Need Help Coping with I.C. (Interstitial Cystitis)

P

pass the pipe

Well-Known Member
I've had suffered a constant bladder pain along with the urge to go constantly for three going on four years now and have been on and off various medications for it. While none have even touched it for good, at first if they do work, the medications have caused me to go into retention or just a real struggle to go among other unpleasant side effects. Cannabis, I've noticed does help to a point, more for pain so and that's where I'm a bit stumped. Seeing how various studies have shown THC and CBD to possibly be of therapeutic value, and recently so has Cannabigerol (CBG) for MS symptoms including incontinence and frequency. My question is this, is there anyone here on the forums that has this or knows what strain or even consumption method would be ideal for IC sufferers? Also what I should be on the lookout for ratio wise, like 1:1 THC:CBD? Thanks.
 
BobCajun

BobCajun

Well-Known Member
I don't know about what cannabinoids you should use but there are some other natural remedies available. This one seems interesting.

"Apple Cider Vinegar
Apple cider vinegar cures most of the diseases due to its anti fungal and anti-bacterial characteristics. First, prepare a mixture that contains two teaspoons of apple cider vinegar, one-fourth teaspoon borax and one-eighth teaspoon of baking soda.

Add this mixture to adequate quantity of water and stir it thoroughly. Taking this solution three times a day will destroy the bacteria and prevents frequent urination." http://www.searchherbalremedy.com/natural-treatments-for-interstitial-cystitis/

I wouldn't use that much borax though. You wouldn't want to take more than 100 mg of borax a day, because that contains 10 mg of boron, the highest amount recommended for medicinal use per day. It probably would help though, because borax does kill fungus in the body, it's also good for other things, like keeping bones strong and preventing osteoarthritis. I would spread 100 mg of borax over the day, like 2-3 doses.

Also, I don't know if there are actual cysts involved in your ailment but if you take fish oil or flax oil they're known to cause cysts on the skin in many people, particularly fish oil. I take flax oil but very small amounts. I think I did read about people getting cysts on organs from it too. Could be wrong but it seems familiar.
 
Vermont Sarge

Vermont Sarge

Active Member
pass the pipe said:
I've had suffered a constant bladder pain along with the urge to go constantly for three going on four years now and have been on and off various medications for it. While none have even touched it for good, at first if they do work, the medications have caused me to go into retention or just a real struggle to go among other unpleasant side effects. Cannabis, I've noticed does help to a point, more for pain so and that's where I'm a bit stumped. Seeing how various studies have shown THC and CBD to possibly be of therapeutic value, and recently so has Cannabigerol (CBG) for MS symptoms including incontinence and frequency. My question is this, is there anyone here on the forums that has this or knows what strain or even consumption method would be ideal for IC sufferers? Also what I should be on the lookout for ratio wise, like 1:1 THC:CBD? Thanks.
Click to expand...
1:1 Ratio is popular but what has worked best for me is Medicann Blue Blood ration 17.5 THC : 10 % CBD…..Ingesting it works much better for what you have,friend ! I make
00 size capsules with Coconut oil and Sunflower Lecithin and a Magic Butter Machine. 5-6 OZ of Bud + the leafs to 4 cups of coconut oil …De-carb at 225 for an hour
and then cook at 160 approx for at least 4 hours….Two well made pills with this mixture WILL solve your problem,been there done that….yeah,smoking or gaping helps what you
have to a point but that's it….Had bladder-pain spasms after a back surgery gone wrong 30 + years ago….i had all the symptoms of I.C and was constantly tested for it
and other things. went from one Medical institution and drug after the other…None of the drugs worked and then had a medtronic implant which barely helped….was told by
the urology and neurology field i was at the end of the medical road…..Well,the first night i tried two of these babies i went from peeing every other hour and being in pain
to going 5-6 hours without peeing or pain….a f'ing miracle,man !!! I was at The End of the road !! I feel your pain ,sorry !
 
