Letters to health and justice ministers

VIANARCHRIS said:

I have not heard about that case, but I'm not sure what it has to do with legalization? We seem to have very different views on what legal means or looks like - it's all good, makes for an interesting discussion. I think it was a little unfair to say my attitude will be responsible for a shitty system. We haven't seen what that system looks like yet. As much as I've dreamed of the day (since high school), a wild west anarchy approach to marijuana is never going to happen. I have watched the attitudes change over the last 4 decades, but public opinion, especially in regards to use by kids, is still a barrier we have to cross and that involves compromise. I think people are ready to treat weed like alcohol and that is the best we can hope for at the moment. It is a huge step forward from the 1970's and as long as we are all allowed to grow for our own consumption, I can live with it. Regulations, rules, laws and taxes are a reality in civilized societies and I don't see MJ being excluded, unfortunately.

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Your position is held by most except they don't want to ever see people have the freedom to grow plants of their choosing in any way they see fit. If what they do harms others there are mechanisms in place to deal with that. There is plenty of incentive not to harm others. It is absurd that we would give the government that kind of power.

And the case is indeed related as the tweets he put out were tantamount to any internet disagreement you can imagine! Anyway, it's worth putting it out there. Pretty sure if they win you could charge me with criminal harassment for disagreeing with you because that's what the case amounts to.

GrowRock said:

That is the biggist load of crap I have ever heard... he voiced his opinion!! Fuck this...if he is guilty!!! then I gues everyone on the Internet with a fucking opinion is guilty!!!!

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Pretty much. It would be the worst precedent set in the history of Canadian courts (and there have been some truly remarkably bad ones) and would directly impact all facets of life.

gb123 said:

You're not allowed to disagree with feminists. You get charged with criminal harassment.


I guess we shall see how it ends up..

The take...?

....They want to toss the whole damn thing away and is why its gone on for three long years. they needed to come up with an excuse. .. Any of the people involved want to wash their hands of it all.
They know they all could easily lose their jobs for what they have done or go to jail themselves.
They know that the same actions taken against Greg could easily be directed towards them, and down they go...one after the other, the whole GIANT list of bullshit artists.

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I'd be really curious to read the minds of the women responsible for this. According to the witness whose testimony they did not allow because it came after evidence was allowed to be admitted - there were police, the prosecutor and all the girls making the charges involved in a conspiracy FFS. Just ridiculous.

The fact it's gone on 3 years does not give me warm and fuzzy feelings.

The sad part is what they did to him was actual criminal harassment and way beyond.

gb123 said:

the ramifications of it means.. any chick can get you put in jail until you prove you did nothing wrong.
Doesnt have to be a chick ....it can be you saying I was mean. and I scared you..Thats all!! and away you will go!!

Me thinks Grow rock doth snark to much...
take me away!!!

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It will be helpful if you are a female. Females are believed at a much higher rate than males are despite lying at higher rates than males do (many studies that prove this by the way for those who take offense to reality). Example there was a study done with respect to sexual behavior and mens answers were taken both in an anonymous way and in a personal up close interview and they were assured of confidentiality etc. Men's % of answers shifted pretty modestly. Women's answers shifted DRAMATICALLY. Over 80% of women on self surveys has admitted to telling a life changing lie to someone. Have you ever told someone a life changing lie? I haven't.

There is a genetic predisposition in our species to protect our females. It's for good reason if we want to survive and carry on. They are the only ones of us capable of having children. One guy can father a lot of kids and women have been the ones exerting evolutionary pressure on our side as they have been the ones who do the selection excepting certain cultures which were created IMO to completely work against this natural process. Don't know if you knew this but online dating sites do lots of surveys and get their members to rate other members profiles and such all the time so as to build information to help their clients find matches. Anyway, consistently, across all sites when you look at the 'attractiveness curve - which is to say whether someone finds you suitable or not' for males looks like a standard bell curve. Some females were exceptional, some not at all, most lied somewhere near the middle. Females? 80% of men consistently are viewed as below average. Again - this is another evolutionary measure to ensure the best genetics move on as females tend to be attracted to classic alpha males who can protect, provide, control a situation etc. If he's a nice guy on top of that they're going to be all over it as well. They selected for these traits. Having a loyal male partner is vital for a female as they were highly dependent on them for survival. Conversely the best way for a man to spread his genetics is to get as many women pregnant as possible (which is how you can explain certain kinds of guys who are literal dogs, whereas most of us are very loyal to our wives as we know they are hard to come by.. alphas tend to be more dog like in behavior because they can be.. anyway more evolutionary pressure)...

