MMJ Caregivers and Taxes

rckjames

Member
For those of you who are active Caregivers are you going to file for taxes? As a person trying to stay as legal as I can, I don't necessarily know how to go about this. I figured this could be a good topic for those of us who are trying to do things the right way.

Do I really need to provide receipts for my non-profit?
Can I use my gas/nutes/electricity/etc. as write offs?


(I'm personally not familiar with taxes at all, actually filing for the first time in 3 years. :-()
 

HB DC

Active Member
Sowing cannabis is against Federal law...

A patient may get away with medical expenses but a caregiver is to get reimbursed by their patients which would leave you at Zero (no profit)... A caregiver can not get paid a fee for his/her services...

So I recommend talking to a lawyer....
 

Rck James

Member
I clearly understand that. But at the same time, don't non profits file taxes still? If so, why wouldn't this be treated in the same manor? This post also was meant for paying taxes as well... Guess since there's no profit we don't have to pay?

I'm not trying to be defensive, yet have an open mind. In fact, not filing taxes just makes it a little easier for me/us. I just want to be as legal as I can and cover my ass.
 

Lucius Vorenus

Well-Known Member
Do NOT mention Cannabis growing or try and file for tax reimbursement on it at all. If you do, please come back to this thread in a couple of years and let us know how that audit went down for you.
 

aisach

Active Member
After many years trying to keep a business within regulatory guidelines here is the most valuable lesson I learned.
When it is an issue - they will let you know. We often waited for the state (whoever) to tell us about something before we tried to figure it out. Why? Because there is no sense in fixing something if you dont know how. When they know they will tell us. Until then follow the above advise and stay under the radar. If you want to be a guinee pig, or be the first, or be the one that has to take the issue public, or hire lawyers or public relations experts, then pushing the issue is the pathway for you. If you are like the rest of us that seek to do the right thing but dont know how - stop struggling - because the rules are not clear. Relax and wait for the rules to be clear.
 

BeaverHuntr

Well-Known Member
Good thread I always wondered about this just from being a grower...What about using receipts from purchased grow equipment and nutrients as a medical write off? I always wondered what happens if and when the IRS audits you and they respond " Marijuana is still illegal on a federal level" you're pretty much fucked right?
 

headtreep

Well-Known Member
This should be reported on the state tax section not federal. State of AZ let's you deduct 100% medical.
 

headtreep

Well-Known Member
The tax deductions are gray area and lately the IRS hasn't been playing nice with the Golden State's dispensary business expenses. I would not make any deductions personally at this point for caregiver or patient but in the future it maybe valid.
 

kingsti

Member
New to Forum. Great stuff. Just read this Thread, highlights an issue I have spent a ton of time wrestling with

1. Reality - IRC § 61 (Gross Income) Gross Income for tax purposes pursuant to IRC § 61 is like a massive black hole that sucks into it any thing you receive and have control over that has any value (find a penny on the sidewalk, you have received something of value and your gross income when up by 1 cent _ unless it is a 1909S VDB penny, in which case its E-Bay value should be included in your gross income). Certain things are not included in gross income only if there exists a specific IRC code provision that excludes such thing ((ex. gifts you receive from granddad - IRC § 102). Thus, monetary and non-monetary reimbursement payments made to a Caregiver by his MMJ patient are Gross Income to the Caregiver unless an IRC code section OR IRS pronouncement applies {there is no IRC code section that says otherwise]

2. Deductions to offset the Gross Income. Fine, if a Caregiver's reimbursements are gross income the Caregiver will offset that gross income with related expenses? NO! Wait a minute, the Caregiver has receipts for supplies, grow materials, etc. and those expenses are clearly deductible pursuant to IRC § 162 (business deductions). The Tax Law Death Star, IRC § 280E trumps all the IRC Code deduction sections and prohibits reducing gross income for ANY expenses related to an illegal activity, and specifically includes expenses paid or incurred in connection with carrying on any trade or business if such trade or business consists of trafficking in controlled substances. Id.