P

pass the pipe

Well-Known Member
Vermont Sarge said:
1:1 Ratio is popular but what has worked best for me is Medicann Blue Blood ration 17.5 THC : 10 % CBD…..Ingesting it works much better for what you have,friend ! I make
00 size capsules with Coconut oil and Sunflower Lecithin and a Magic Butter Machine. 5-6 OZ of Bud + the leafs to 4 cups of coconut oil …De-carb at 225 for an hour
and then cook at 160 approx for at least 4 hours….Two well made pills with this mixture WILL solve your problem,been there done that….yeah,smoking or gaping helps what you
have to a point but that's it….Had bladder-pain spasms after a back surgery gone wrong 30 + years ago….i had all the symptoms of I.C and was constantly tested for it
and other things. went from one Medical institution and drug after the other…None of the drugs worked and then had a medtronic implant which barely helped….was told by
the urology and neurology field i was at the end of the medical road…..Well,the first night i tried two of these babies i went from peeing every other hour and being in pain
to going 5-6 hours without peeing or pain….a f'ing miracle,man !!! I was at The End of the road !! I feel your pain ,sorry !
Click to expand...
Damn, see that's where everyone's at I've talked to lately in terms of frequency, see I guess my frequency is more severe then pain per say. I literally gotta piss about every 10-15 mins, not a joke. At most I believe I can go about 20 to 25 mins before I gotta piss bad to where it hurts to hold it. So it's gotten to the point I either sit here in pain due to an urge to go and slight pain or slip a foley back in again and if you've had that, you know it's not pleasant in the least. Not to mention the spasms they've caused in the past when placed in. I'll check out Medicann there and look into em, is there maybe a way to not be high or at least so inebriated feeling while also getting relief for something like this? I have a rather high tolerance and tend to overindulge in that sense due to, and seeing as smoking isn't good in general for a condition like this, it would probably be for the better.
 
Vermont Sarge

Vermont Sarge

Active Member
I hardly get high at all from the capsules,more like a sedative. The key is to let the plant completely finish it's flowering season as the longer
it flowers the less THC and more CBN you end up with. I can smoke or Vape my brains out and it doesn't help my I.C. like symptoms. I know
where you are at and hope you get some relief !
 
BobCajun

BobCajun

Well-Known Member
Ever take ketamine, or related compounds? That has messed up a lot of bladders. I'm assuming you didn't, but just checking.
 
P

pass the pipe

Well-Known Member
Vermont Sarge said:
I hardly get high at all from the capsules,more like a sedative. The key is to let the plant completely finish it's flowering season as the longer
it flowers the less THC and more CBN you end up with. I can smoke or Vape my brains out and it doesn't help my I.C. like symptoms. I know
where you are at and hope you get some relief !
Click to expand...
That would make it more sleepy and couchlock though correct? Wouldn't it be better to harvest, I think it's 2-3 weeks early from the max harvest window when CBG and THCV and the acid form have yet to convert over from their states? Only reason for this basis is looking up the "Sativex" brand and somewhere they stated about having a strain specifically for that brand that produced higher amounts of non-psychoactive parts and found it best to be cut early by 2 to 3 weeks in order to harvest max CBG levels or something along the lines of such. But I have not heard much about CBG other then a few studies done on bladder contractions with the usual tested elements, THC, THCV, THCA, CBG, CBD. An CBG showed the highest potential but also is actually quite low in concentrations.

BobCajun said:
Ever take ketamine, or related compounds? That has messed up a lot of bladders. I'm assuming you didn't, but just checking.
Click to expand...
Naw, been tired as hell for about a month now and can't focus on nothing, been sleeping forever and a day. To answer your question, no, never even knew what it was til after I found out my bladder problems and doctors kept asking once in a while when we'd first meet.
 
BobCajun

BobCajun

Well-Known Member
pass the pipe said:
That would make it more sleepy and couchlock though correct? Wouldn't it be better to harvest, I think it's 2-3 weeks early from the max harvest window when CBG and THCV and the acid form have yet to convert over from their states? Only reason for this basis is looking up the "Sativex" brand and somewhere they stated about having a strain specifically for that brand that produced higher amounts of non-psychoactive parts and found it best to be cut early by 2 to 3 weeks in order to harvest max CBG levels or something along the lines of such. But I have not heard much about CBG other then a few studies done on bladder contractions with the usual tested elements, THC, THCV, THCA, CBG, CBD. An CBG showed the highest potential but also is actually quite low in concentrations for medical purposes.


Naw, been tired as hell for about a month now and can't focus on nothing, been sleeping forever and a day. To answer your question, no, never even knew what it was til after I found out my bladder problems and doctors kept asking once in a while when we'd first meet.
Click to expand...
I wonder what causes it. Probably some kind of organism. I hope you get some relief. I suggest THCA. It seems to be the best of the cannabinoids.
 