ahh fuck you know I'm gonna stop. I need to stop smoking killer wax and then coming here lol.. totally off the rails tangent. Btw I'm not judging here merely pointing out that our perceptions are very skewed by our reptile brains and evolution as reality is quite a bit different and necessarily so IMO. Women are actually the reason we are what we are today - they were the evolutionary pushers more than anything. But men are the reason society is what it is today. And without men society would collapse in a matter of days. As almost every important job that keeps society functioning is done by a man (lights on, roads paved, houses built, etc etc). But this is how we evolved. The current paradigm is completely warped it's unbelievable but folks let women get away with murder. I mean that literally, because we want to protect them because we know they are the only ones who can produce more to further our species.

Males conversely are quite disposable. For the reason I stated above. And as a result I don't think this case would have pressed forward at all if it were a female on female thing. And I think any male on male complaint would be dismissed in the same way males being raped by females are completely dismissed by everyone - even when it's a kid most of the time.

its actually vexatious abuse of process on the plaintifs part...... not criminal harassment
surprising part is the judge let it get this far

OGEvilgenius said:

It will be helpful if you are a female. Females are believed at a much higher rate than males are despite lying at higher rates than males do (many studies that prove this by the way for those who take offense to reality). Example there was a study done with respect to sexual behavior and mens answers were taken both in an anonymous way and in a personal up close interview and they were assured of confidentiality etc. Men's % of answers shifted pretty modestly. Women's answers shifted DRAMATICALLY. Over 80% of women on self surveys has admitted to telling a life changing lie to someone. Have you ever told someone a life changing lie? I haven't.

There is a genetic predisposition in our species to protect our females. It's for good reason if we want to survive and carry on. They are the only ones of us capable of having children. One guy can father a lot of kids and women have been the ones exerting evolutionary pressure on our side as they have been the ones who do the selection excepting certain cultures which were created IMO to completely work against this natural process. Don't know if you knew this but online dating sites do lots of surveys and get their members to rate other members profiles and such all the time so as to build information to help their clients find matches. Anyway, consistently, across all sites when you look at the 'attractiveness curve - which is to say whether someone finds you suitable or not' for males looks like a standard bell curve. Some females were exceptional, some not at all, most lied somewhere near the middle. Females? 80% of men consistently are viewed as below average. Again - this is another evolutionary measure to ensure the best genetics move on as females tend to be attracted to classic alpha males who can protect, provide, control a situation etc. If he's a nice guy on top of that they're going to be all over it as well. They selected for these traits. Having a loyal male partner is vital for a female as they were highly dependent on them for survival. Conversely the best way for a man to spread his genetics is to get as many women pregnant as possible (which is how you can explain certain kinds of guys who are literal dogs, whereas most of us are very loyal to our wives as we know they are hard to come by.. alphas tend to be more dog like in behavior because they can be.. anyway more evolutionary pressure)...

ahh fuck you know I'm gonna stop. I need to stop smoking killer wax and then coming here lol.. totally off the rails tangent. Btw I'm not judging here merely pointing out that our perceptions are very skewed by our reptile brains and evolution as reality is quite a bit different and necessarily so IMO. Women are actually the reason we are what we are today - they were the evolutionary pushers more than anything. But men are the reason society is what it is today. And without men society would collapse in a matter of days. As almost every important job that keeps society functioning is done by a man (lights on, roads paved, houses built, etc etc). But this is how we evolved. The current paradigm is completely warped it's unbelievable but folks let women get away with murder. I mean that literally, because we want to protect them because we know they are the only ones who can produce more to further our species.

