Need help with plant diagnosis...perpetual problem driving me nuts

dipstick333

Active Member
Hi, I have done a few rotations using the "ebb and grow" multi pot system. Im using GH
nutrients, hydroton, and I have 8 plants under a 1000hps at the moment.
Heres my problem: I take 8 super happy/healthy 6" plants grown from seed under florescent
in rockwool, and pop them in the hydroton pots under the HP and the next day the leaves are curling under (basically claw like), and plants not happy. This happens every time I put the plants into the pots in this system. Last time I tried with rockwool and same deal.
PH 5.9- 6.0
GH nutrient is at the lower level..not over nute at all
I have them currently being watered 1 time/day..rockwool is moist to wet. Hydroton moist.
Research is saying maybe a magnesium problem but I really doubt its any kind of lack of
nutrient b/c 2 days earlier, they were banging under the florescent, being watered 1 time day, with the same nutrient solution.
Can anyone weigh in on this please? Thanks in advance.
*I can grab pics if I get some feedback
 

jaag102882

Active Member
im thinking your light source may be too close...
fluorescent lighting has low temps allowing you to get the light really close... w/ a 1k watt hps you're gonna need good air circulation and space between the light and plants...
 

Cavalry

Well-Known Member
You do have to harden off the plants gradually when going to a brighter light source. Curled under leaves sounds like over fertilized, normally too close to the light will give you "taco leaves" or ridges.
 

johny1212

Active Member
I agree with cavalry. Also make sure the rockwool is above your water level in the basket or it will stay too wet. I would move them to hydro with your veg light. When you introduce the 1k keep it really high and bring it down gradually.
 

woodsmaneh!

Well-Known Member
So the only thing you changed is the light? you don't transplant or add more hydroton? So if it is the light which it has to be, move it so that it is 24 inches above the top of the tallest plant. In 3 days move it down 3 inches so your at 21 inches from tops. In 3 days do the same so your at 18 inches. Now put your hand with the back facing up over the top of the tallest plant, if you feel heat after 30 seconds move the light up a bit, do this till you fell just about no heat. This should clear things up, another sure sign your light is too close is the top leaves turn white.


Here is a little more help and some encouragement, one of my buds

[FONT=&quot]Solving Marijuana Plan Leaf Curl/Cupping Problems[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]OK rule number #1 when you see this happening is flush with 25% nutrients; use 2 to 3 times the pot size to do this. Flushing means lots of run-off. You use 25% because some elements are not mobile without other elements, so if you have a mag lock up flushing with water won't get the mag out, as it needs nitrogen to be mobile. Your killing your plants with kindness remember they are weeds. Here are more answers for you, you might want to save it for reference later The only time you don't use rule #1 is in the last 2 weeks of flower when bottom leaves stop being used for photosynthesis.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Unless another marijuana grower inspects the damage a true assessment might not be possible. It's hard to tell "exactly" what the culprit is. Unfortunately the “solution” the marijuana grower chooses many times is not the right one.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]A misdiagnosis only serves to make matters worse by promoting further decline.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The ultimate and correct solution is in the hands of the marijuana grower.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Here are some common problems when marijuana leaves are curling.[/FONT]