P

pass the pipe

Well-Known Member
BobCajun said:
I wonder what causes it. Probably some kind of organism. I hope you get some relief. I suggest THCA. It seems to be the best of the cannabinoids.
Click to expand...
Heres the hightimes link http://hightimes.com/news/research-shows-cannabis-may-help-overactive-bladder/ that stated a link within the article to the study showing CBG as best for urinary frequency and THCV coming a close second.
Hmm, on a side note, would one just harvest rather early before prime window then for high THCA? If true I may be in some luck there... I been battling a spider mite problem since early flower in my tent and had to go in and clean and spray down and just waiting a few days to air it out. But in the meantime I threw my three Cherry Cream Pies outside for the last three or four days as I cleaned despite being seven weeks into flower already and the days are just now getting shorter. My quick question on this would be should I harvest now to save it for what it's worth? As the light hours are too long right now in the PNW. About 14 hours and 45 mins I believe was yesterdays sunrise to sundown and my few outdoor ones are just now throwing pistils. More then likely the buds are going to shrivel up and reveg after it gets out of shock?
 
Douglas.Curtis

Douglas.Curtis

Well-Known Member
Whatever your issue is, I would be damn sure I wasn't making it worse with food choices. I doubt your doctor ever blood typed you or asked much about what you eat, have they? Look up "Blood Type Food List" and make sure you're skipping the avoids for your blood type.

Needing to urinate can also be due to a low or high pH of your urine. Makes it uncomfortable, your doc talk about pH levels at all?

Possible mold colonies? Heard some weird stuff in that department lately, fatigue is a main symptom of all the possibles.

Douglas
 
BobCajun

BobCajun

Well-Known Member
pass the pipe said:
Heres the hightimes link http://hightimes.com/news/research-shows-cannabis-may-help-overactive-bladder/ that stated a link within the article to the study showing CBG as best for urinary frequency and THCV coming a close second.
Hmm, on a side note, would one just harvest rather early before prime window then for high THCA? If true I may be in some luck there... I been battling a spider mite problem since early flower in my tent and had to go in and clean and spray down and just waiting a few days to air it out. But in the meantime I threw my three Cherry Cream Pies outside for the last three or four days as I cleaned despite being seven weeks into flower already and the days are just now getting shorter. My quick question on this would be should I harvest now to save it for what it's worth? As the light hours are too long right now in the PNW. About 14 hours and 45 mins I believe was yesterdays sunrise to sundown and my few outdoor ones are just now throwing pistils. More then likely the buds are going to shrivel up and reveg after it gets out of shock?
Click to expand...
Oddly, they didn't test THCA in that study. But it doesn't matter when you harvest because almost all THC is in the form of THCA anyway until heated. Just look at some test results in "analytical 360" site and you'll see what I mean. About your plants, you could put a covering over them to limit light hours to 12. Might be kind of troublesome but it could be done. Harvesting now would make things simpler, but obviously you wouldn't get much.
 
P

pass the pipe

Well-Known Member
Douglas.Curtis said:
Whatever your issue is, I would be damn sure I wasn't making it worse with food choices. I doubt your doctor ever blood typed you or asked much about what you eat, have they? Look up "Blood Type Food List" and make sure you're skipping the avoids for your blood type.

Needing to urinate can also be due to a low or high pH of your urine. Makes it uncomfortable, your doc talk about pH levels at all?

Possible mold colonies? Heard some weird stuff in that department lately, fatigue is a main symptom of all the possibles.

Douglas
Click to expand...
Already done so on food choices, as it's a must. IC can and usually invlolves frequent urination sometimes up to 40 to 60 times a day. Such as in my case... Just got out the hospital Thursday and got given a choice to think about and hard..., Tibial Nerve Stimulation, "Medtronic" Bladder PaceMaker, Botox Injections directly into the bladder muscle, or complete bladder reconstruction/augmentation with part of my intestine as suggested by one doctor and two others recommended I try Botox first. Given the rather invasive and seriousness of my condition and that it's only worsened with time. Which has to me not surprisingly, stumped even quite a few of the doctors. I guess I forgot to mention in my original post, I have been diagnosed more then once now with a rather small max bladder capacity of only 150ml (4OZ) compared to a normal bladder holding average 16 ounces. No scar tissue though as far as I know. Almost four years later now and I still have yet to find a treatment option outside these options and given current studies on IC being limited compared to other diseases and conditions. Interstitial Cystitis is incurable and can only be treated with a treatment plan that may or may not work... An I've exhausted a lot of my options already.