Males conversely are quite disposable. For the reason I stated above. And as a result I don't think this case would have pressed forward at all if it were a female on female thing. And I think any male on male complaint would be dismissed in the same way males being raped by females are completely dismissed by everyone - even when it's a kid most of the time.

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I have not told a life changing lie to a man for a manipulative reason. I disagree that society would collapse without men...women pave roads, build houses...etc...we need men to keep the population moving along..so having said that, we only need a few men...lol...

cannadan said:

its actually vexatious abuse of process on the plaintifs part...... not criminal harassment
surprising part is the judge let it get this far

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Makes you wonder. If the judge rules in favor the judge and the prosecutor as well as all the girls probably need to be seriously investigated after it's hopefully overturned on appeal. I'm pretty sure there are a lot

WHATFG said:

I have not told a life changing lie to a man for a manipulative reason. I disagree that society would collapse without men...women pave roads, build houses...etc...we need men to keep the population moving along..so having said that, we only need a few men...lol...

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You're free to disagree. However I must argue otherwise.

Less than 10% of blue collar work is done by women and it is what keeps society going. 10% would not be enough of a work force to maintain society. There are reasons that have nothing to do with sexism that men wind up at the top of many fields too and it goes back to the evolutionary pressure I was discussing.

Female geniuses are outliers on a bell curve. It is not the case with men. Outliers on the bell curve for men you're talking IQ's over 180. For women you're talking genius level IQ's - this is evolutionary pressure. 2x as many females have been involved in the evolution of our species as have been males as a result of the stuff I outlined above. Similarly with men there are more exceptionally stupid. It's like what we've done with our favorite plant - a lot of times the best lines also have dud plants show up (that might be so awful as to wreck your room, hello hermies) at about a ratio as the really exceptional. It's a result of deliberate evolutionary pressure.

http://rgambler.com/2014/05/02/why-do-more-students-get-more-first-class-degrees-at-oxford-university-than-female-students/

A pretty good article about that there. It should be noted that many of the men that are very high in IQ are also completely struggle to read and perceive other peoples current states of minds and emotions and have a different set of challenges in life as a result. It's yin and yang really. We balance each other beautifully.

Moreover, women just aren't interested in these blue collar and STEM jobs. Yes, probably some would be forced into them and of course there are those who do enjoy them (but they are exceptions), but not before society seriously fell apart - there's only 3 days worth of food in the supply chain at any given time and almost all truck drivers are male as well as farmers and such. The countries with the most equality pushing policies in the world also have the largest divides in various STEM fields. Women in Sweden, by far the most progressive country in the world and also relatively rich, go into child care, nursing and that kind of field almost exclusively. Conversely in more supposedly regressive countries like the Philipines or India where poverty is a much bigger deal they go at a much higher rate into STEM fields because the pay is higher. If you give a male infant pictures to observe he will tend to favor pictures of machines over pictures of people. Females tend to be the opposite. It's not exclusive, like you said there are females involved in these fields. But they are rare, just like males who love to take care of children and such are more rare as it's not really how we've been wired.

All through our evolution we have been complimentary of each other. Only today with modern feminism - which is a very poisonous ideology that blames all men for all problems which is not unlike blaming all jews or any other group for all problems (seriously, read any feminist and replace male/men with Jew and the patriarchy with jewish conspiracy and tell me how they read, it's not pretty - especially when you dig more into their sources and find many of them are complete bunk ie: 1/5 women will be sexually assault on campus - a complete fabrication and myth). They've put us against each other to divide while they conquer. This case with Gregory Allen Elliot is a part of the conquering process (freedom of speech, btw political correctness is a term invented by Marxists in the early communist countries).

Just like anything in politics, it's always about power and who gains it.

Anyway this GAE case is pretty important to everyone here who is going to want to voice opposition to any future policy IMO.

