Most effecient chips!

ANC said:

Yeah but they pack real good density on those middle strips, they are somewhere in the middle of the 3 options in each length when it comes to lumen/dollar.
I honestly don't mind 80CRI, sure, I'd like higher with the same output.... 6 bars will give me about 300W of lm301B in a form factor designed for a 3x3 It should penetrate like a motherfucker.

Click to expand...

Have you seen the german 50cm strips with LM301b, bro? They have 98 diodes, 7s14p(10 more like L06 strips) and are availble in 2700 to 6500°k/CRI80 with and without solderless connectors. They have less than 20v but 2,8A max current and can run on HLG-xxxH-20A or B series drivers. 58,8w, 9400lm(3,5k), 16,90€ per strip incl. german VAT(2€ less if you take 15). You would pay 19% less without VAT but the shipping costs are a little higher. But compared against digikey prices for L06 strips that's still a real bargain. You can also cut them because each of the 14 module has 4 own solder pads.

Solder pads, 2700-6500°k,
https://www.led-tech.de/de/50cm-Alustreifen-mit-98x-Samsung-LM301B-LEDs

Solderless but better bin and only available in 3500°k till now..
https://www.led-tech.de/de/50cm-Alustreifen-mit-98x-Samsung-LM301B-LEDs-3500k-und-Steckerbuchsen

Fuckinc can't think straight through this flu.
OK I made a little table to compare my options in terms of Samsung strips.
The results was something like I thought it would be. The more efficient they got the less total density they used, which is great in terms of power usage, not so great in terms of output.

Comparing F series H_Inlux and Q
F 4 dual rows, Max output 69 360lm for 412W
H 8 single rows, Max output 63 2880lm for 357W
Q 16 single rows, Max output 58 888lm for 315W

So a 24% savings in running cost but a 20% reduction in total output (I HAVE TO ADD IN LUMENS, the PAR numbers may be different).
So one can run 12/12 for $53 per year less on the Qs, but unless it has stellar spectrum, I think you are going to be out of a 5th of your harvest.

Please correct me if you are familiar with the spectrum of the H or Qs and this is far off.

Randomblame said:

Have you seen the german 50cm strips with LM301b, bro? They have 98 diodes, 7s14p(10 more like L06 strips) and are availble in 2700 to 6500°k/CRI80 with and without solderless connectors. They have less than 20v but 2,8A max current and can run on HLG-xxxH-20A or B series drivers. 58,8w, 9400lm(3,5k), 16,90€ per strip incl. german VAT(2€ less if you take 15). You would pay 19% less without VAT but the shipping costs are a little higher. But compared against digikey prices for L06 strips that's still a real bargain. You can also cut them because each of the 14 module has 4 own solder pads.

Solder pads, 2700-6500°k,
https://www.led-tech.de/de/50cm-Alustreifen-mit-98x-Samsung-LM301B-LEDs

Solderless but better bin and only available in 3500°k till now..
https://www.led-tech.de/de/50cm-Alustreifen-mit-98x-Samsung-LM301B-LEDs-3500k-und-Steckerbuchsen

Click to expand...

I'll have a look, the free shipping from Digikey makes me somewhat of a captive audience though..
I fucking hate solderless boards, I simply soldered through that shitty plastic connector on my F's

welight said:

We do a full range of Semiled strips from 385nm to 430nm but only in 280mm, Semileds in image below. We could certainly do 660/420 mix version. What ratio?

Cheers
Mark

Click to expand...

I need something thats 2 feet but i guess i could do it with 2 strips.

Id be looking for an 9 to 1 output red to blue, about 25 w of output (thats 12ish per 1 footer) and looking for high efficieny reds. Its still in planning though but if you could give some rough details

Yeah OK did more sums, used a 320W driver as the limit, to compare apples to apples and yes you can now get a few more photons max out of the fixture on the Q, the price is still pretty much double...
Looks like I'll be buying F-series again.

Randomblame said:

Have you seen the german 50cm strips with LM301b, bro? They have 98 diodes, 7s14p(10 more like L06 strips) and are availble in 2700 to 6500°k/CRI80 with and without solderless connectors. They have less than 20v but 2,8A max current and can run on HLG-xxxH-20A or B series drivers. 58,8w, 9400lm(3,5k), 16,90€ per strip incl. german VAT(2€ less if you take 15). You would pay 19% less without VAT but the shipping costs are a little higher. But compared against digikey prices for L06 strips that's still a real bargain. You can also cut them because each of the 14 module has 4 own solder pads.

Solder pads, 2700-6500°k,
https://www.led-tech.de/de/50cm-Alustreifen-mit-98x-Samsung-LM301B-LEDs

Solderless but better bin and only available in 3500°k till now..
https://www.led-tech.de/de/50cm-Alustreifen-mit-98x-Samsung-LM301B-LEDs-3500k-und-Steckerbuchsen

Click to expand...

