Is this normal?

Im having leaves on the bottom of my plant shriveling up. I'm about a month away from harvest so I'm not sure if this is normal or not. They're usually bottom leaves. Some middle leaves are falling as well, but no uppers. 1 pictures show the progression of the shriveling, while the other shows what they look like after its almost completely dead.

Look under the leaves that have those white spots on them....I think you have mites

Michiganmeds1982 said:

Look under the leaves that have those white spots on them....I think you have mites

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Yes I saw my first mites about 3 days ago and I sprayed immediately. I also sprayed this morning. I'm using green cleaner and I haven't had the leaves dropping and dying in a couple days. I got lazy and didn't spray for about 2 weeks. I think I've got them under control. I haven't seen them on the leaves since either spraying. I haven't really seen too much spider mite damage, but I thought it was just the spotted leaves that gave it away. They've been on and off with the shriveling. One week im good, then next week I'm losing leaves like crazy. I'll keep an eye out for em.

yeah that looks like trips or a phosphorus deff

I`d bet on sapsucker pests 1st

THE KONASSURE said:

yeah that looks like trips or a phosphorus deff

I`d bet on sapsucker pests 1st

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It does look like Phosphorus deficiency or possibly excess? I was feeding them hydroplex along with a base. The hydroplex is 0-10-6 and I was giving them a max feeding. I actually stopped the hydroplex on one of the plants and I haven't had any issues. It has to be bugs. Like I said, I think they're under control. Could it be something other than spider mites that maybe the green cleaner isn't treating?

cindywhite said:

It does look like Phosphorus deficiency or possibly excess? I was feeding them hydroplex along with a base. The hydroplex is 0-10-6 and I was giving them a max feeding. I actually stopped the hydroplex on one of the plants and I haven't had any issues. It has to be bugs. Like I said, I think they're under control. Could it be something other than spider mites that maybe the green cleaner isn't treating?

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could be too much phosphorus or a calcium phosphate build up

Personally I like my K to out number my P, I go with a 1-2-3 ratio and still add potassium sulphate a lot of the time

Looks like a P issue or thrips to me but you can see the plant better

Try Spinosad if its bugs spinosad will end that for a month with one spray/watering

THE KONASSURE said:

could be too much phosphorus or a calcium phosphate build up

Personally I like my K to out number my P, I go with a 1-2-3 ratio and still add potassium sulphate a lot of the time

Looks like a P issue or thrips to me but you can see the plant better

Try Spinosad if its bugs spinosad will end that for a month with one spray/watering

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I think you're spot on with the thrips. I think the green cleaner is working to an extent but it's not keeping them away. I've never even heard of thrips. Will I see them flying or are they too small to see? I see a lot of gnat looking things flying around the crop. I've never looked at one under a scope.

cindywhite said:

I think you're spot on with the thrips. I think the green cleaner is working to an extent but it's not keeping them away. I've never even heard of thrips. Will I see them flying or are they too small to see? I see a lot of gnat looking things flying around the crop. I've never looked at one under a scope.

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the eggs you wont see

the larval stage you`ll normally see jumping around in your run out or in the top of the soil

the adult ones fly but I`m sure you get some that just live in the root zone and eat the fuck out of your roots but that happens a few gens in

they are small but the adults and larva can be seen the larva just wriggle and jump the adults are kinda like small fruit fly size sometimes a bit smaller and quite slim, kinda like a mosquito and a small narrow mouth had a baby

We`ve had them for a year or 2 now and a mate had them for years, seeing the larva stage was easy but I only spotted my 1st adults the other day after 2 years of looking for them and that was on an outside grow, so I have yet to actually see an adult one inside yet

but they must be there they just fly, lay eggs on the leaves and then the eggs hatch out eat the leaves drop down to the soil and pupate in the wet/damp areas

Perlite or silica rock or volcanic dust on the top of your soil can help

but from personal experience thrips are a cunt, I`d give them a 7/10 if spider mites are say a 3/10 I mean water or soapy water or neem oil will scare away spider mites

spinosad nukes spider mites but only gets rid of thrips for 1 to 6 months

I use a mixture of tricks and bug killers and such to make it hard for them to get onto my indoor plants

just gotta nuke my flowering beds outside with "ant stop granules" next week actually due to seeing them in there