  1. [FONT=&quot]Too much marijuana fertilizer[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
    The most common cause of marijuana leaf cupping aka leaf margin rolling, leaf margin burn, and leaf tip curl/burn is overzealous use of marijuana plant food. In relationship to factors such as marijuana plant vigour and rate of growth. Leaf burn is often the very first sign of too much marijuana fertilizer.
    A hard, crispy feel to the marijuana leaf frequently occurs as well, as opposed to a soft and cool feel of a happy pot leaf. Back off on the amount and/or frequency of using marijuana fertilizer. Too much marijuana fertilizer can also burn the roots, especially the sensitive root tips, which then creates another set of problems. Note - as soil dries, the concentration of the remaining salts rises further exacerbating the problem. [/FONT]
  2. [FONT=&quot]High Heat[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
    The marijuana plant is losing water via it’s leaves faster than what can be replaced by the root system. The marijuana leaf responds by leaf margin cupping or rolling up or down (most times up) in order to conserve moisture. A good example is reflected by the appearance of broad-bladed turf grass on a hot summer day, high noon, with low soil moisture levels - the leaf blade will roll upward/inward with the grass taking on a dull, greyish-green appearance. Upon sunrise when moisture levels have returned to normal, the leaf blade will be flat. Lower the heat in the marijuana grow-op and concentrate on developing a large robust root system. An efficient and effective root system will go a long way to prevent heat induced pot leaf desiccation or marijuana leaf margin curling. One short episode of high heat is enough to permanently disable or destroy leaf tissue and cause a general decline in the leaves affected, which often occurs to leaves found at the top of the cannabis plant. The damaged pot leaf (usually) does not fully recover, no matter what you do. Bummer in the summer. One can only look to new growth for indications that the problem has been corrected.[/FONT]
  3. [FONT=&quot]Too much light[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
    Yes, it’s true, you can give your marijuana plant too much light. Cannabis does not receive full sun from sunrise to sunset in its natural state. It is shaded or given reduced light levels because of adjacent plant material, cloudy conditions, rain, dust, twilight periods in the morning and late afternoon, and light intensity changes caused by a change in the seasons. Too much light mainly serves to bleach out and destroy chlorophyll as opposed to causing marijuana leaf cupping, but it often goes hand-in-hand with high heat for indoor marijuana growers. Turn down the time when the lights on in your marijuana grow room. If you're using a 24 hr cycle, turn it down to 20 hrs. Those on 18 - 6 marijuana growth cycle can turn their lights down two or three hours. Too much light can have many adverse effects on marijuana plants. Concentrate on developing/maintaining an efficient and robust root system.[/FONT]
  4. [FONT=&quot]Over Watering[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
    For marijuana growers using soil, this practice only serves to weaken the root system by depriving the roots of proper gas exchange. The marijuana plants roots are not getting enough oxygen which creates an anerobic condition inducing root rot and root decline with the end result showing up as leaf stress, stunted growth, and in severe cases, death. Over watering creates a perfect environment for damp-off disease, at, or below the soil line. Many times marijuana growers believe their cannabis plant is not getting enough marijuana fertilizers (which it can't under such adverse conditions), so they add more marijuana fertilizers. Making the problem worst. Not better. Often problem 1 and 4 go together. Too much marijuana fertilizer combined with too much water. Creating plenty of marijuana plant problems.[/FONT]
  5. [FONT=&quot]Not Enough Water[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
    Not only is the marijuana plant now stressed due to a low supply of adequate moisture, but carbohydrate production has been greatly compromised (screwed up). Step up the watering frequency, and if need be, organic marijuana growers may need to water from the bottom up until moisture levels reach a norm throughout the medium. One of the best methods in determining whether a marijuana plant requires watering is lifting the pots. The pots should be light to lift before a water session. After watering the marijuana plants lift the pots to get an understanding how heavy they've become fully watered. If the pot feels light to the lift - it’s time to water. Don’t wait until the soil pulls away from the side of the pot before watering. And of course, leach, once in a while to get rid of excess salts. These are the five most common problems marijuana growers encounter when growing cannabis. Correcting the problems early will save the marijuana plants, but may reduce overall yield. With practice and experience these problems are easily overcome which will then enable the marijuana grower to produce fantastic marijuana plants. With heavy yields.[/FONT]
:blsmoke::blsmoke::joint::joint::eyesmoke:


DSCN0057.jpgDSCN0062.jpgDSCN0039.jpg
 

dipstick333

Active Member
Thank you all for your responses and help. The light was about 32" above the plants which in my experience has been fine. I did raise it another 12" just to take that out of the equation.
I transplanted in to the hydroton...the tricky part here is that, you use rockwool to start the plant then pop it into the rocks and it does kinda stay wet. I used the small 1.5" so its not a big sopping wet 4"er ya know? Anyway, seriously it cant be over nute. Im at 1 teasp per gal here!
What about water too cold? Humidity too low? Im Im grasping at air here. Thanks again!
 

chasta

Active Member
just a noob thought but is there any chance it's getting a huge boost of water when you jump systems under the hid . It sounds like it could be just curled down acting like a overwatered plant in soil . You said it does this every time you make the switch . Does it pop right out of it every time after adjusting to wetter habitat ?
 

dipstick333

Active Member
just a noob thought but is there any chance it's getting a huge boost of water when you jump systems under the hid . It sounds like it could be just curled down acting like a overwatered plant in soil . You said it does this every time you make the switch . Does it pop right out of it every time after adjusting to wetter habitat ?
well, I wouldnt say they get a huge boost of water..im watering once a day so they werent necc getting any more water or any wetter than they were under the fluorescent.
I havent seen them be proper plants in this system to be honest. Its bumming me out. thx
 

*BUDS

Well-Known Member
Stress. They like the cubes and where you had them and dont like the cube covered in hydroton(less air) and the much more powerful light giving them relocation shock. Next time introduce them slowly to the 1000w HPS couple hours a day, raise the light in the beginning and have the cube sticking 1/2 way out of the hydroton.
 
So the only thing you changed is the light? you don't transplant or add more hydroton? So if it is the light which it has to be, move it so that it is 24 inches above the top of the tallest plant. In 3 days move it down 3 inches so your at 21 inches from tops. In 3 days do the same so your at 18 inches. Now put your hand with the back facing up over the top of the tallest plant, if you feel heat after 30 seconds move the light up a bit, do this till you fell just about no heat. This should clear things up, another sure sign your light is too close is the top leaves turn white.


