Needing help for first timer with lights

Hello all. Long timer reader but first time poster. I'm currently working on getting my room set up. 8x12'. Looking for lighting options. I've looked at the BlackDogLed and really liked the results they were getting with those but hated the price. Also looked at the Perfect SUN brand lights. I liked those as well but the guy seemed kinda shady in a few videos I watched. I emailed him a week ago with a few questions and never got a reply back. So figured it best to get.good.opinions here. I'd like to do the full grow in the same room. I will have a 100 amp sub panel in the building. 8x12 with just under 8 foot ceiling height. What's the best options to.light this up? I'm pretty handy and not afraid to assemble a kit or do a complete diy if I had help picking the pieces out. Thanks in advance.

DrGrnThumb90 said:

Hello all. Long timer reader but first time poster. I'm currently working on getting my room set up. 8x12'. Looking for lighting options. I've looked at the BlackDogLed and really liked the results they were getting with those but hated the price. Also looked at the Perfect SUN brand lights. I liked those as well but the guy seemed kinda shady in a few videos I watched. I emailed him a week ago with a few questions and never got a reply back. So figured it best to get.good.opinions here. I'd like to do the full grow in the same room. I will have a 100 amp sub panel in the building. 8x12 with just under 8 foot ceiling height. What's the best options to.light this up? I'm pretty handy and not afraid to assemble a kit or do a complete diy if I had help picking the pieces out. Thanks in advance.

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It depends on your budget. Stay away from Black Dog LED. HLG is what most will recommend. They're the standard for quantum boards. HLG copy cats are readily available allover alibaba from about a hundred different vendors for half the price of HLG. Budget LED has had some positive feedback around the growing community. Spider farmer is a fantastic brand and they're available on Amazon. The SF-4000 is a great unit. I bought one of those and I bought a 660w quantum board off of alibaba for about $125 cheaper than the 450w SF-4000. Prices keep coming down. The 660w light I bought 6 months ago for 504 delivered is now $680 for 2 or something crazy like that. Lots of great options. Just stay away from black dog. Any company that claims "you will grow 3LB with this light" is so full of horse shit you can smell it through the fucking internet. The price made me laugh too

Anywho, you'll get lots of good recommendations from others. Check around. Do your research. Just don't overpay.

DrGrnThumb90 said:

Hello all. Long timer reader but first time poster. I'm currently working on getting my room set up. 8x12'. Looking for lighting options. I've looked at the BlackDogLed and really liked the results they were getting with those but hated the price. Also looked at the Perfect SUN brand lights. I liked those as well but the guy seemed kinda shady in a few videos I watched. I emailed him a week ago with a few questions and never got a reply back. So figured it best to get.good.opinions here. I'd like to do the full grow in the same room. I will have a 100 amp sub panel in the building. 8x12 with just under 8 foot ceiling height. What's the best options to.light this up? I'm pretty handy and not afraid to assemble a kit or do a complete diy if I had help picking the pieces out. Thanks in advance.

Click to expand...

what's your budget and time frame to be up and running?

with that space and height you could do a mix of led and cmh and get great results for a lot cheaper than pure led.

if you want to go full led, I can also recommend HLG and what I would use if I was going to do boards in there. but like Jonny said there's plenty of decent options if you do your research. I know @Rocket Soul would probably suggest Fotop style boards. ive never used them personally.

strips would be most cost effective and best coverage but that size space is a decent amount work wiring everything up.

ilovereggae said:

what's your budget and time frame to be up and running?

with that space and height you could do a mix of led and cmh and get great results for a lot cheaper than pure led.

if you want to go full led, I can also recommend HLG and what I would use if I was going to do boards in there. but like Jonny said there's plenty of decent options if you do your research. I know @Rocket Soul would probably suggest Fotop style boards. ive never used them personally.

strips would be most cost effective and best coverage but that size space is a decent amount work wiring everything up.

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You know my Jam...

Fotop is a board made by Meijiu led, which is around 1'x3' so has a nice large footprint, has a shit load of diodes, and can be run with no heat sink up to 200w. Its sorta like if you spread out 3 qbs of leds, on 5 qbs of pcb. So just boards, cabling, driver and fraame and off to the races.

They are really nice for larger areas as you can do a 4x2 with basicly 2 connections.

I think @WeedSexWeightsShakes still uses them but i dont knoww if he got a growlog.

ilovereggae said:

what's your budget and time frame to be up and running?

with that space and height you could do a mix of led and cmh and get great results for a lot cheaper than pure led.

if you want to go full led, I can also recommend HLG and what I would use if I was going to do boards in there. but like Jonny said there's plenty of decent options if you do your research. I know @Rocket Soul would probably suggest Fotop style boards. ive never used them personally.

strips would be most cost effective and best coverage but that size space is a decent amount work wiring everything up.

Click to expand...

Not quite settled on a budget yet. Time frame I would like to be ready to start within 4-6 weeks. I'd like to try and stay under 1000 for lighting for now. Even if that means only part of the room is lit. I can add more later. Or even cheaply light the room and upgrade down the road. I can wire things up no problem. I'm doing framing now. It's a room built inside an outdoor garden shed. I'd like to have a sealed room and run C02 in the future. But I wanna walk before I start to run.

