found Jesus and come forward, not one deathbed confession has been made, not a single betrayal of trust; what an amazing feat just in itself.
The second thing that identifies a conspiracy theory is this fact; Any evidence presented against the theory, becomes evidence for the theory. For example, some people claimed the gun Oswald used was given to him just before the shooting. When a picture was found of him holding the gun taken years before, which is reasonable evidence that the gun existed prior to that day, conspiracy theorists say the picture was simply doctored, and now sight the picture as evidence that the conspiracy is true. A conspiracy theory has no problem making as many assumptions as it needs to justify itself, which of course is not a reliable way to reach the truth.
Like Tenner, I brought up a specific conspiracy for the sake of example, and do not wish to discuss JFK in this thread, as it is off topic.
The second thing that identifies a conspiracy theory is this fact; Any evidence presented against the theory, becomes evidence for the theory. For example, some people claimed the gun Oswald used was given to him just before the shooting. When a picture was found of him holding the gun taken years before, which is reasonable evidence that the gun existed prior to that day, conspiracy theorists say the picture was simply doctored, and now sight the picture as evidence that the conspiracy is true. A conspiracy theory has no problem making as many assumptions as it needs to justify itself, which of course is not a reliable way to reach the truth.
Like Tenner, I brought up a specific conspiracy for the sake of example, and do not wish to discuss JFK in this thread, as it is off topic.
Tenner
Well-Known Member
You just put up more conspiracy food which I`m kindly going to pass on and get back to the aliens which this thread really is about. (I`m not arguing with the existance of the elite)
Now for what you said about UFO`s on that last paragraph your just like people telling me I`ll belive in god when I see him. I have seen some exceptional patterns in the sky but they are just UFO`s man. UNIDENTIFIED flying objects.
Just understand how our minds work. Seeing the simplest thing in the sky its an alien. Seeing something in the snow and its bigfoot. Feel something weird like a near death experience and its god. Your tuned into the frequency imo.
newworldicon
Well-Known Member
Science as we know does not explain everything in the universe but you seemed to allude to the idea that it did, I thought that was arrogant, where did I belittle anyone, pinpoint it!
I had no idea that I should spend hours typing why I believe they exist, is it your express expectation that I justify everything I believe for your approval Heisenberg??
Your smoke and fire paragraph seems to waffle and drift, I pertained to the idea that the more theories and stories that circulate about a "conspiracy theory" the more difficult it is to really understand the truth...it had nothing to do with theories in science or physics!
We will agree to disagree on which came first, the alien or the non existence of the alien. We all know it is hard to prove aliens exist but can you prove they do not exist? For all intense purposes you claimed they did not exist before I responded to the thread.
Shall I ask you to prove God's existence? Would you dismiss a catholic his belief considering there is zero proof of God's existence??
Tenner
Well-Known Member
I don`t belive in god and I don`t belive in aliens on earth. Both have no logical points for me to concider and are neither proven, nor disproven just like that giant spaghetti monster.
Oh and no I wouldn`t dismiss a catholic in his belief especially if his a nice guy doing nice things. Its his feed for the mind and I have my own feeds and they both work. I don`t go around insulting peoples choices of food either, but I occasionally would if they were unhealthy. I have been eager to dismiss religion on the net but thats just boring now
Heisenberg
Well-Known Member
You seemed to answer reasonable doubt by claiming it is a result of arrogance and ignorance. Perhaps I misunderstood the context. I agree that claiming science explains everything would be arrogant, which is why I didn't say that, and identified it as a strawman. What I actually said was that alien life has an extremely high probability to exist, but so far there is zero evidence that it's out there, and zero evidence that we are being visited on earth. Of course I am discounting anecdotal evidence, which is a standard we have for all claims.
I can not prove aliens do not exist, as I can not prove God does not exist. We do not need to provide justification for rejecting a claim, it is simply the null hypothesis. Just as the default stance for a unicorn living in the sun is that it is not true.
Heisenberg
Well-Known Member
From universe today
But that doesn't change your point, which I guess is that life is likely to be abundant in the universe and methane is a good energy source. But how do we go from 'aliens could be out there' to 'aliens are here'? Mirages are seen by multiple people, and can be caught on video. Am I saying UFOs are mirages? Well some of them are likely to be, but my point is that mistakes of perception can be shared by a group.
