LED hps....

Kingrow1 said:

Seen em and your seedlings a while back, not great.

I will make my next post way more scientific with numbers and equations for heat transger and stuff.

I see some growers posting contra led science and i want in at ground level so i dont look a douche when this stuff rolls in over your snakeoil cold lights, like is it blue or red thats cold

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You are the self-proclaimed dyslexic science guy and expert grower, so let's compare plants.
What are you growing right now?
I bet any of my Half & Half are better than what you're running.

Chunky Stool said:

You are the self-proclaimed dyslexic science guy and expert grower, so let's compare plants.
What are you growing right now?
I bet any of my Half & Half are better than what you're running.

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Its not a competition here, never been like that and wouldnt. Be hard to find a thread in years where ive ever been competetive.

Theres no love lost here but im going to have to be more scientific and too the point if im ever going to convince some to look at the facts again.

Ive been here before but im still wondering if im right or wrong so until the next led thread, i am getting to the point allbeit slowly.

Dyslexia is a cunt but not a measure of intelligenve and science just feqtures heavily in my education as with a lot here in the Uk but thats a measure of how clever our country is generally. Can throw a stone here and hit someone with a science degree easily.

Weed however has made me a little thick so even ill have to hit the physics before the next led heat science thread, this is thread no 3 so far in my dingslow1 v led claims.

See you next thread

No disrespect to anyone but wtf was this thread about?

Thermal dynamics, pissing contest, dyslexia, HPS LED's?

Cx2H said:

No disrespect to anyone but wtf was this thread about?

Thermal dynamics, pissing contest, dyslexia, HPS LED's?

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Abnormal psychology.

Cx2H said:

No disrespect to anyone but wtf was this thread about?

Thermal dynamics, pissing contest, dyslexia, HPS LED's?

Click to expand...

This thread is a primer for a the next thread which will talk about heat from a hps bulb and calculate the amount of energy in joules passed onto the grow space by all three heat transfers and then theorize how much a hps can heat the air as it rushes through the tent.

Either im right or wrong but was hoping there was some science types who would just whip up the equation and do the maths thus proving led sales science right or down right rubbish.

I and others have already written how led is a weak light and par/ppfd and crap is not the be all and end all ergo why they dont outyeild hps lights here and on many forums.

Pretty much just science stuff dude

Kingrow1 said:

This thread is a primer for a the next thread which will talk about heat from a hps bulb and calculate the amount of energy in joules passed onto the grow space by all three heat transfers and then theorize how much a hps can heat the air as it rushes through the tent.

Either im right or wrong but was hoping there was some science types who would just whip up the equation and do the maths thus proving led sales science right or down right rubbish.

I and others have already written how led is a weak light and par/ppfd and crap is not the be all and end all ergo why they dont outyeild hps lights here and on many forums.

Pretty much just science stuff dude

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One trick pony.

Chunky Stool said:

One trick pony.

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You do understand the concept of 'Joules' in energy transfer in physics?

You do know that this is possible to determine the air temperature increase from hps to air ventilating at say 400cfm in a grow tent right?

One trick yes but still way more educated and much less hated than you here so pipe up or sit the fuck down noobie noo

Kingrow1 said:

You do understand the concept of 'Joules' in energy transfer in physics?

You do know that this is possible to determine the air temperature increase from hps to air ventilating at say 400cfm in a grow tent right?

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Only if you can accurately measure and control all the variables that exist in any real world thermodynamic system. I sincerely hope you're not going to stick a thermometer in a grow tent and call it science.
Too many people have already done that and its probably part of the reason this stupid argument is still going on.
Let me make the science behind the claims made by LED proponents as simple as possible for anyone reading this that doesn't quite get whats being debated....
More efficient lights turn more of the power they are supplied into usable light than less efficient lights. This allows you to use less total power to generate a specific par/pfd/ppfd number than a less efficient light. Less power equals less heat. Where is the controversy?

Kingrow1 said:

You do understand the concept of 'Joules' in energy transfer in physics?

You do know that this is possible to determine the air temperature increase from hps to air ventilating at say 400cfm in a grow tent right?

One trick yes but still way more educated and much less hated than you here so pipe up or sit the fuck down noobie noo

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Let's compare plants and see who the noob is.

Wadaya say?

Show us what your bro science can grow!

NanoGadget said:

Only if you can accurately measure and control all the variables that exist in any real world thermodynamic system. I sincerely hope you're not going to stick a thermometer in a grow tent and call it science.
Too many people have already done that and its probably part of the reason this stupid argument is still going on.
Let me make the science behind the claims made by LED proponents as simple as possible for anyone reading this that doesn't quite get whats being debated....
More efficient lights turn more of the power they are supplied into usable light than less efficient lights. This allows you to use less total power to generate a specific par/pfd/ppfd number than a less efficient light. Less power equals less heat. Where is the controversy?

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Then why if i delve do i find gigh levels of contra science, say this document which goes on to conclude that hps raises leaf temp by a mere 1.3c over led and that thermal energy is thermal energy.

This document gives me a lot of food for thought, i feel compelled to discuss the flip side of this coin.

I think theres a more complete science out there than what is sold here and that leds arent much different to hps.

The study dose cite a lot of what ive said here although breaks it down a shitload more.

This just in passing, pretty sure my next thread will be way more science'y and concise.

Need not be an argument but i dont believe the info on led v hps is anywhere near correct yet.

I would only add one thing. Heat is generated generally based on wattage. The savings is in a lower wattage requiring less heat reduction. If you can run a 500 watt Quantum board in your space and grow like a 1000 watt HPS you will generate less heat.