You're obviously well read..I'm curious how old you are? I also don't agree with feminism per se...

its the irrational thinking that gets people in trouble...and we all know with how hormones work...in both of us...that the issues at hand are just dumb.

just look at this place and how some go on and swear and get mad and upset, at their own doing really.

I want to grow it like I can grow tobacco, I want it sold in liquor stores due to its intoxicant nature. It's the best place to sell it IMO because they're already established and regulated. Where liquor stores are private, they can sell it too.

I want advertisement bans for mj products that are smoked or inhaled due to the obvious carcinogenic properties of smoking. Edibles and other products can be advertised in the same way as beer.

I want bootlegging laws to be strict like they are for tobacco and booze, but the tax rate must be considered so the bootleg/black markets are not able to grow and prosper like it has for tobacco in highly taxed areas.

I want the legal age to be the same for booze and smokes.

I want these things for everyone, it's all completely realistic and will be a huge step forward. Everyone benefits and the Med users can be happy knowing they can grow their own and not have to worry about "the system".

OGEvilgenius said:

Your position is held by most except they don't want to ever see people have the freedom to grow plants of their choosing in any way they see fit. If what they do harms others there are mechanisms in place to deal with that. There is plenty of incentive not to harm others. It is absurd that we would give the government that kind of power.

And the case is indeed related as the tweets he put out were tantamount to any internet disagreement you can imagine! Anyway, it's worth putting it out there. Pretty sure if they win you could charge me with criminal harassment for disagreeing with you because that's what the case amounts to.

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I am not understanding what exactly it is that you want. You don't want any part of legal and regulated? We are not 'giving the government power'...that is how the world works. From putting pants on when you get out of bed to the way you raise your kids to the condition of your car. There are laws around EVERYTHING we do and to think that marijuana will be the one thing that escapes is unrealistic. I can see your vision, but I am old enough and wise enough to know it is merely a pipe dream. Hopefully we end up with a system that works for everyone.
I haven't researched the court case you are talking about, but...as long as I don't threaten or slander, I will say what I want, where I want and there isn't a damn thing anyone can do about it. You do not go to jail for pissing off feminists in Canada...period. We have a constitution that guarantees that.

WHATFG said:

You're obviously well read..I'm curious how old you are? I also don't agree with feminism per se...

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I am in my mid 30's. It's really Karen Straughan who is really well read because a lot of this stuff is information presented to me on youtube with me following up to read some of the studies she cites. She's a real level headed lady. Worth checking her out on youtube.

VIANARCHRIS said:

I am not understanding what exactly it is that you want. You don't want any part of legal and regulated? We are not 'giving the government power'...that is how the world works. From putting pants on when you get out of bed to the way you raise your kids to the condition of your car. There are laws around EVERYTHING we do and to think that marijuana will be the one thing that escapes is unrealistic. I can see your vision, but I am old enough and wise enough to know it is merely a pipe dream. Hopefully we end up with a system that works for everyone.
I haven't researched the court case you are talking about, but...as long as I don't threaten or slander, I will say what I want, where I want and there isn't a damn thing anyone can do about it. You do not go to jail for pissing off feminists in Canada...period. We have a constitution that guarantees that.

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I agree that he shouldn't go to jail, but he's already had his life basically destroyed and this trial has been ongoing for three years. I appreciate your sentiment, obviously. There is a very real chance he does go to jail for this. The fact it even got to court says it all. It should never have been there.

Here's hoping it doesn't work that way. If it does I fear for the worst in this country. If it doesn't, I will have a small glimmer of hope - especially if the people involved in bringing the charges get seriously investigated which seems worth while.

It's not unrealistic. People say nothing about all kinds of poisonous plants that folks grow. No one's worrying about the kids then. There are berries you can grow that have an excellent chance of killing you if you eat one. The same people responsible for the war on drugs are responsible for the rise in feminism. They want to take all your rights from you. And now they are trying give a dog a bone so to speak but still maintaining massive authoritarian power including harsh penalties for those who do anything with the plant outside of the law. Sounds a lot like Washington State to me. Or the MMPR however instead of just patients, everyone and their dog.