I am gonna buy 6 more of the solderless ones...they are awesome...

ANC said:

I'll have a look, the free shipping from Digikey makes me somewhat of a captive audience though..
I fucking hate solderless boards, I simply soldered through that shitty plastic connector on my F's

Click to expand...

They offer free shipping too(above 50€) but I'm not sure if only within the eu zone. You can chat with them directly on their website. There should pop up a window on the right side.. Even higher diode density, full aluminum PCB and can run at 2amps (~39w) without heatsink.

nachooo said:

I am gonna buy 6 more of the solderless ones...they are awesome...

Click to expand...

Probably the best for diy'ers currently. Cheap, flexible and you can literally cut them to any length you want. Connect two in parallel or series and you have an 1m strip with 196 diodes, ~118w and ~19.000lm(4k) and you still only need a small c-channel to keep them cool. 6 of them, 3m c-channel and an HLG-240H-20B makes a nice and cheap 4x 2' fixture and with an HLG-320H-20B it fits also for a 3x 3' aka 1m² tent. And you still pay less than 200 for such a combo... If one has 220-240vac ELG series fits as well up to the ELG-250... Saves you another 10er and would be dimmable down to 0/off also with the smaller ones.

4 x F-series double row is $186 , that is hard to compete with.

For an equal total light output I would need 199EUR worth of LM301 strips... (awkward size too)
So that is about $223, so that is a 20% jump in price. I know you said the strips don't need heatsinking but are they suggesting spanning them through the air with no backing
this would be quite a complicated frame to construct compared to a 4 bar one...

Randomblame said:

They offer free shipping too(above 50€) but I'm not sure if only within the eu zone. You can chat with them directly on their website. There should pop up a window on the right side.. Even higher diode density, full aluminum PCB and can run at 2amps (~39w) without heatsink.

Click to expand...

Have you got an idea of temps at 2amps?

welight said:

Let me put some costing together for you, drop me your email address in PM
Cheers
Mark

Click to expand...

welight said:

Let me put some costing together for you, drop me your email address in PM
Cheers
Mark

Click to expand...

done

ANC said:

Yeah it is nuts, In my local currency the H_I is R550 for 7910lm total
and the Q is R618 for 7360lm
you get 5% more light for your electricity on the Q though than the H_I

with things being this close you would likely not remember the extra expense taking one over the other, what do you think?
The high-density strips put down a fifth more light in the same area

Click to expand...

Ya, that's pretty close haha, with price within ~10% I think it gives the ability to focus soley on what will have the greatest impact for your custom area. I like hanging my lights a bit higher than most so perhaps I'd opt for the H_I, but I think there's +/- to both options so I'd try to optimize my decision for my area based on the different traits of each.

EDIT:
Looks like there are some other calcs that make my assumed ~10% price difference incorrect. I'd probably let my wallet choose if there were greater than a 10% initial price disparity. The effeciencies seem close enough that I think I'd let price be a factor up till there was only about a 10% disparity.

ChiefRunningPhist said:

Ya, that's pretty close haha, with price within ~10% I think it gives the ability to focus soley on what will have the greatest impact for your custom area. I like hanging my lights a bit higher so perhaps I'd opt for the H_I, but I think there's +/- to both options so I'd try to optimize my decision for my area based on the different traits of each.

Click to expand...

they are awful bright
I do not think you need half as many 4000k diodes as you my think if you got with the Q series,
you will need welding goggles to go in the grow room lol
I think I would go single row
do 6 rows of strips or 8 spread it out you will really like it
https://www.digikey.com/products/en?keywords=SI-B8T201B20US

welight said:

Thats the fixtures business, nothing to do with the Leds business
Cheers

Click to expand...

My bad, fake news!
I read a few articles, the wording is still leading me to think they sold all chip LEDc based light
You would know better, it is your profession, not mine.
Good to know,
Then it won't be messed with which is good judging by their superb products.
Perhaps then just raising some capital for that expansion, money's gotta come from somewhere.

Randomblame said:

Probably the best for diy'ers currently. Cheap, flexible and you can literally cut them to any length you want. Connect two in parallel or series and you have an 1m strip with 196 diodes, ~118w and ~19.000lm(4k) and you still only need a small c-channel to keep them cool. 6 of them, 3m c-channel and an HLG-240H-20B makes a nice and cheap 4x 2' fixture and with an HLG-320H-20B it fits also for a 3x 3' aka 1m² tent. And you still pay less than 200 for such a combo... If one has 220-240vac ELG series fits as well up to the ELG-250... Saves you another 10er and would be dimmable down to 0/off also with the smaller ones.

Click to expand...