In the UK we struggle to get nice spinosad products, in the usa there`s captain Jack and montgomery.... here I`ve just found Ant Stop granules 0.2% spinosad, easy to get don`t think too many people in the UK or europe have twigged the ant stop is spinosad based yet.

pepper extract works really well. i just made one earlier today using 3 minced ghost peppers (or a bunch of habaneros) and a pint of water. boiled the water, reduced to a simmer (dont let it boil again cuz itll break down the capsicum). simmer for 20+ minutes and filter out the peppers. spray wearing a face mask and glasses. kills mites on contact and naturally washes away off the plant but you can interchange foliar feed and pest control uses to keep the capsicum from lingering around.

THE KONASSURE said:

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but they must be there they just fly, lay eggs on the leaves and then the eggs hatch out eat the leaves drop down to the soil and pupate in the wet/damp areas

Perlite or silica rock or volcanic dust on the top of your soil can help

but from personal experience thrips are a cunt, I`d give them a 7/10 if spider mites are say a 3/10 I mean water or soapy water or neem oil will scare away spider mites

spinosad nukes spider mites but

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First off, thank you so much for all your help. After further inspection of my plants I have found eggs on 1/3. I've been looking for the last few days. I even bought a 120x scope to see hemp mites/ russet mites. I have not spotted any. When I had the fungus gnats I saw the tiny white worm like larvae in the soil of all of the plants. 2/3 like I said are damaged pretty well and seem to be stunted. I put nematodes in the soil after that and haven't seen them since. I still have 1 thriving plant even though it has bugs as well. The other 2 are drinking much less water. I'm feeding them 2 gallons of water in 10 gallon pots about every 5 days (sometimes 7 whole days) regardless of temps still being in the 90s. With the healthy plant I have been feeding it the same amount of water every 2 days pretty religiously. Is it possible that I overfed the other 2 causing root rot? I feel like i have a lot of root rot symptoms. The main one being that I am showing defincies where there are none and the 2 plants not drinking like they're supposed to. I was feeding them at the same rate until I noticed they weren't drinking nearly enough. (I'm dealing with 3 strains) If I have root rot, is it too late to do anything now in flowering? I've heard of a botanicare product that is supposed to help with root rot, but you'll have to wait longer to harvest. Which is no problem for me. I've also heard that those don't work in flowering. Why? I don't know. I will also post pictures of the worst damage on the plants. It is on the Girl Scout cookies that I believe is a real cut. I've heard real Girl Scout cookies are very hard to grow. It's not the plant I spotted the eggs on

I'm sorry this is all out of whack! I'm freaking out a little bit!

Back to the eggs that i spotted. Obviously I have a bug problem, on top of whatever else I may have. I posted pictures of them. They didnt look clear like pictures of spider mite eggs I have seen online. They were the same shape I believe, but they also seemed to be bigger than something a spider mite could lay. If I have mites should I get spray (that isn't green cleaner) or use predatory mites?

Anyone's input is welcome!

iHearAll said:

pepper extract works really well. i just made one earlier today using 3 minced ghost peppers (or a bunch of habaneros) and a pint of water. boiled the water, reduced to a simmer (dont let it boil again cuz itll break down the capsicum). simmer for 20+ minutes and filter out the peppers. spray wearing a face mask and glasses. kills mites on contact and naturally washes away off the plant but you can interchange foliar feed and pest control uses to keep the capsicum from lingering around.

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I'll keep that in mind. I've always wanted to make my own spray and a lot of recipes that I've heard good things about have pepper in them. This green cleaner is like soapy alcohol. I think it would've worked out if I hadn't missed a week on spraying. I'll have to identify whatever is going on before I do anything. I'll post if I try it out. I'm going to have to make more decisions soon.

