Leaves Clawing (cause?)

I just uploaded a video of the plants..(shot this last night)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Re-oU4CRQlo&feature=channel_video_title

unfortunately they are in grow bags, so lifting them out to check the roots isn't really a possibility, I'd have to slice open the bag

my initial reaction was that it might be nitrogen toxicity..but I'm not feeding them any nitrogen rich nutes? I'm also only feeding about half the recommended dose..just to be safe though I flushed two of them and I'll keep on eye on them of improvement

It is FFOF so it's impossible to keep book on the nutes like in soilless/hydro. If your instinct says N tox (and my read of the pics says that's not unlikely) proceed accordingly. Just a thought. cn

yep, I flushed two of them...its strange that it pretty much only affects the leaves surrounding the buds, is that what happened with your chiesel as well?

PlantProblems said:

my initial reaction was that it might be nitrogen toxicity..but I'm not feeding them any nitrogen rich nutes? I'm also only feeding about half the recommended dose..just to be safe though I flushed two of them and I'll keep on eye on them of improvement

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Nitrogen toxicity is usually the result of nitrogen buildup during the vegetative stage of growth. Excess nitrogen remains in the soil so even though you cut back on how much is fed once you switch to flower the plants still have access to larger amounts of nitrogen than they need or should have when switched to the flowering stage of growth. That is why "The Claw" normally, not always, but normally, shows up early in flowering, and you said you are what, two weeks into flower?

my initial research said nitrogen toxicity as opposed to my "instinct"...hopefully I'll get to that point where I can a fruitful diagnosis based on my instincts though, haha

shot this video of them..perhaps if kind provide a better perspective
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Re-oU4CRQlo&feature=channel_video_title

Thanks for the advice so far!

ahh, interesting..thanks for the info Brick!

yes, they are about 20 days into flower and the clawing seemed to happen over the course of a couple days...some of the plants seem to be pretty much clawless while others are clawing away

furrycnorm said:

My vanilla kush are doing this as well...growing in ffof 2 weeks into flower. Mine curl more at the very tips of the leaves...they look fine up until the very tip and then they almost make a 90 degree curl down. I have a 600hps about 18-20 inches above them and the room is at 70 degrees and it doesn't feel hot or anything under the light

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Ok, here is my question for you? I have a 400w HPS that will burn the shit out of you if you get even remotely close to it...how do I keep this thing cooled?!

missnu, this isn't really the thread for that..but look up aircooled hoods..that's your answer

PlantProblems said:

ahh, interesting..thanks for the info Brick!

yes, they are about 20 days into flower and the clawing seemed to happen over the course of a couple days...some of the plants seem to be pretty much clawless while others are clawing away

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Normally when switching to flower and you have excessive nitrogen you wee rapid growth but the new growth, not the old, will "claw." The color will be off, it will appear somewhat lifeless, not dead, just bland, and the leaves will have a semi-paper feel to them, they will not feel like normal healthy leaves, they will be drier. That is the result of increased transpiration and the plants inability to replace the lost moisture due to a damaged vascular system.


Sometimes older fan leaves that will not "claw" will be a dark green, a very dark green and sometimes will have a slight dull bluish tint to the green. That is another sign of excessive nitrogen.

and as an answer to the original question....Doesn't PH make the leaves curl like that...I feel like I read somewhere that that means that PH is too high or too low, I can't remember which....but I vote PH...or has always been the assumption I make when i see it happen

looks to me that you foilaged sprayed your girls under lights on

missnu said:

and as an answer to the original question....Doesn't PH make the leaves curl like that...I feel like I read somewhere that that means that PH is too high or too low, I can't remember which....but I vote PH...or has always been the assumption I make when i see it happen

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PH problems will make leaves curl, but leaves will curl in different ways depending on what is being locked out by the specific pH problem and not all leaf curl is the result of a pH imbalance.

When there is too much nitrogen in your growing mediums or soil plants will have like an overall dark green look and have delayed maturity. Due to excessive amounts of Nitrogen leftover from the vegetative growth stage, to much nitrogen will exist once in flower result in tall plants with weak stems. New growth will be very lively and plant transpiration will be high, but not always. Nitrogen toxicity can be seen give the appearance of very dry conditions in newer growth, almost as if there was a drought, which is from increased transpiration and reduced moisture/nutrient uptake due to plant vascular damage. which may show a burning effect, but not always. "the claw" look will be seen on new growth and fan leaves, normally the upper fans leaves..

If plants are give ammonium based nutrients they may show NH4+ toxicity, which will show a smaller/lesser/slowed plant growth and lesions that occur on stems and roots, leaf margins that will roll downward. Also the big fan leaves, mainly the upper fan leaves and new growth will have “the claw” look. The tips will point down but the leaves will stay up as if when you bend your fingers downwards. Besides "the claw" look leaves can be twisted when growing… mainly new growths. Roots will be under developed along with the slowing of flowering. Yields will be decreased, because to much nitrogen in early stages of flowering slows down bud growth. Water uptake is slowing down from the vascular breakdown of the plants as well.

The plants might now have "the claw." The symptoms have to be looked at and if enough exist, then it is likely "the claw" is the problem. If enough symptoms do not exist, then it is some other problem.

never sprayed the foliage (lights on or off)

Thanks again Brick.

I've been having problems this whole grow:

first lot of problems:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEHq-3hTY_I&feature=channel_video_title
second lot of problems: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l46D2cQ7tXg&feature=channel_video_title

and the most recent (claw) (uploaded tonight)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Re-oU4CRQlo&feature=channel_video_title

I'm having the same problem :/ I'll get some pics here in a few minutes....starts off fine, just a little yellowing for me near the bottom, then BAM! leaves curled. adjusting pH hasn't helped, raising the light didn't help, flushing didn't work. The only thing I can think of is maybe there's too much chlorine in our tap water? Havn't been able to afford an R/O machine, or distilled water so I'll have to deal with it ><

I have 11 clones all of them are ok except one of mine are "clawing" Im not sure why. I read it might be too much nitrogen. Which sucks if this is the case because i used Miracle Grow slow release soil. SO i cant really flush her. Guess the only thing i can do is get some better soil and try and transplant her.. Let me knowhow i can save her..
Thank you everyone for all your input..