Which further sucks this grow as it's nothing but freebies and a m/f rando so no idea what I'm working with currently lol. I think the old homebrewer wisdom of 1/2 tsp of foliage pro is a great foundation point and then just add a bit of mag pro if plants get hungrier. I highly doubt they would need even MORE nitrogen. Next feed I may run a couple gallons of fresh PHed water through and then run a feed similar to what I ran today.
It's just a spreadsheet, and they're very real numbers.
I guess keep doing what you're doing then, you seem to have it fully under control?
I'm open to all feedback so please don't take it the wrong way. It was more of a general comment on how there seems to be so much contradiction when it comes to Promix PH.
Generally speaking the RIU wisdom on ProMix HP as it's a 'soilless' medium is to treat it as hydro when it comes to pH. Took me a few grows to internalize that information, but once I did, things were much easier. That said, I think you need more calcium and also adjustment to your feed strength.
I'm thinking one variable at a time. Run a solid amount of water through and probably start monitoring PH trends over time from runoff to see what direction it might be drifting. My runoff catches already have some build up so runoff PPM is a bit trickier. I may attempt 6.2 or even 6.1 PH, but I want to limit the amount of changes so as not to overwhelm the plants. I'll be using 1/2 tsp FP per gallon with some protekt and if the plants get hungry further in flower I'll supplement with mag pro so as not to add even more nitrogen overload. I believe the 1/2 tsp of FP with my tap ppm comes out to about 500 even which is a pretty healthy amount I'd say. The feed chart leans hard on bloom but it has bad issues with salt build up in the bottle so I'm discontinuing use of the bloom.
I have really high EC water and spent a lot of time screwing around trying to get it to work as-is. Theoretically, it is high in calcium carbonate (well water) but I was having calcium issues with it. I've never been so sure that what is in the water is bio-available no matter what people say. So I ended up filtering my water down to zero. I don't have a R/O setup but put it through a zero water filter. From there I add Ca/Mg, a bit more epsom salts and my nutrient. That's been my best process for success. Not cheap, but workable. I move between hand watering or using a blumat Tropf drip system.
I've been running Dyna-gro for a long time (even back in the 90s). grow, bloom, pro-tekt, and Mag-pro. litterally run usually just under 1/2 of recomended dose with a recirculating ebb and flow with rockwool and tap water (prox 250ppm). I rarely if ever get over 1.0 EC (usually lower .8 or.9). That seems to be the sweet spot for most cultivars.
Not sure I've seen the contradictions you're referring to. I've been running promix on and off for over a decade and myself and most everyone I've ever discussed it with has been in agreement that a range of 5.8 to 6.2 is optimal. Perhaps there is a new batch of growers on here saying otherwise that I just haven't noticed, but what I can tell you for certain is that when I've kept my inputs in that range I've had nothing but smooth sailing, when I haven't problems have arisen without fail. Just my 2 cents. Good luck.
Here's a few for starters. Again I'm not saying one way or another. I'll do whatever keeps my plants healthy, but I did want to illustrate how confusing this place can be to navigate at times.
First of all, why are you relying solely on this place for your info? If I responded every time I saw someone with 2 grows under their belt giving inaccurate info I’d have to quit me job. I’ve been reading published books since the 90’s when forums like this didn’t exist or I was too afraid to use them. I always say do your own research then come to a forum for clarification.
Well I definitely dont solely rely on this forum, but I will say maybe I read the tea leaves more than I should sometimes. For example PThort says that PHing the water won't fix PH of the medium and it's actually carbonate and bicarbonate levels in the water that dictate the PH drift. Though I was aware of the water properties, the Internet overwhelmingly fixates purely on water PH which can also help explain why someone with 8 PH well water might have great success because they are lucky enough to have the right natural alkalinity to not fuck it up. I've also heard using a lot of PH down to try to get the PH in range can hurt the carbonate/bicarbonates in the water. Any insights on this? Foliage Pro has a ton of nitrate based N compared to ammonium or urea, combined with natural 7.8 PH water would that cause PH drift upwards over time regardless of feed PH? I suppose the test would be to measure the PH runoff over a period of time, probably with fresh waterings so the existing feed won't throw off the readings as much. My two focuses will be on feed strength and PH. Honestly even just cutting feed way back should right the helm at this point.
