If Sanders were to run as an independent...

Would you vote for Bernie if he ran as an independent?

  • Total voters
    19
abandonconflict

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
randallb said:
He's also miserable and cranky. Not electable
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I don't disagree with you, but I have to retort in order to create an atmosphere where Bernie supporters feel welcome to vote and comment. So far only two actual Bernie supporters have taken part and only one of them has said they would vote for him if he ran as independent. I'm thinking that of the 120+ who have seen the thread, some are Bernie supporters who are just timid.
 
ChiefRunningPhist

ChiefRunningPhist

Well-Known Member
I think its smarter for him to run as a dem though for both him and whoever the dem front runner would be. If he were to run as an independent he'd just steal votes from the dem candidate and visa versa, and the GOP walks away as the dems split their party. I don't see any trumpers walking over to Bernie.
 
abandonconflict

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
ChiefRunningPhist said:
I think its smarter for him to run as a dem though for both him and whoever the dem front runner would be. If he were to run as an independent he'd just steal votes from the dem candidate and visa versa, and the GOP walks away as the dems split their party. I don't see any trumpers walking over to Bernie.
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What about centrists and economic liberals who reject democratic socialism? Most of them do not want their party subverted by someone who has never been a member of it. Many of those people feel that he has already split the party. An eighth of Bernie's primary support voted for Trump in the general in 2016. This is a fact and it indicates strongly that his movement, whether by his design or by GOP opportunity, served exactly the purpose you described. So he is splitting the vote either way.

Democrats have a right to vote for a democrat. Bernie is not a democrat.
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
abandonconflict said:
What about centrists and economic liberals who reject democratic socialism? Most of them do not want their party subverted by someone who has never been a member of it. Many of those people feel that he has already split the party. An eighth of Bernie's primary support voted for Trump in the general in 2016. This is a fact and it indicates strongly that his movement, whether by his design or by GOP opportunity, served exactly the purpose you described. So he is splitting the vote either way.

Democrats have a right to vote for a democrat. Bernie is not a democrat.
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That's why we have caucuses and coalitions, different factions within parties in a two party system. Sanders has caucused with Democrats since he was elected to congress. If his political party is an issue, why has it never been brought up until he became a viable candidate for president? It seems a lot like one of the only arguments against his popularity is that he's not a Democrat. The reality is that's a net benefit to his campaign as more Americans identify with and support Independent candidates. Sanders being an Independent running in the Democratic party brings more I into the voting process. The coalition supports young people, I, and nonvoters, all the demographics required to win.

Centrists and economic liberals - people who are content with 50K people dying and 500K people going bankrupt every year because they can't afford healthcare costs under a neoliberal healthcare system

Seems pretty authoritarian to me to not support democracy, as mayo Pete explains here;


"In an American election, the person who gets the most votes ought to be the person who wins."
 
hanimmal

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
That's why we have caucuses and coalitions, different factions within parties in a two party system. Sanders has caucused with Democrats since he was elected to congress. If his political party is an issue, why has it never been brought up until he became a viable candidate for president? It seems a lot like one of the only arguments against his popularity is that he's not a Democrat. The reality is that's a net benefit to his campaign as more Americans identify with and support Independent candidates. Sanders being an Independent running in the Democratic party brings more I into the voting process. The coalition supports young people, I, and nonvoters, all the demographics required to win.

Centrists and economic liberals - people who are content with 50K people dying and 500K people going bankrupt every year because they can't afford healthcare costs under a neoliberal healthcare system

Seems pretty authoritarian to me to not support democracy, as mayo Pete explains here;


"In an American election, the person who gets the most votes ought to be the person who wins."
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Do you mean six years ago?
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
That's why we have caucuses and coalitions, different factions within parties in a two party system. Sanders has caucused with Democrats since he was elected to congress. If his political party is an issue, why has it never been brought up until he became a viable candidate for president? It seems a lot like one of the only arguments against his popularity is that he's not a Democrat. The reality is that's a net benefit to his campaign as more Americans identify with and support Independent candidates. Sanders being an Independent running in the Democratic party brings more I into the voting process. The coalition supports young people, I, and nonvoters, all the demographics required to win.

Centrists and economic liberals - people who are content with 50K people dying and 500K people going bankrupt every year because they can't afford healthcare costs under a neoliberal healthcare system

Seems pretty authoritarian to me to not support democracy, as mayo Pete explains here;


"In an American election, the person who gets the most votes ought to be the person who wins."
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When you use the word "neoliberal", what do you mean by that? Your use of the term doesn't match common use so you need to explain the term.

Edit: thanks for posting a cherry picked video that was otherwise free from talking head commentary like Jimmy Dore. Question: what's so authoritarian about one person, one vote?
 
ChiefRunningPhist

ChiefRunningPhist

Well-Known Member
Warren proposes everything Bernie does. The only difference I see is Bernies proposal of garunteed FT jobs. Not really a bad deal imo. The country only pays if people work, and we desperately need infrastructure repair and investment. If you're going to want to kick Sanders out, but then turn around and embrace Warren, I have to scratch my head??? I'm not saying Bernie isn't an independent, but if the policies of an independent are embraced and mimicked by a so called "democrat," then whats the issue? Sounds like we're fighting over labels...

Wall street is doing well due to less regulation and huge tax cuts, but it's not sustainable. Deficit is climbing outrageously and governmental programs are slashed at incredible rates. The GOP is playing politics with the economy. They are squeezing the last out of it knowing that the next guy is going to be up a creek. It won't matter if your republican or democrat, the GOP have buried the country in debt to give their candidate a boost on wall street and line the pockets of the wealthy while the majority suffer. Imo a huge tax increase on the rich is what's needed to correct the thievery and right the boat for the majority American.
 
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ChiefRunningPhist

ChiefRunningPhist

Well-Known Member
abandonconflict said:
This isn't a Warren thread. You already made a Warren bashing thread. You remember the one where you're terrified of a hysterical woke triggered libtard because she would let a gay kid ask questions.
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Lol so Bernie is the devil for running as a democrat, because his policies aren't consistent with Democratic policies, though Warren has the same policies (and more free stuff), and she's ok?..., and she's a democrat? Again, fighting over labels... They are pretty much campaigning for the same things, the only thing I've really seen different and that Warren hasn't adopted yet is Bernie's FT job garuntee..

If Bernie ran as an independent, I garuntee Trump walks away with it (siphoning votes away from whoever the dem would be). By him running as a dem, if he gets the nod, then we still have a chance of removing dump. By him running as a dem, liberals who are concerned have the chance to knock him off, so that he doesn't siphon. As an independent, that's not possible.
 
E

EddieTorres

Active Member
I'm a Bernie supporter. There is no viable 3rd party in America, particularly when it comes to Presidential races, Independent votes only pull votes from the Dems. We can't have Trump win in 2020 so the answer is no, I'd unfortunately have to vote for whoever the Dems put up, just like I did in 2016. The misguided people that voted for Trump in 2016 (the ones who would have voted Sanders) were the ones that were fed up with D.C. and couldn't stand Clinton, which is the exact reason we can't put up a centrist in 2020. That said, regardless of how people feel about his disposition, Internet trolls, Bernie-bro nonsense, various identity politics, etc, if you want to look at voting records, he's been (for the most part) the furthest left, most consistently, for the longest amount of time. He's been fighting for the underclass since the early 60s, to the detriment of his political career, which tells me he's the real thing.
 
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