Even in Colorado the black market is booming as a result of restrictive policy and regressive taxes.

It should be treated like any other plant.

If you give an inch, they will take a mile.

It snowballed because a few mixed up chicks lied about what they were up to, and cried wolf.
The mob got hold and the rest is whats happening.
The truth is that the system should be held accountable and all involved, as this man has done NOTHING wrong!
but he's being hung to make their MISGUIDED thinking a reality!!!

You can make up what ever you like and say what ever you want and have people charged!!!

Then have to prove they're innocence!!!

GUILTY until proven innocent!

OGEvilgenius said:

I am in my mid 30's. It's really Karen Straughan who is really well read because a lot of this stuff is information presented to me on youtube with me following up to read some of the studies she cites. She's a real level headed lady. Worth checking her out on youtube.



I agree that he shouldn't go to jail, but he's already had his life basically destroyed and this trial has been ongoing for three years. I appreciate your sentiment, obviously. There is a very real chance he does go to jail for this. The fact it even got to court says it all. It should never have been there.

Here's hoping it doesn't work that way. If it does I fear for the worst in this country. If it doesn't, I will have a small glimmer of hope - especially if the people involved in bringing the charges get seriously investigated which seems worth while.

It's not unrealistic. People say nothing about all kinds of poisonous plants that folks grow. No one's worrying about the kids then. There are berries you can grow that have an excellent chance of killing you if you eat one. The same people responsible for the war on drugs are responsible for the rise in feminism. They want to take all your rights from you. And now they are trying give a dog a bone so to speak but still maintaining massive authoritarian power including harsh penalties for those who do anything with the plant outside of the law. Sounds a lot like Washington State to me. Or the MMPR however instead of just patients, everyone and their dog.

Even in Colorado the black market is booming as a result of restrictive policy and regressive taxes.

It should be treated like any other plant.

If you give an inch, they will take a mile.

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My wife says fembots are ruining it for themselves and all women.

Seems to be a measured uptick in feminist propoganda in recent years. Man spreading? Really? Like there isn't more important things to worry about.

I thiink its hilarious people dont see what this trial is about...

oh well...sheeple will be sheeple...

gb123 said:

It snowballed because a few mixed up chicks lied about what they were up to, and cried wolf.
The mob got hold and the rest is whats happening.
The truth is that the system should be held accountable and all involved, as this man has done NOTHING wrong!
but he's being hung to make their MISGUIDED thinking a reality!!!

You can make up what ever you like and say what ever you want and have people charged!!!

Then have to prove they're innocence!!!

GUILTY until proven innocent!

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Most civil law related issues have turned the whole innocent until proven guilty thing on its head. Children being removed from parents, no trial judge or jury. Civil family law too. The whole thing is about establishing a totalitarian state. We're well on our way. The number of men killing themselves after divorce is far far too high and has only been rising.

gb123 said:

It snowballed because a few mixed up chicks lied about what they were up to, and cried wolf.
The mob got hold and the rest is whats happening.
The truth is that the system should be held accountable and all involved, as this man has done NOTHING wrong!
but he's being hung to make their MISGUIDED thinking a reality!!!

You can make up what ever you like and say what ever you want and have people charged!!!

Then have to prove they're innocence!!!

GUILTY until proven innocent!

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I KNOW THIS FIRST HAND...diff is ...we won in court....even though there was never any reason to come after us in the first place....totally fabricated situation ...People need to learn about narcissistic personality disorder.....because you can't pick your neighbours.
people/judges can still tell when someone is lying ...when on the stand...it becomes very obvious under
examination...unless your a really good actor...that is.
I would guess these girls are being instructed on what to say....probably in depth....

OGEvilgenius said:

I am in my mid 30's. It's really Karen Straughan who is really well read because a lot of this stuff is information presented to me on youtube with me following up to read some of the studies she cites. She's a real level headed lady. Worth checking her out on youtube.