I had been doing feed-water-water, and found my plants looked hungry starting somewhere in the water-water phase with an every 3 day (and even every 2nd day) schedule, so I moved that to feed-water-feed-water, etc. and still had a bit of yellowing. So I moved to feeding every time and making sure I had a good amount of runoff (I look for 25%). Last grow the plants with the same environmental conditions and inputs wanted every other day feeding...this time it's every two days rather than every other, but again never 'just water'. Much closer to a hydroponic setup.Well I definitely dont solely rely on this forum, but I will say maybe I read the tea leaves more than I should sometimes. For example PThort says that PHing the water won't fix PH of the medium and it's actually carbonate and bicarbonate levels in the water that dictate the PH drift. Though I was aware of the water properties, the Internet overwhelmingly fixates purely on water PH which can also help explain why someone with 8 PH well water might have great success because they are lucky enough to have the right natural alkalinity to not fuck it up. I've also heard using a lot of PH down to try to get the PH in range can hurt the carbonate/bicarbonates in the water. Any insights on this? Foliage Pro has a ton of nitrate based N compared to ammonium or urea, combined with natural 7.8 PH water would that cause PH drift upwards over time regardless of feed PH? I suppose the test would be to measure the PH runoff over a period of time, probably with fresh waterings so the existing feed won't throw off the readings as much. My two focuses will be on feed strength and PH. Honestly even just cutting feed way back should right the helm at this point.
How to Maintain the Proper pH of a Growing Medium | PT Growers and Consumers
Maintaining pH 5.6-6.2 in growing medium requires more than water pH adjustment. Find out what other factors need to be taken into account.www.pthorticulture.com
How did you settle on feed, feed, water? What's the frequency between waterings? I used to do feed, water, feed every 3 days for several years until it was suggested that my plants could get hungry during what is almost a 6 day period between feedings. I'm not overly concerned as I've recovered from far worse and it's all about challenging what we believe to be true to continue to improve. For shits and giggles, here's the results of my very first grow several years ago.
Starting to get concerned the damage to the root zone might be hard to recover from. I barely fed them a couple of days ago and now they are looking fried again like I just dumped a ton more salts in. I'm giving them 2x the normal plain water as I have to get them back under control. At this point I may just do plain PHed water until the shit stops and the lower leaves start to yellow and drop. I evened measured the runoff PPM and PH and they don't seem that high so that makes me more concerned as I was expecting sky high PPM numbers from the salts being washed out. The plants dried out a day faster than normal so the middle one was drooping this morning which also doesnt help the salt situation. This was my first grow with feed every watering and doing too high PPM really fucked things up. I guess worst case scenario they make a good science experiment to learn from at this point, but it's irritating that I've done far worse and was able to recover so extra annoyed they apparently are choosing death. I mean I get it I made a poor call but whats it take to make these fuckers stop dying at this point like holy shit.
What's the runoff on the days that you're only giving 3g of water? After 6g, I'd expect low EC/PPM because of all the water you've put through.
Well honestly I haven't been checking runoff until the shit show started. I'm more interested in measuring PH drift, but the runoff PPM numbers can help to some extent. Those numbers are after the initial 3 gallons fyi. I had just pruned some of the fried leaves yesterday and they still felt pretty heavy so I was shocked to see one drooping this morning. That poor right plant is pretty fucked up though lol it was always the slowest to dry and it's just never gotten straightened out and is now obviously just starting to recover from the nutrient shock.
I generally don't bother with runoff pH or EC...unless there's a major problem. But when you're flushing, it's good to check the run off stats along the way, so you know how hot the medium had gotten as well as how effective your flush is and if you need to go further or have done enough. If you measured at 3g, it doesn't sound like your soil was all that hot if the plants were in the 390-500PPM range.
It's been about 4 hours now. Debating on letting them ride for 2 days or giving them a very light feeding of maybe 1/4 tsp of foliage pro. I'm hesitant as I still see leaf curl, especially on the right one. Better to have a light hand for the rest of the grow.