3. IRS helps limit the tax/financial disaster - The Reimbursement Offset Rule. When a Caregiver performs services for a MMJ Patient pursuant to a non-employee arrangement (e.g., independent contractor relationship) which is the case, any amounts paid to the Caregiver and labeled as 'reimbursements' may be excluded from the Caregiver's gross income to the extent of the actual/real expenses incurred by the Caregiver. Once the aggregate reimbursement payments to the Caregiver exceed the Caregiver's out-of-pocket grow costs, the excess of such reimbursement payments is profit and gross income to the Caregiver (and considered self-employment income subject to self-employment taxes). Also, if an amount paid to the Caregiver is not labeled as an "expense reimbursement" but say a grow fee, that specific amount would be considered gross income. These rules were established by the IRS in Revenue Ruling 1977-280 and are valid today (text of ruling @ http://www.charitableplanning.com/document/675843 [crucial to cut and paste to understand rationale] One has to read the IRS ruling a few times. Although facts underlying ruling 77-280 involve reimbursements to foster care parents, the conclusions reached in the ruling apply to any fact pattern involving reimbursements to a person (i.e., Caregiver) in a non-employee relationship with the payer (i.e., MMJ Patient). Rev. Rul. 77-780 contains "4" examples in which reimbursement payments are made. The tax treatment of reimbursements in the Caregiver/MMJ patient context is covered by examples "3" and "4." In both examples "3" and "4" reimbursement payments in excess of actual costs incurred by the receiving party were considered profit and self-employment income (also payments designated as "fees" as set forth in the operative agreements were considered items of gross income to recipient.

4. The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly. The Good. Without the blessing of the IRS offset rule in Rev. Rul. 1977-280, a Caregiver would have to include all reimbursement payments as gross income and would be prohibited under IRC § 280E from deducting any of his out-of-pocket grow expenses. Under the offset rule the Caregiver's gross income is limited to the actual dollars realized over his documented grow costs (actually dollars he is ahead). The Bad - a Caregiver does realize gross income and taxable income equal to the amount reimbursement payments received exceed his cost outlays. The Ugly - any gross income/taxable income (will be the same amount) realized by the Caregiver is subject to self-employment tax (which under The Fiscal Cliff Tax Act equals 15.3%). Consequences - since a Caregiver probably will be in a low tax bracket the income tax on his grow income profit likely would be minimal, but the 15.3% self-employment tax add-on would hurt.

5. Course of Action. The clean approach, and one that would not shout "I'm involved in a federally prohibited cannabis activity" would be to (a) report a Caregiver's gross income on line 21 of Form 1040 (other income) and perhaps describe the income as "excess reimbursements" and (b) fill out Form 1040 (Schedule SE) and enter the gross income from line 21 and determine the amount of any self-employment tax due. Of course there exist fervent Protest Groups which consider the income tax to be unconstitutional (ask Wesley Snipes) and would file no return. Or, one could believe (like that Tinker Bell is real) that MMj activities such as Caregiver /patient are non profit and not run as a business and omit any inclusion of any profit received from helping a MMJ patient.

CAVEAT -None of the analysis or statements made in this post are intended to provide legal advice, or guidance as to the tax matters discussed therein and may in fact not properly reflect the federal tax law as it applies to a Caregiver/MMJ patient relationship. Each member should consult with his or her tax advisor for guidance with complying with applicable federal tax laws and completing his or her federal income tax return/I did the research and analysis for my own interest but wanted to share for others to consider and perhaps comment.
 

HB DC

Active Member
Not to be a douche...

Any "income" from activities that are illegal under the same said statues (Federal Books) can not be used on your tax papers.

Income - the sum of all the wages, salaries, profits, interests payments, rents and other forms of earnings received... What are earnings?
Earning - the net benefits of a corparoations operation. Earnings is also the amount on which corporate tax is due.

Being a Designated caregiver is not corporate nor shall it have an income. Period. Anything outside of this is not protected by the AMMA in the spirit or the intent.

A caregiver breaking even (if MMJ was not illegal) with their numbers would not have to report them on their taxes. Only income. If you are breaking even there is no income mate!


Nice disclaimer... I read that first! I bet you do taxes...

"excess reimbursements" - IMO - Bad idea.


Funny Fact - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_R._Caldwell (Reminds me of the recent Kingman arrest...)

This is what started the "War On Drugs" my friends.... (Alcohol prohibition ring a bell- taxation controls the legal and illegal flow)
TAX CODE: § 280E. Expenditures in connection with the illegal sale of drugs.
No deduction or credit shall be allowed for any amount paid or incurred during the taxable year in carrying on any trade or business if such trade or business consists of trafficking in controlled substances which is prohibited by Federal law or the law of any State in which such trade or business is conducted.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/280E

 

kingsti

Member
[1[SUP]st[/SUP] – The references cited in your post are wrong and have no relevance to potential federal income tax consequesnces to a caregiver! The federal income tax law is blind as to the nature of the activity that gives rise to an item of Gross Income, and dollars or property received in any illegal activity is Gross Income. The famous gangster Al Capone is a good example – and see this link that discusses the Gross Income issue with marijuana activities - http://boards.answers.findlaw.com/index.php/topic/223349-legal-marijuana-and-federal-income-tax/]