I agree that he shouldn't go to jail, but he's already had his life basically destroyed and this trial has been ongoing for three years. I appreciate your sentiment, obviously. There is a very real chance he does go to jail for this. The fact it even got to court says it all. It should never have been there.

Here's hoping it doesn't work that way. If it does I fear for the worst in this country. If it doesn't, I will have a small glimmer of hope - especially if the people involved in bringing the charges get seriously investigated which seems worth while.

It's not unrealistic. People say nothing about all kinds of poisonous plants that folks grow. No one's worrying about the kids then. There are berries you can grow that have an excellent chance of killing you if you eat one. The same people responsible for the war on drugs are responsible for the rise in feminism. They want to take all your rights from you. And now they are trying give a dog a bone so to speak but still maintaining massive authoritarian power including harsh penalties for those who do anything with the plant outside of the law. Sounds a lot like Washington State to me. Or the MMPR however instead of just patients, everyone and their dog.

Even in Colorado the black market is booming as a result of restrictive policy and regressive taxes.

It should be treated like any other plant.

If you give an inch, they will take a mile.

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I see what you are saying, but mj is not lettuce. There are many plants growing in the wild or used for landscaping that are poisonous, however there is no attraction to consume them. Many other plants are controlled.Try growing cocoa or certain poppies or magic mushrooms or peyote...all illegal. Even tobacco is controlled- 15 kg limit/personal use only. If you have a listen to the Kirk Tousaw interview last night, he see's post-prohibition Canada having the best system in the world and one other jurisdictions will emulate. What do you envision 'no controls' looking like? What advantage would we gain? I'm curious. Like I said, I will be happy when everyone can grow for their own use and smoking a joint is viewed as the responsible alternative to drinking. I've been fighting for this for 35 years, so maybe I'm just old and willing to settle?! lol

VIANARCHRIS said:

I see what you are saying, but mj is not lettuce. There are many plants growing in the wild or used for landscaping that are poisonous, however there is no attraction to consume them. Many other plants are controlled.Try growing cocoa or certain poppies or magic mushrooms or peyote...all illegal. Even tobacco is controlled- 15 kg limit/personal use only. If you have a listen to the Kirk Tousaw interview last night, he see's post-prohibition Canada having the best system in the world and one other jurisdictions will emulate. What do you envision 'no controls' looking like? What advantage would we gain? I'm curious. Like I said, I will be happy when everyone can grow for their own use and smoking a joint is viewed as the responsible alternative to drinking. I've been fighting for this for 35 years, so maybe I'm just old and willing to settle?! lol

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Not illegal to grow peyote or mushrooms (illegal to harvest and dry out). Mushrooms grow friggin everywhere anyway. It is illegal to grow cocoa. Not that it would do well here (even indoors).

We gain the advantage of instantly being able to open up the hemp market in a huge way. It is extremely prohibitively expensive to grow compared to other crops because of stupid regulations and rules. We gain the advantage of not setting awful authoritarian precedent - which is everything in the law by the way. Also would put the price of cannabis where it should be which is a tiny fraction of where it is now.

It would open us open to potentially huge economic gains through innovative technologies that could not be developed in a less free environment because there would be far less incentive. Hemp processing - which is very very behind the times given how long it's been outlawed and post industrial processes. For example the U of A recently made a battery out of hemp that's equivalent or superior to graphene based batteries only infinitely cheaper and less damaging to the environment (not damaging at all really to the environment).

Freedom always brings good things with it, even if it's not perfect. Authoritarianism always leads to awful things for the majority of people. Great for some tiny minority though.

You should be able to try to grow cocoa too if you want (good luck with that in Canada). Opium as well. Would save the health care system a lot of money and would produce many fewer deaths than the concentrated pain killers they sell now (also way better studied as it's been around forever). You can grow poppies effectively in Canada. But people being independent? That's no good if you're trying to lord over them.

*I guess I should say it would be an opportunity to possibly reverse precedent already set.