I'm getting as sick as these babies

Good day to all. I am currently still in my first attempt at playing DADDY to these girls and am getting a bit frustrated (ready to shake the shit out of them).
I know it isn't their fault but i just can't seem to find that right balance. I think i've got the culprit narrowed to my ph.... but if you think i'm way off please school me!
I originally started six seeds about six weeks ago under a 400w MH 24/0 with a 10 gal. res. drip system, ph drip test kit, rockwool as medium,fed 3 times a day with 1/2 nute strength of Rockwool Formula 1, 80* temps, 30% hum., exhaust and fan.
I messed with everything until i found that my ph levels were rising drastically. i was noticing my res. a bit cloudy after a day or two so i was constantly changing the water. IMO only one was worth keeping so i put it on a rockwool slab and started to water by hand. LESSONS LEARNED.
Finally got those magic BEANS so i decided to use..
(6) 40w 4ft. fluros.
1 rubbermaid 14 gal. res. w/airstone and res.heater 68*
pre-soaked rockwool cubes to ph of 6
(1) w.rhino
(1) s.white
This time i only fed the babies distilled water for the first week then 1/2 strngth second fed by my res. After one day my ph jumped to like 7.5. Been hand watering these girls with full strength for 2 days now.
Problem is why even when i put 5 gal of tap water in res with airstone with correct ph and temp. with no nutes. does my ph jump up within 24 hours in the res.?...but my 1 gallon jugs mixed with nutes will stay proper for days? Am i missing something here?
The first two pics are 23 days from sprout. Lack of, or too much what? Roots look fine.
Second is 6 weeks in its own container just for trial and error. Dont know strain or sex. I finally seen a root tip from the bottom of slab and the tip is brown. Should i keep the slab submerged in a bit of water?
So sorry for the long post but i'm sure experienced growers will find this informing for a possible solution to my problem. thanks

whats the ph of your tap water?

probably nute burn though id do straight phed water for at least two weeks in the begining..then third week 1/4 then fourth weelk 1/2 then full after that..I'm no hydro expert I just know my basics..I'm actually in organic soil myself.

bobsgreen said:

whats the ph of your tap water?

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it looks to be about 7 when it comes out the faucet. but i correct it with ph down. I have been thinking of boiling the water first but who the hell wants to boil 10 gal of water. :/

procrastinator said:

it looks to be about 7 when it comes out the faucet. but i correct it with ph down. I have been thinking of boiling the water first but who the hell wants to boil 10 gal of water. :/

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thanks bud. i was actually thinking of starting some new ones with plain water until they show me some symptoms of lack of nutes to distinguish the characteristics of the two.

do you let it sit out for a day before adding it? thats the way most people using tap do it..I go down to the bottled water machine and get 5 or 10 gal for $1.50/5gal..kind of a hassle but just until I get a RO machine

A lot of nutes have PH buffers in them that will help the solution resist PH change. If your water comes out of the tap at 200 or more PPM, then it may contain some crap that acts as a slight buffer it self, perhaps causing the solution to try to maintain a high PH. When you add the nutes, the better buffers kick in and help the PH stay low.

Also sometimes new growers, myself included, will try to chase the PH too much. Experienced hydro growers recommend you start with a low PH like 5.5 and allow it to drift up to 6.5. Different nutrients are available at different PH levels. It's not good to bring the PH down too quick or too often, or try to keep it at a constant level. Have no idea if this pertains to your situation.

If you use something like vinegar for PH down, you may find that hydroponic PH down is a bit more stable.

bobsgreen said:

do you let it sit out for a day before adding it? thats the way most people using tap do it..I go down to the bottled water machine and get 5 or 10 gal for $1.50/5gal..kind of a hassle but just until I get a RO machine

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no i dont. Thanks. As much as i browse here i didnt know i should let tap water sit for a day before adding nutes and checking ph. The bottled water machine thing isnt a bad idea either since i only use 5 gal. for these two. Right now atleast. thanks again.

procrastinator said:

no i dont. Thanks. As much as i browse here i didnt know i should let tap water sit for a day before adding nutes and checking ph. The bottled water machine thing isnt a bad idea either since i only use 5 gal. for these two. Right now atleast. thanks again.

