Keep leaves or cut leaves?
- Thread starter ManishWayz
- Start date
The Yorkshireman
Well-Known Member
Contrary to popular belief the size of Cannabis buds has nothing to do with light exposure/penetration at all.
Cannabis is a plant that grows with a characteristic called "apical dominance" (http://en.wikipedia....pical_dominance). This means that, like other plants, it will do everything it can to push a single tip towards the source of light. The tip of a plant that grows like this is called the apical tip, a good example of this in nature is the pine tree:
Pine Tree
Cannabis
(My Skunk #1 - 400W HPS)
The tip of the plant is also where a particular auxin (plant hormone) production is most abundant. It's called indole-3-acetic-acid (IAA).
This auxin is directly responsible for bud size, the more IAA produced in any particular tip of the plant then the bigger the bud at that tip will be.
By removing the apical tip through "Topping" or "Scrog"ing it forces the plant into branching to find a new one. In turn IAA production is distributed evenly, producing buds of equal size.
So to recap, apical dominance is responsible for the shape of the plant while IAA production is responsible for bud size.
Improving light exposure/penetration won't fix the "popcorn" situation but changing the shape of the plant will.
Hope this clears things up.
Cannabis is a plant that grows with a characteristic called "apical dominance" (http://en.wikipedia....pical_dominance). This means that, like other plants, it will do everything it can to push a single tip towards the source of light. The tip of a plant that grows like this is called the apical tip, a good example of this in nature is the pine tree:
Pine Tree
Cannabis
(My Skunk #1 - 400W HPS)
The tip of the plant is also where a particular auxin (plant hormone) production is most abundant. It's called indole-3-acetic-acid (IAA).
This auxin is directly responsible for bud size, the more IAA produced in any particular tip of the plant then the bigger the bud at that tip will be.
By removing the apical tip through "Topping" or "Scrog"ing it forces the plant into branching to find a new one. In turn IAA production is distributed evenly, producing buds of equal size.
So to recap, apical dominance is responsible for the shape of the plant while IAA production is responsible for bud size.
Improving light exposure/penetration won't fix the "popcorn" situation but changing the shape of the plant will.
Hope this clears things up.
TicKle
Well-Known Member
ManishWayz
Active Member
Here are the images from when I started taking all the leaves off up to the harvest of the plant.
(06/28/2012)
(08/08/2012)
** Sorry for the images had to cover cell phone with sunglass to take the pictures.
(06/28/2012)
(08/08/2012)
** Sorry for the images had to cover cell phone with sunglass to take the pictures.
ManishWayz
Active Member
Afghan Kush Ryder
(07/12/2012)
(08/11/2012)
(07/12/2012)
(08/11/2012)
Thats an awesome idea , ha never thought of that.
Id like to say , in growing "weeds" I believe u can try ur own ways , and whatever works for u and ur plant the best than go for it .
Try one trimming and another one not , of the same strain , if u really find a difference in yield and quality then u know , if not then u know we r all potheads just talking out our asses as it seems this whole forum does , and thats why i love it . ive spoken with over 10 weed Dr's since ive been on this forum and they r just like real doctors they say lots of shit and guess work .
Try one trimming and another one not , of the same strain , if u really find a difference in yield and quality then u know , if not then u know we r all potheads just talking out our asses as it seems this whole forum does , and thats why i love it . ive spoken with over 10 weed Dr's since ive been on this forum and they r just like real doctors they say lots of shit and guess work .
racerboy71
bud bootlegger
the idea of removing fan leaves is not guess work but rather science.. i mean, it's like everyone else has said earlier, photosynthesis is about as basic of a plant function as you can get.. jesu..Id like to say , in growing "weeds" I believe u can try ur own ways , and whatever works for u and ur plant the best than go for it .
Try one trimming and another one not , of the same strain , if u really find a difference in yield and quality then u know , if not then u know we r all potheads just talking out our asses as it seems this whole forum does , and thats why i love it . ive spoken with over 10 weed Dr's since ive been on this forum and they r just like real doctors they say lots of shit and guess work .
i can't believe that people actually think that by removing fan leaves you're doing the plant good.. this must be the 3rd or so thread like this i have seen this week, and it's only tuesday..
cannabis is no different than any other plant ffs.. do you ever see people who grow roses cut off all of the leaves to get better and bigger roses?? hell's to the nah's.. why do you think this is??? anyone, anyone, bueller, bueller...
I dont think we care about Science here Sir, its more of does it really do something different to the buds ? And i dont think u can compare roses to "weeds". So can u explain then how there is so many people on here that trim their plants and have these awesome pictures of nice buds , and people that dont and have the same awesome buds ?. Like i said everybody is a weed Doctor here
missnu
Well-Known Member
The leaves take sun and turn it into energy the plant can use, using a process called photosynthesis...leaves make food for the node they are attached to...so the light doesn't need to hit every node...just needs to hit leaves off of every node..this is why I don't understand why people take them off..they stick far off the plant for a reason...so they can catch the light...this is also why the lower the leaves the larger they are and the farther from the plant they will grow...lol.
tip top toker
Well-Known Member
From the few pictures in this thread, they might be nice, but they are not big. I am personally very interested in the science, even though i am a lazy "whatever works" grower. I would like to see a proper side by side comparison. And i think people do care about the science regardless if it is needed, hence why the vast majority of folk on this forum will own a ph meter. Science.
Understanding the importance of photosynthsis has nothing to do with a doctor, as i said earlier, i was taught this when i was barely into double digits.