I am simply saying that we must apply the same standards of evidence to the claim of alien visitors as we do to everything else.
newworldicon
Well-Known Member
I had just written about my experience and the "HideIP" changed addresses to lose what I had written...I shall share an experience with you, take it how you want....
Last year on the 23rd of July my GF and I took the dog for it's evening walk and pee in the park next to my house, we entered the aprk as the rain was coming and the wind was howeling around us. I threw the ball for the dog which ran off and simultaneously out of the corner of our eyes we both saw a blinding silver shape come over the tree line moving slowly then lowering to about 4 foot off the ground beyond the trees inside the common about 25 metres from us. We stood there frozen with fear frankly, it made no noise, nothing, just hovered there. It was about 12 metres long, about 4 metres tall and was the stereotype cigar silver shape that we all love to label as a UFO. It was huge and had no apparent windows or doors or portals etc. nothing. It looked like it was turned from a solid piece of silver and then polished on the lathe. The dog barking like his life was in danger was a reassurance to us that we were seeing what we were seeing, we commented on that later with little sleep and much searching the internet that night. The thing then hovered up to about the height of the trees and then shot off over in the direction of the new Olympic stadium and out of sight within seconds, I mean it shot away with such speed that it if we blinked we would not have seen the direction it had left in.
Now I by no means think that in that thing were beings from another planet but I do not know, perhaps it was a secret government project, who knows but I know what I saw and my GF knows what she saw too.
We cannot explain it but we know this, whatever it was it was sophisticated and could travel much quicker than anything man has produced to my knowledge and by my reckoning considering what I saw it was either alien or reverse engineering from alien tech.
One common denominator in this whole thing is this, I have been belittled and ridiculed by friends and by family for telling them this experience. It seems that people are quick to judge.
Last year on the 23rd of July my GF and I took the dog for it's evening walk and pee in the park next to my house, we entered the aprk as the rain was coming and the wind was howeling around us. I threw the ball for the dog which ran off and simultaneously out of the corner of our eyes we both saw a blinding silver shape come over the tree line moving slowly then lowering to about 4 foot off the ground beyond the trees inside the common about 25 metres from us. We stood there frozen with fear frankly, it made no noise, nothing, just hovered there. It was about 12 metres long, about 4 metres tall and was the stereotype cigar silver shape that we all love to label as a UFO. It was huge and had no apparent windows or doors or portals etc. nothing. It looked like it was turned from a solid piece of silver and then polished on the lathe. The dog barking like his life was in danger was a reassurance to us that we were seeing what we were seeing, we commented on that later with little sleep and much searching the internet that night. The thing then hovered up to about the height of the trees and then shot off over in the direction of the new Olympic stadium and out of sight within seconds, I mean it shot away with such speed that it if we blinked we would not have seen the direction it had left in.
Now I by no means think that in that thing were beings from another planet but I do not know, perhaps it was a secret government project, who knows but I know what I saw and my GF knows what she saw too.
We cannot explain it but we know this, whatever it was it was sophisticated and could travel much quicker than anything man has produced to my knowledge and by my reckoning considering what I saw it was either alien or reverse engineering from alien tech.
One common denominator in this whole thing is this, I have been belittled and ridiculed by friends and by family for telling them this experience. It seems that people are quick to judge.
RyanTheRhino
Well-Known Member
I think you have a problem with logic. why would they create area 51 to distract form the moon landing fake (it really did happen just so dont you say that in public) .
People knew about area 51 before 1969. so
newworldicon
Well-Known Member
Area 51 is used for many things and there is always going to controversy surrounding something secretive..
heathaa
Well-Known Member
there are actually more than 8 planets here it is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_System and im just saying nitrogen or methane as a way to sustain life on other planets. but yes methane could be an energy used to go to mars if done right. not only that if you asked the russian and us governments to put up the truth we would be quite suprised. russia had soldiers posted all over russia and had an ongoing case of it longer than project blue book. russia kept the investigation going untill the end of the cold war.
newworldicon
Well-Known Member
Why bother with fuel when you can use zero point energy propulsion, and has anyone included nubiru in our solar system, it's there and it belongs to our sun's rotation....
Kodank Moment
Well-Known Member
What a thread. Arguing over the same shit. And neither has any evidence to support claims because its all opinion lol.
/fail.
/fail.
rowlman
Well-Known Member
...so... that was all part of their plan, they had to start the project early...oh, I did put a JK after that post, that means JUST KIDDING