[The bare term "income” or AMMA definitions have no relevance to determine whether a caregiver’s activities have federal income tax consequences and require the filing of a federal tax return. A caregiver like any other individual for federal income tax purposes must determine if he/she realized any “Gross Income.” This controlling term “Gross Income” is defined pursuant to Section 61 of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986, hereinafter the “Code” and applicable Treasury Tax Regulations). Code Section 61 does not discriminate and applies to any individual, partnership, corporation (including non profits), organizaion (ex. social club, community garden), trust, or any other legally recognized entity. The all powerful term “Gross Income” is unlimited in scope and any tangible or intangible item or right a caregiver receives and has control over is part of his Gross Income as measured by its value (unless exempted under certain other Code sections not relevant to this discussion). How braod is its scope - “Treasury Regulation Sec. 1.61-1 Gross income. (a) General definition. Gross income means all income from whatever source derived, unless excluded by law. Gross income includes income realized in any form, whether in money, property, or services.... Section 61 lists the more common items of gross income for purposes of illustration. For purposes of further illustration, Sec. 1.61-14 mentions several miscellaneous items of gross income not listed specifically in section 61. Gross income, however, is not limited to the items so enumerated.”]

[Even assuming a caregiver has enough expenses to quote "breaks even" such intuitive observation is irrelevant for federal income tax purposes. There are 2 separate steps mandated under the federal income tax law in such a situation (1) a caregiver (taxpayer) must first calculate his/her Gross Income regardless of any potential allowable expenses and this Gross Income amount would have to be reflected on his federal tax From 1040, most likely Schedule C; and (2) the caregiver would then deduct from the Gross Income his allowable expenses to determine any amount of “Taxable Income” from his caregiver activities. Instead, your approach impermissibly melds the 2 steps into 1 and concludes since the Gross Income and deductions net out there is no "income" and therefore nothing to report for federal tax purposes.
Again, by relying on the term "income" to support your conclusion fails to recognize that the federal income tax law demands the application of a 2 step calculation, not to determine "income" but to determine if the taxpayer has any "taxable income." For example, if an unincorporated business owner has gross income of $20,000 but also expenses of $20,000 his "taxable income" is zero but, his Gross Income is still $20,000 and the term or concept of “income” is meaningless. Based upon these facts this taxpayer would have to report the Gross Income of $20,000 on Form 1040 (Schedule C). He would then list his $20,000 of expenses on such schedule with the result that the Schedule C attached to his Federal Form 1040 would reflect a "taxable income" of zero.
So you will say what's the big deal for being required by the federal income tax law to use this 2 step calculation when the taxpayer ends up with zero taxable income? I would say HUGE, because expenses are prohibited as deductions from Gross Income when the activity giving rise to the related Gross Income is illegal under federal law. Section 280E of the Code. As a result, if a caregiver with the facts stated above were audited, he would have $20,000 of Gross Income and $20,000 of Taxable Income because he would be denied any deduction for related expenses as his activity involves marijuana, a controlled substance, and is illegal under federal law.

That is why I did the research and found the Treasury Department’s Revenue Ruling 1977-280 that, for administration convenience, sanctioned an offset rule for reimbursements received in the context of a non-employee relationship. The conclusion reached in the ruling was not that the recipient (our caregiver) had no taxable income because of his offsetting expenses BUT he did not realize any Gross Income by reason of the ruling’s Offset principle – net/net taxpayer’s net worth was the same after the transaction as it was before the transaction. The Offset Rule sanctioned by Rev. Rul. 1977-280 is crucial for the caregiver by allowing him to reduce his reimbursement Gross Income dollar-for-dollar for his expenses rather than having such expenses treated as deductions and barred by Section 280E of the Code. ]


[Actually try to help people minimize their taxes]

[while a bad idea what are the facts, is the caregiver receiving reimbursement payments which exceed his cash expenses (the value of the time spent by caregiver is not an expense for Fed tax purposes]

[thanks for your reply]
 

HB DC

Active Member

Exactly...

"Federal law prohibits taxpayers, however, from deducting any expense of a trade or business that consists of the trafficking of
a controlled substance such as marijuana...."

"The taxpayer in CHAMP was a legitimate (under State law) operation that had a second business (providing caregiving services) and we applied section 280E
there. The dispensing of medical marijuana, while legal in California (among other States), is illegal under Federal law. Congress in section 280E has set an illegality
under Federal law as one trigger to preclude a taxpayer from deducting expenses incurred in a medical marijuana dispensary business. This is true even if the
business is legal under State law..."

I would agree that the model in Arizona is in favor of the dispensary model which is bound to fail... The caregiver model will show more favor to the patients and likely be a tad bit more smooth sailing! section 280E is what started the so called "War on Drugs" only if it were amended. Imagine the tax revenues the IMF would see... HA
 
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