I have a few lights. As I add the lights to the tent the heat becomes an issue (no air cooled hoods to wick it away).

I run a 315 CMH in my 4 x 4 and it hits 25C I add 200 watts of vero it hits 29.5 I add 135 watts of quantum and no vero i hit 28. The reflective tent is probably exacerbating the effect (I think energy transfer back to heat captured in the tent).

I am just saying 1 watt of light produces an amount of heat. And efficiency does not reduce the heat proportionally as many say. IMHO and my limited grow experience.

Chunky Stool said:

Let's compare plants and see who the noob is.

Wadaya say?

Show us what your bro science can grow!

Click to expand...

I dont use bro science and one thing thats always been hard is seperating that from real science here which is why im questioning leds as they have laid down the most bro science here in the last half a decade. To even propose that led science has been right since day one will get you laughed out of threads like Mr Blurple a while back, now five corrections later i shouldnt check the exacting science and just take your word hmmmmmmmm

Might be better if you just give up now, despite what led'ers copy and paste theres quite the following that think your still full of poop.

I cant change these facts sorry...

gwheels said:

I would only add one thing. Heat is generated generally based on wattage. The savings is in a lower wattage requiring less heat reduction. If you can run a 500 watt Quantum board in your space and grow like a 1000 watt HPS you will generate less heat.

I have a few lights. As I add the lights to the tent the heat becomes an issue (no air cooled hoods to wick it away).

I run a 315 CMH in my 4 x 4 and it hits 25C I add 200 watts of vero it hits 29.5 I add 135 watts of quantum and no vero i hit 28. The reflective tent is probably exacerbating the effect (I think energy transfer back to heat captured in the tent).

I am just saying 1 watt of light produces an amount of heat. And efficiency does not reduce the heat proportionally as many say. IMHO and my limited grow experience.

Click to expand...

The main difference in terms of heat generated per watt is where the heat is generated. A portion will always be radiating from the ballast/driver whixh can be removed from your grow space. The rest of the difference is in the amount of IR they emit. IR raises surface temperature when absorbed by whatever its hitting.

gwheels said:

I would only add one thing. Heat is generated generally based on wattage. The savings is in a lower wattage requiring less heat reduction. If you can run a 500 watt Quantum board in your space and grow like a 1000 watt HPS you will generate less heat.

I have a few lights. As I add the lights to the tent the heat becomes an issue (no air cooled hoods to wick it away).

I run a 315 CMH in my 4 x 4 and it hits 25C I add 200 watts of vero it hits 29.5 I add 135 watts of quantum and no vero i hit 28. The reflective tent is probably exacerbating the effect (I think energy transfer back to heat captured in the tent).

I am just saying 1 watt of light produces an amount of heat. And efficiency does not reduce the heat proportionally as many say. IMHO and my limited grow experience.

Click to expand...

I dont think for a second heat is just based on wattage sorry and scientifically feel this is an archaic view here.

Heat is thermal convective conductive and radiating, the same principle a leaf uses to balance its energy budget. Before that i used a thermometer and dunceness was bliss.

NanoGadget said:

The main difference in terms of heat generated per watt is where the heat is generated. A portion will always be radiating from the ballast/driver whixh can be removed from your grow space. The rest of the difference is in the amount of IR they emit. IR raises surface temperature when absorbed by whatever its hitting.

Click to expand...

I would also say I am not mass producing. Kingrow1 likes HPS because they work. Every time all the time. I would imagine it is easier to wick away heat too.

For me 1 pound in a 4 x 4 is perfection. If I were to fill my garage with lights and grow more industrially I would probably change my mind but I love cobs. I love CMH and the quantum board....i will let you know. I bought it before i needed it but they stock out so i have it now. I am a collector.....of lights

Kingrow1 said:

I dont think for a second heat is just based on wattage sorry and scientifically feel this is an archaic view here.

Click to expand...

It is not 1 to 1 but 1000 watts of quantum and 1000 watts of cob and 1000 watts of CMH they produce very close to the same heat.

The heat is moved a lot. Like in a cob if you can get the fins out of your grow space you have no heat problem etc. The fins that displace heat, in a tent it goes back in the tent.

Kingrow1 said:

I dont use bro science and one thing thats always been hard is seperating that from real science here which is why im questioning leds as they have laid down the most bro science here in the last half a decade. To even propose that led science has been right since day one will get you laughed out of threads like Mr Blurple a while back, now five corrections later i shouldnt check the exacting science and just take your word hmmmmmmmm

Might be better if you just give up now, despite what led'ers copy and paste theres quite the following that think your still full of poop.

I cant change these facts sorry...

Click to expand...

Put up or shut up.
Show us your plants.

Kingrow1 said:

This thread is a primer for a the next thread which will talk about heat from a hps bulb and calculate the amount of energy in joules passed onto the grow space by all three heat transfers and then theorize how much a hps can heat the air as it rushes through the tent.

Either im right or wrong but was hoping there was some science types who would just whip up the equation and do the maths thus proving led sales science right or down right rubbish.

I and others have already written how led is a weak light and par/ppfd and crap is not the be all and end all ergo why they dont outyeild hps lights here and on many forums.

Pretty much just science stuff dude

Click to expand...

Type silver state relief into YouTube. Not saying I believe what’s said just pretty convincing

Jimmy the vest uk said:

Type silver state relief into YouTube. Not saying I believe what’s said just pretty convincing

Click to expand...

They started a big grow in 2016 with LED. Then I think they were going to expand. The question is, if they expanded did they continue buying LED?