http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/interstitial-cystitis/basics/symptoms/con-20022439


BobCajun said:
Oddly, they didn't test THCA in that study. But it doesn't matter when you harvest because almost all THC is in the form of THCA anyway until heated. Just look at some test results in "analytical 360" site and you'll see what I mean. About your plants, you could put a covering over them to limit light hours to 12. Might be kind of troublesome but it could be done. Harvesting now would make things simpler, but obviously you wouldn't get much.
Click to expand...
I must have not paid attention enough there, but ya I'm not too worried it'll all go to alcohol extract then coco oil regardless. But now that's it's about a week outside the hairs are dying, not going orange and receding, but dying with no more fattening on buds, should I chop now and save whats there before the plant drops it's buds? (obviously wouldn't wait that long, but given it's more then likely confused and trying to reveg given it's lack of any major growth)
 
Douglas.Curtis

Douglas.Curtis

Well-Known Member
Damn. Well, take a peek at this list anyway, just to make sure you don't have an 'avoid' as a major part of your diet. Won't change the 4oz capacity but may ease up on other issues. http://www.dadamo.com/typebase4/typeindexer.htm
pass the pipe said:
I must have not paid attention enough there, but ya I'm not too worried it'll all go to alcohol extract then coco oil regardless. But now that's it's about a week outside the hairs are dying, not going orange and receding, but dying with no more fattening on buds, should I chop now and save whats there before the plant drops it's buds? (obviously wouldn't wait that long, but given it's more then likely confused and trying to reveg given it's lack of any major growth)
Click to expand...
You want maximum THCA, so you'll be looking for 5-15% amber trichomes. Less than 5% and THC(A) is not at full development. Later than 15% and that thc is degrading into CBN and causing a sleepy effect.
 
Olive Drab Green

Olive Drab Green

Well-Known Member
pass the pipe said:
I've had suffered a constant bladder pain along with the urge to go constantly for three going on four years now and have been on and off various medications for it. While none have even touched it for good, at first if they do work, the medications have caused me to go into retention or just a real struggle to go among other unpleasant side effects. Cannabis, I've noticed does help to a point, more for pain so and that's where I'm a bit stumped. Seeing how various studies have shown THC and CBD to possibly be of therapeutic value, and recently so has Cannabigerol (CBG) for MS symptoms including incontinence and frequency. My question is this, is there anyone here on the forums that has this or knows what strain or even consumption method would be ideal for IC sufferers? Also what I should be on the lookout for ratio wise, like 1:1 THC:CBD? Thanks.
Click to expand...
CBG is a cannabinoid that most cannabis contains. I say give it a shot. It's a lifestyle, and there's nothing wrong with cannabis. It's no one's business how you recover.
 
Vermont Sarge

Vermont Sarge

Active Member
pass the pipe said:
Already done so on food choices, as it's a must. IC can and usually invlolves frequent urination sometimes up to 40 to 60 times a day. Such as in my case... Just got out the hospital Thursday and got given a choice to think about and hard..., Tibial Nerve Stimulation, "Medtronic" Bladder PaceMaker, Botox Injections directly into the bladder muscle, or complete bladder reconstruction/augmentation with part of my intestine as suggested by one doctor and two others recommended I try Botox first. Given the rather invasive and seriousness of my condition and that it's only worsened with time. Which has to me not surprisingly, stumped even quite a few of the doctors. I guess I forgot to mention in my original post, I have been diagnosed more then once now with a rather small max bladder capacity of only 150ml (4OZ) compared to a normal bladder holding average 16 ounces. No scar tissue though as far as I know. Almost four years later now and I still have yet to find a treatment option outside these options and given current studies on IC being limited compared to other diseases and conditions. Interstitial Cystitis is incurable and can only be treated with a treatment plan that may or may not work... An I've exhausted a lot of my options already.

http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/interstitial-cystitis/basics/symptoms/con-20022439




I must have not paid attention enough there, but ya I'm not too worried it'll all go to alcohol extract then coco oil regardless. But now that's it's about a week outside the hairs are dying, not going orange and receding, but dying with no more fattening on buds, should I chop now and save whats there before the plant drops it's buds? (obviously wouldn't wait that long, but given it's more then likely confused and trying to reveg given it's lack of any major growth)
Click to expand...
Did The Medtronic implant and it did not work
 