The first time I run two of them in series, I though: Well. Thats quite bright for 30 watts the two strips...and looked my driver again..I was driving them with only 10 watts (5 watts each one)!!!!....90-100 watts with 6 strips..gives me 60000-70000 luxes in 1x3 square foot...with an incredible light distribution,200 watts of this equals 400 of HPS for sure. And penetration is excellent. Thanks Randomblame for lead me in the right direction to buy this leds. I am running 6 strips 102 watts total at about 850 ma about 2,80 µMol/joule...with the aprox 30 more watts I have with the osram red squares..added.I am entering the 3 µMol/joule territory….

AS I said, there will be those for who saying no to this option would be silly.
The problem I see is people see shit like Mars offered at half the cost of what real LEDs would cost to light an area properly.
it just doesn't look viable for me personally with shipping and customs'

oldbeancounter said:

@TheGreatSouthern
Thanks
I will be running them at around 450ma but have the ceiling to go higher if wanted for future proof so I can add to circuit if I want just add strips heat sinks and some wire.
I intend to design it so I can get very close to the canopy but it costs alot more to have diodes all spend out but its ok I feel the benefits out way cost.
Do you use other lights with these 5000k ?

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I use the 4000K ones, so there's not really any need to add any red or blue. That's just my opinion though based on the look of the spectral chart samsung published for the lm301b. I don't have a ppfd meter to do my own analysis.
The reason I suggested running them at binning current like you're doing is because that's where they are most efficient. since you said you are primarily chasing efficiency here it makes a lot more sense to use two strips mounted on a single heat sink running at binning current than to run a single strip at 900ma. to be honest I reckon if you ran them at 450ma you might even get away with mounting them on something other than aluminium because they just don't produce any heat. even running at 733ma like I'm doing the aluminium extrusion stays cool to the touch.

nachooo said:

The first time I run two of them in series, I though: Well. Thats quite bright for 30 watts the two strips...and looked my driver again..I was driving them with only 10 watts (5 watts each one)!!!!....90-100 watts with 6 strips..gives me 60000-70000 luxes in 1x3 square foot...with an incredible light distribution,200 watts of this equals 400 of HPS for sure. And penetration is excellent. Thanks Randomblame for lead me in the right direction to buy this leds. I am running 6 strips 102 watts total at about 850 ma about 2,80 µMol/joule...with the aprox 30 more watts I have with the osram red squares..added.I am entering the 3 µMol/joule territory….

Click to expand...

This is something im deciding on myself. First, this for a very small space so cost is not an issue. I too am thinking about nearly 2 strips per sq ft, close to 200 diodes per sq ft, with additional red monos. My concern is i would be running strips very,very softly, around 6-8 watts per strip. But when i visualize it in mind i imagine the rig would need to be very , vey close to the tops, maybe 6 to 10inches from top of canopy at peak flower. Which would make use of uvb difficult. I could just go with 1 strip per sq ft, and with that i believe the rig would never need to less than 12” from canopy.

What do u guys with hands on experience with strips think?

Randomblame said:

They offer free shipping too(above 50€) but I'm not sure if only within the eu zone. You can chat with them directly on their website. There should pop up a window on the right side.. Even higher diode density, full aluminum PCB and can run at 2amps (~39w) without heatsink.

Click to expand...

Definitely have to pay for shipping to u.s. Which is not a big deal, if you buy enough stuff from them, outside e.u., no vat, and they will give you an even better price than posted on the site.

TheGreatSouthern said:

I use the 4000K ones, so there's not really any need to add any red or blue. That's just my opinion though based on the look of the spectral chart samsung published for the lm301b. I don't have a ppfd meter to do my own analysis.
The reason I suggested running them at binning current like you're doing is because that's where they are most efficient. since you said you are primarily chasing efficiency here it makes a lot more sense to use two strips mounted on a single heat sink running at binning current than to run a single strip at 900ma. to be honest I reckon if you ran them at 450ma you might even get away with mounting them on something other than aluminium because they just don't produce any heat. even running at 733ma like I'm doing the aluminium extrusion stays cool to the touch.

Click to expand...

@TheGreatSouthern
Very helpful
Then I will keep my good heatsinks for rest of build and use 1 inch wide by 1/8 thick 6063P series Aluminum strips with 2 sided thermal tape as I can get that for about 6 bucks per strip. If it deflects any in middle which is unlikely I will just add a rib extra in a T to strengthen of angle.
Likely won't have em much over 350ma most of the time.
Thinking of going with a Meanwell 320 HLGH 48B for all 14 strips.
Any idea how many didods per sq foot you re running I am assuming for veg is this or better yet watts per sq foot for ease for calculation?
I will be adding extra red, blue etc later as a experiment for myself indoor veggies taste wise so I don't need tons of watts per sq foot of just these as will add likely double in other spectrums but a guideline would help if you have grown with these strips which few have I have read so far. Most go for dense footprint for economy which I understand that is not what I seek in my build but what could reproduce the sun best indoors and that is very hard too do I think but if you could might make heck of difference none lol.
Guess I will find out.
Thanks for that info