Here is a little more help and some encouragement, one of my buds

Solving Marijuana Plan Leaf Curl/Cupping Problems

OK rule number #1 when you see this happening is flush with 25% nutrients; use 2 to 3 times the pot size to do this. Flushing means lots of run-off. You use 25% because some elements are not mobile without other elements, so if you have a mag lock up flushing with water won't get the mag out, as it needs nitrogen to be mobile. Your killing your plants with kindness remember they are weeds. Here are more answers for you, you might want to save it for reference later The only time you don't use rule #1 is in the last 2 weeks of flower when bottom leaves stop being used for photosynthesis.
Unless another marijuana grower inspects the damage a true assessment might not be possible. It's hard to tell "exactly" what the culprit is. Unfortunately the “solution” the marijuana grower chooses many times is not the right one.
A misdiagnosis only serves to make matters worse by promoting further decline.
The ultimate and correct solution is in the hands of the marijuana grower.
Here are some common problems when marijuana leaves are curling.
  1. Too much marijuana fertilizer
    The most common cause of marijuana leaf cupping aka leaf margin rolling, leaf margin burn, and leaf tip curl/burn is overzealous use of marijuana plant food. In relationship to factors such as marijuana plant vigour and rate of growth. Leaf burn is often the very first sign of too much marijuana fertilizer.
    A hard, crispy feel to the marijuana leaf frequently occurs as well, as opposed to a soft and cool feel of a happy pot leaf. Back off on the amount and/or frequency of using marijuana fertilizer. Too much marijuana fertilizer can also burn the roots, especially the sensitive root tips, which then creates another set of problems. Note - as soil dries, the concentration of the remaining salts rises further exacerbating the problem.
  2. High Heat
    The marijuana plant is losing water via it’s leaves faster than what can be replaced by the root system. The marijuana leaf responds by leaf margin cupping or rolling up or down (most times up) in order to conserve moisture. A good example is reflected by the appearance of broad-bladed turf grass on a hot summer day, high noon, with low soil moisture levels - the leaf blade will roll upward/inward with the grass taking on a dull, greyish-green appearance. Upon sunrise when moisture levels have returned to normal, the leaf blade will be flat. Lower the heat in the marijuana grow-op and concentrate on developing a large robust root system. An efficient and effective root system will go a long way to prevent heat induced pot leaf desiccation or marijuana leaf margin curling. One short episode of high heat is enough to permanently disable or destroy leaf tissue and cause a general decline in the leaves affected, which often occurs to leaves found at the top of the cannabis plant. The damaged pot leaf (usually) does not fully recover, no matter what you do. Bummer in the summer. One can only look to new growth for indications that the problem has been corrected.
  3. Too much light
    Yes, it’s true, you can give your marijuana plant too much light. Cannabis does not receive full sun from sunrise to sunset in its natural state. It is shaded or given reduced light levels because of adjacent plant material, cloudy conditions, rain, dust, twilight periods in the morning and late afternoon, and light intensity changes caused by a change in the seasons. Too much light mainly serves to bleach out and destroy chlorophyll as opposed to causing marijuana leaf cupping, but it often goes hand-in-hand with high heat for indoor marijuana growers. Turn down the time when the lights on in your marijuana grow room. If you're using a 24 hr cycle, turn it down to 20 hrs. Those on 18 - 6 marijuana growth cycle can turn their lights down two or three hours. Too much light can have many adverse effects on marijuana plants. Concentrate on developing/maintaining an efficient and robust root system.
  4. Over Watering
    For marijuana growers using soil, this practice only serves to weaken the root system by depriving the roots of proper gas exchange. The marijuana plants roots are not getting enough oxygen which creates an anerobic condition inducing root rot and root decline with the end result showing up as leaf stress, stunted growth, and in severe cases, death. Over watering creates a perfect environment for damp-off disease, at, or below the soil line. Many times marijuana growers believe their cannabis plant is not getting enough marijuana fertilizers (which it can't under such adverse conditions), so they add more marijuana fertilizers. Making the problem worst. Not better. Often problem 1 and 4 go together. Too much marijuana fertilizer combined with too much water. Creating plenty of marijuana plant problems.
  5. Not Enough Water
    Not only is the marijuana plant now stressed due to a low supply of adequate moisture, but carbohydrate production has been greatly compromised (screwed up). Step up the watering frequency, and if need be, organic marijuana growers may need to water from the bottom up until moisture levels reach a norm throughout the medium. One of the best methods in determining whether a marijuana plant requires watering is lifting the pots. The pots should be light to lift before a water session. After watering the marijuana plants lift the pots to get an understanding how heavy they've become fully watered. If the pot feels light to the lift - it’s time to water. Don’t wait until the soil pulls away from the side of the pot before watering. And of course, leach, once in a while to get rid of excess salts. These are the five most common problems marijuana growers encounter when growing cannabis. Correcting the problems early will save the marijuana plants, but may reduce overall yield. With practice and experience these problems are easily overcome which will then enable the marijuana grower to produce fantastic marijuana plants. With heavy yields.
:blsmoke::blsmoke::joint::joint::eyesmoke:


View attachment 1923375View attachment 1923376View attachment 1923377
Thanks for the info bro....nice buds man
 

apbx720

Well-Known Member
whats yr rh? do u live in a dry area? i got leaf curling up when i had a low rh. couldnt find out what it was for the longest and nobody knew what it was. rh was 20%-30%. got a humidifier and the problem went away. peace
 
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