P

pass the pipe

Well-Known Member
Douglas.Curtis said:
Damn. Well, take a peek at this list anyway, just to make sure you don't have an 'avoid' as a major part of your diet. Won't change the 4oz capacity but may ease up on other issues. http://www.dadamo.com/typebase4/typeindexer.htm

You want maximum THCA, so you'll be looking for 5-15% amber trichomes. Less than 5% and THC(A) is not at full development. Later than 15% and that thc is degrading into CBN and causing a sleepy effect.
Click to expand...
Ya I have to follow a strict diet or at least try to, given diet can cause flares in about 80%-90% of patients. There's one or two loosely based diet plans given based on overall sufferers in general.
The IC Diet & Elimination Diet

http://www.ichelp.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/food-list.pdf

http://www.ichelp.org/living-with-ic/interstitial-cystitis-and-diet/elimination-diet/

Olive Drab Green said:
CBG is a cannabinoid that most cannabis contains. I say give it a shot. It's a lifestyle, and there's nothing wrong with cannabis. It's no one's business how you recover.
Click to expand...
I understand. Just with a particular strain that comes to mind for this particular cannabinoid, would be Mickey Kush by TGA Genetics, but I'm not all that sure about breeders descriptions especially since it's the only strain I could find that directly stated moderate to higher CBG levels compared to most other strains. An given the linked study I found it interesting at least to check out but first wanted some opinions on what might or might not have worked for someone else.
Vermont Sarge said:
Did The Medtronic implant and it did not work
Click to expand...
If it's alright, could you explain how it failed? Did you do the temporary belt before the implant or afterwards when the real one's implanted, you notice it didn't work?
 
Olive Drab Green

Olive Drab Green

Well-Known Member
pass the pipe said:
Ya I have to follow a strict diet or at least try to, given diet can cause flares in about 80%-90% of patients. There's one or two loosely based diet plans given based on overall sufferers in general.
The IC Diet & Elimination Diet

http://www.ichelp.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/food-list.pdf

http://www.ichelp.org/living-with-ic/interstitial-cystitis-and-diet/elimination-diet/


I understand. Just with a particular strain that comes to mind for this particular cannabinoid, would be Mickey Kush by TGA Genetics, but I'm not all that sure about breeders descriptions especially since it's the only strain I could find that directly stated moderate to higher CBG levels compared to most other strains. An given the linked study I found it interesting at least to check out but first wanted some opinions on what might or might not have worked for someone else.

If it's alright, could you explain how it failed? Did you do the temporary belt before the implant or afterwards when the real one's implanted, you notice it didn't work?
Click to expand...
If THC is also helpful, since it's easier to see the average strain content, why not focus on that with a secondary focus on CBG, CBN, and CBD? I think if you go to seed banks, some of them have "Top Medical" which are usually lower in THC and higher in CBD and CBN.
 
P

pass the pipe

Well-Known Member
Olive Drab Green said:
If THC is also helpful, since it's easier to see the average strain content, why not focus on that with a secondary focus on CBG, CBN, and CBD? I think if you go to seed banks, some of them have "Top Medical" which are usually lower in THC and higher in CBD and CBN.
Click to expand...
I do, but that's just it. I'm tired of being high literally all day long haha. Bad enough the condition makes it impossible to have much of an active lifestyle let alone being even buzzed all the time seems it's taking it's toll in the way of daily things. Like the usual, forgetful a lot. Don't get the munchies or none of that all too often no matter the strain. An I don't get a whole lot done being high without constantly being reminded all the time. My biggest worry or fear is like with any drug you'll have to take increasing amounts of it to get considerable relief which wouldn't be too much of a bother if I wasn't going to be getting a buzz from it all the time. I guess it would be nice to feel "normal" if possible without the high everyime. I just don't think THC alone is going to help is all, in a way too much, like sativa's make me feel anxious and worsen that feeling so I stick with indica and indica dominants mainly. Of course I could always go to a store to try more medical products before plunging in the time for medical strains. But that defeats the purpose really to me due to limited income and whether or not a certain strain or cannabinoid is the holy grail here per say, still doesn't mean I would have steady access to it. Anything medical is as much if not more then regular shelf and top shelf bud? I do see where your going though, I've got a handful or two of strains to trial and play with so that's not a problem for THC wise.
 
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