Understanding the importance of photosynthsis has nothing to do with a doctor, as i said earlier, i was taught this when i was barely into double digits.
TicKle
Well-Known Member
Science, wether you care or not, is behind everything in life, jeeez are you really that ignorant...I have already posted pictures of my last grow, show me any of your grows that even come close with or without your stress tactics and maybe I'll contemplate considering giving your opinion a bit of thought.I dont think we care about Science here Sir, its more of does it really do something different to the buds ? And i dont think u can compare roses to "weeds". So can u explain then how there is so many people on here that trim their plants and have these awesome pictures of nice buds , and people that dont and have the same awesome buds ?. Like i said everybody is a weed Doctor here
can you define awesome buds? yes it's been proven that MJ can grow flower without these 'pesky to some' leaves. but every plant that does, would have performed better had you not taken away it's main energy producing life givers....
I agree with the side by side comparison . But in this case We dont need a science class to let us explain what we were taught for many years in Science class . If somebody can give a correct 100% scientific statement on why or why not then id be glad to read and understand , but in this case its just a bunch of "weed Doctors" saying what they know from their own growing . IT Has Nothing to do with science its just theory cases by growers around the world which each doctor gives his own diagnosis and Homie dont play dat.
U guys wanna put science in the mix be 100% sure because there is no 95% or 99% in science facts.
Science is not guess work Sir , Its TRUE 100% and accurate Facts and understanding How can u be that ignorant and say science stuff when u cant even explain the science in it or give correct information proving ur facts Dr.?!
Increase Bud Development
Marijuana seed fan leaves shade lower cannabis buds. These marijuana buds do not develop their full potential do to this shading. By removing fan leaves more light hits the lower branches.
Remove fans to conserve energy for upper marijuana bud development.
Trimming marijuana fan leaves and lower shaded branches focuses the plant’s development on the cola.
A marijuana plant wastes precious energy several ways.
Tall marijuana plants use energy to build extra stem and to move water up higher.
An untrimmed bushy cannabis plant wastes energy by expending energy on lower small bud producing branches. Careful trimming to remove unnecessary branches (which wont produce nice buds) leaves more energy for a larger yield.
Reduce stretching marijuana plants by removing fan leaves in the early flowering stage.
Speed Up The Flushing Process by removing fan leaves in the last 14 days before harvest.
Removing fan leaves creates better airflow which reduces the chance of mold.
When and how to trim marijuana fan leaves.
A marijuana strain with very few leaves and long internodes will need a lot less trimming - if a trimming technique is even adopted.
A marijuana strain with a surplus of leaves and short internodes would require more thinning to get the same amount of light to the lower buds.
Remove non productive dead leaf material first.
Marijuana leaves that have reached their final size and are aging will stop producing chlorophyll and start changing to a lighter color, often yellowing and showing purple.
These are the ones to take out first.
The older leaves, even though larger, are no longer very productive once they are not dark green anymore. By the time they start looking pale or discolored, they are not contributing anything to the marijuana plant at all.
Marijuana seed fan leaves shade lower cannabis buds. These marijuana buds do not develop their full potential do to this shading. By removing fan leaves more light hits the lower branches.
Remove fans to conserve energy for upper marijuana bud development.
Trimming marijuana fan leaves and lower shaded branches focuses the plant’s development on the cola.
A marijuana plant wastes precious energy several ways.
Tall marijuana plants use energy to build extra stem and to move water up higher.
An untrimmed bushy cannabis plant wastes energy by expending energy on lower small bud producing branches. Careful trimming to remove unnecessary branches (which wont produce nice buds) leaves more energy for a larger yield.
Reduce stretching marijuana plants by removing fan leaves in the early flowering stage.
Speed Up The Flushing Process by removing fan leaves in the last 14 days before harvest.
Removing fan leaves creates better airflow which reduces the chance of mold.
When and how to trim marijuana fan leaves.
A marijuana strain with very few leaves and long internodes will need a lot less trimming - if a trimming technique is even adopted.
A marijuana strain with a surplus of leaves and short internodes would require more thinning to get the same amount of light to the lower buds.
Remove non productive dead leaf material first.
Marijuana leaves that have reached their final size and are aging will stop producing chlorophyll and start changing to a lighter color, often yellowing and showing purple.
These are the ones to take out first.
The older leaves, even though larger, are no longer very productive once they are not dark green anymore. By the time they start looking pale or discolored, they are not contributing anything to the marijuana plant at all.
tip top toker
Well-Known Member
I do not understand what you are after. You are trying to debate what is a well known and well understood scientific fact.
I already said we dont need to know about stuff we learnt in school (photosynthesis) , so The debate Sir, is over rather or not the Fan Leaves really have any need once the budding process has started. And nobody here can give me scientific reasoning only their own theories scroll up and read what i posted about increase bud development, Found it online of course . but still makes a lot more sense than what some of these guys r saying on here.
tip top toker
Well-Known Member
Rather explain why YOU think that photosynthesis suddenly becomes irrelevant once flowering has commenced. By that notion there would be no need to feed it either because apparently the plant has no need for energy during flowering. Leaves are key to photosynthesis, photosynthesis creates energy, plants need energy when flowering.
And your post of random sentences doesn't read as anything i would take as scientific fact, just a bunch of sentences. Half of them aren't even relevant. You just copy and pasted someone elses, by your words, theories.
And your post of random sentences doesn't read as anything i would take as scientific fact, just a bunch of sentences. Half of them aren't even relevant. You just copy and pasted someone elses, by your words, theories.