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There are different opinions about letting tap water sit out. If your water is treated with chlorine, sitting out will allow it to evaporate. However a lot of treatment plants use an alternative these days that doesn't evaporate. Some growers even like the chlorine because they are growing with only chem nutes and prefer a sterile tank. If you do chose to let the water sit out, try to sit it in the dark so you won't encourage early algae growth.

TY. Will keep the drifting ph thing a try. but why does only one gallon of the same water stay ay my desired levels kept in a jug?

I would ask myself what variables are present in each jug, and then attempt to control for those variables to isolate the problem. Sounds to me like the nutes are just helping to stabilize the PH, as they should.

I had a somewhat similar problem. My res PH was drifting wildly. I set up a control bucket with airstones and nutes, and it did the same thing. So I knew that the variable I was looking for what not isolated to the res with the plants. The only variable in my case that was the same in both jugs was the PH meter, and it turns out it was faulty.

PH can be a struggle for new growers, but the good news is that if you keep at it, you will eventually get to know your water and become familiar with how it behaves, and it will be like riding a bike.

As for your sick plants I am not experienced to know from looking. It is surely an issue of nutrient deficiency, but it's hard to say if that deficiency is caused from lack of nutes in the water, or from lockout due to PH or even too much PPM. You may want to search for 8 step recovery thread.

I think that your first problem may lay with the seedling's been put under a m.h at such a young age.Good that you now have them under flouresents.When growing in a hydroponic system it is best to keep the nutrient levels at a ph of 5.0/5.5 most hydro feed are made to peform best at this ph level.If the ph is any higher even 6.0 it will lock out some of the essential part of the nutrients the plant needs.While increaseing other part of the nutrients that the plant will take up through it's roots.Before filling the tank with water clean it realy good there might be a nutrient build up inside the tank.Also let the water stand for a few hours before putting the pumps on.This will allow any additive's that your water company adds to make the water clean will evaperate.Check the ph when you first put water in the tank and check it after a couple of hours i bet the ph goes down not much but i bet a little.Also if the ph continues to flux then get a ph buffer this will help in the battle of the ph.

procrastinator said:

no i dont. Thanks. As much as i browse here i didnt know i should let tap water sit for a day before adding nutes and checking ph. The bottled water machine thing isnt a bad idea either since i only use 5 gal. for these two. Right now atleast. thanks again.

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The 24 hours of sittin is to let the clorine disipate.Good Luck..

tyke1973 said:

I think that your first problem may lay with the seedling's been put under a m.h at such a young age.Good that you now have them under flouresents.When growing in a hydroponic system it is best to keep the nutrient levels at a ph of 5.0/5.5 most hydro feed are made to peform best at this ph level.If the ph is any higher even 6.0 it will lock out some of the essential part of the nutrients the plant needs.While increaseing other part of the nutrients that the plant will take up through it's roots.Before filling the tank with water clean it realy good there might be a nutrient build up inside the tank.Also let the water stand for a few hours before putting the pumps on.This will allow any additive's that your water company adds to make the water clean will evaperate.Check the ph when you first put water in the tank and check it after a couple of hours i bet the ph goes down not much but i bet a little.Also if the ph continues to flux then get a ph buffer this will help in the battle of the ph.

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thanx for looking out for me. I originally thought the light was burning them up but it was like 3 ft from them , and its a switchable ballast so i decided to try the mh before flowereing with hps. All this was happening in my flower room since i hadnt made a suitable veg room yet. When i realized the res. ph was the problem i thought to get the veg room done so i can keep everything at a constant. Same shit luck. But the rooms are pretty.
I scrub the shit out of the res. with water and bleach so its pretty sterile. ? about hydroton grow rocks...i rinsed them thoroughly before use getting all that dust off but i notice that after i water there is still a little brown sediment coming out of the bottom. normal? that shouldnt affect the ph since they are a neutral ph right?