They look like caterpillar or mouth or some kinda beetle eggs ? (or even spider eggs)

As for rot, yeah over watering causes rot and then if you under water so the plant wilts and then over water that`s like the worse

you wanna get some good soil bacteria going and keep it kinda damp, my rule is 3 wet days 3 dry days, so I water every 3 days and flood the fuck out of them, actually I`ve been getting away with once every 7 days in bloom atm but normally its every 3/4 days just got extra airflow and temps have dropped and due to a broken fan a month or 2 ago my veg is behind so I`m flowering smaller plants than normal

I butt my water for a week before I use it

The water has potassium silicate added to it, then is ph`d to ph5/5.5, (phosphoric acid) has fulvic acid, trichoderma and a natural "water butt fresh" treatment added

then its left to bubble with a big air pump for a week, ph 5 normally go`s up to around 6 in a week, I don`t get to the grow much so I can`t ph it then come back in a few hours and balance if off before adding my trichoderma but oh well

Anyway I run in coco/perlite mix and use rockwall blocks for my seedlings and clones, sometimes I start them in coco

I think the pre treatment of my water really helps cut down on rot issues

as outside when I use tap water or it rains we get more rot/mould and bug problems

also when I used fresh tap water I had more issues too

I`m hydro, even when I do soil or organics, I`d still be hydro, I like to condition and set up my water, cos you know I can`t just order some fresh mountain water here in London, lol

THE KONASSURE said:

They look like caterpillar or mouth or some kinda beetle eggs ? (or even spider eggs)

As for rot, yeah over watering causes rot and then if you under water so the plant wilts and then over water that`s like the worse

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Well, I have done that a few times. It's just so hard to be here to keep them satisfied when the temps are in the 100's. Then I started having the plants drink at way different rates, so now I'm always outside checking them to see if they need to be watered. I am watering them all separately because they all drink different amounts. Have you used hydroguard or great white or products similar for root rot? I have the bug situation under control now, but I still believe I have root rot. Im so late into flowering I dont even know if its worth it to spend $30 on something I dont need or won't perform miracles this late in flower. I asked botanicare if I could use hydroguard in flower, but obviously they are going to tell me I can. Does root rot extend flower time, or will my trichomes mature leaving me with tiny buds (which is what I have).

root rot travels up the main stem and the taste can even get into the buds, once all the leaves die the bud will already get the taste of the rot in it slightly

I mean the roots feed the plant if they suck up mold or bacteria the whole plant can get infected the same stuff will grow inside the plant that is why is dies and why people run sterile or use beanies

I`m n the UK and I`m piss poor both factors effect what I use, maybe one day I`ll make enough to move somewhere legal

Anyway I buy trichoderma it`s an aggressive soil/water mold, I get a product called "guard" from india its either £10 or 20 a kg the cheapest way I could get good trichoderma

You can mix it with soil, coco or water
Then I also use a water butt treatment, a natural kind that does not fuck with my bennies, I personally avoid the barley extract type as I`m gluten intolerant plus barley extract kills algae as much as a bit of green algae on my perlite annoys me most of my other bennies and feeds are seaweed/algae based so I worry that it may do damage to my bennies

Then if I`m rich I use Bactor S13 from TNC £28 for 300g pricey stuff but a great bactria mix makes for a nice taste enhancement

Then I like some mycorr aka mycorrhizal fungi I`ve ot great white granular 1 at the mo as it was cheap, but normally I use the uk made "root grow" as its £18 per kg I just use it when mixing coco and put some under the roots when potting up

but I think I`m going to use House and Gardens Rhizo Force instead of the mycorr and bactor s13 next as that has both in it and I can get 4/5kg from spain cheap on ebay

but 1st off ph and water conditioning are very important

I`ve seen roots turn to mush in a day, all it takes is warm weather and some high ph, like ph7 or more soon it becomes ph 8 and bacteria has turned your roots to mush

So yeah water treatments and some ph5 to ph 6.5 water, if soil I would push ph7 as a max but I would keep the soil pretty dry if doing that

Id use great white if I was rich, I would like to try using Orca next time I run hydro just because having clear water really helps see problems in hydro plus I`ve not used orca yet but I don`t see how using it in my water butt to pour on coco would be worth the money as I don`t need clear water in coco as I can`t view the rootzone or "res" lol