DrGrnThumb90 said:

Not quite settled on a budget yet. Time frame I would like to be ready to start within 4-6 weeks. I'd like to try and stay under 1000 for lighting for now. Even if that means only part of the room is lit. I can add more later. Or even cheaply light the room and upgrade down the road. I can wire things up no problem. I'm doing framing now. It's a room built inside an outdoor garden shed. I'd like to have a sealed room and run C02 in the future. But I wanna walk before I start to run.

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Look at Grow Lights Australia. Get their driverless kit and get the drivers separate. Whenever I manage to finish my new flower room that is what I am going to be going for personally. I like the UV-A inclusion and the far red. They have done lots of great tests and have tons of great information on this forum.

jonnynobody said:

It depends on your budget. Stay away from Black Dog LED. HLG is what most will recommend. They're the standard for quantum boards. HLG copy cats are readily available allover alibaba from about a hundred different vendors for half the price of HLG. Budget LED has had some positive feedback around the growing community. Spider farmer is a fantastic brand and they're available on Amazon. The SF-4000 is a great unit. I bought one of those and I bought a 660w quantum board off of alibaba for about $125 cheaper than the 450w SF-4000. Prices keep coming down. The 660w light I bought 6 months ago for 504 delivered is now $680 for 2 or something crazy like that. Lots of great options. Just stay away from black dog. Any company that claims "you will grow 3LB with this light" is so full of horse shit you can smell it through the fucking internet. The price made me laugh too

Anywho, you'll get lots of good recommendations from others. Check around. Do your research. Just don't overpay.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the info. I don't mind going to Alibaba for some lights either. As long as they actually show up and ain't damaged. The boards you got, the 660w, is that the rated watts to the actual draw of power? What kind of footprint did those have?

DrGrnThumb90 said:

Not quite settled on a budget yet. Time frame I would like to be ready to start within 4-6 weeks. I'd like to try and stay under 1000 for lighting for now. Even if that means only part of the room is lit. I can add more later. Or even cheaply light the room and upgrade down the road. I can wire things up no problem. I'm doing framing now. It's a room built inside an outdoor garden shed. I'd like to have a sealed room and run C02 in the future. But I wanna walk before I start to run.

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$1000 is a good budget for lights. You should be able to do a decent DIY build to cover that space.
is the shed insulated? are you planning to add an ac and/or heater to keep your temps/RH in the proper zone? sorry if these questions sound dumb but will help figure out your best option. for instance if heat will be an issue, def go with LED since they run cooler, and you want a higher overall ambient temp with them. if cold is an issue, then you might want a cmh or hps to get the extra heat. would recommend figuring out all your environmental stuff, exhaust, ventilation, humidity control etc before choosing a light.

DrGrnThumb90 said:

Thanks for the info. I don't mind going to Alibaba for some lights either. As long as they actually show up and ain't damaged. The boards you got, the 660w, is that the rated watts to the actual draw of power? What kind of footprint did those have?

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660w at the wall. It covers a 5'x5'. I ordered the 660 from alibaba and a 450w spider farmer from amazon. The alibaba light shipped and arrived before the SF-4000 I ordered from Amazon a day earlier. From the day I paid for the invoice it took 8 days to arrive. They bench test each light prior to shipment, so it's a 3 day hold time before it actually is dropped with DHL. It only spent 5 days in transit. Fantastic service. It was packaged as a box within a box. However, because it had to pass through customs the box clearly is labeled "660w LED grow light." I sure wouldn't want to order that if I lived in Indiana or Texas. Everyone at the local Fedex including your delivery man knows you're the dude
https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Yixiou-Hot-Selling-Full-Spectrum-High_62551149687.html?spm=a2756.order-detail-ta-bn-b.0.0.5fb82fc2zYrAfF

I was so pleased with their service and the quality of their product I ordered 2 more 110W units for my nursery. The quality, service, and shipping speed was just as impressive on my second order. I can't speak for other vendors on 'baba, but I had 2 great experiences.

Here's a link to the two 110w boards I purchased from the same vendor for $187:
https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Full-Spectrum-3000K-5000K-660NM-730NM_62512497620.html?spm=a2756.order-detail-ta-ta-b.0.0.353b2fc2ZCOvuP&bypass=true

Lots of great vendors to choose from. My inbox gets flooded regularly with all sorts of vendors hawking their lights. I've been pleased with the vendor I did business with and want for nothing more so I haven't tried any others.

ilovereggae said:

$1000 is a good budget for lights. You should be able to do a decent DIY build to cover that space.
is the shed insulated? are you planning to add an ac and/or heater to keep your temps/RH in the proper zone? sorry if these questions sound dumb but help figure out your best option. for instance if heat will be an issue, def go with LED since they run cooler, and you want a higher overall ambient temp with them. if cold is an issue, then you might want a cmh or hps to get the extra heat. would recommend figuring out all your environmental stuff, exhaust, ventilation, humidity control etc before choosing a light.

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I live in the midwest. Cold winters and hot summers. The building will be totally insulated with R19. Then walls will be skinned with osb board and haven't decided on painting it white or using the bubble foil insulation on top for some extra R value and reflection. I can add a heater and ac easy enough.

DrGrnThumb90 said:

I live in the midwest. Cold winters and hot summers. The building will be totally insulated with R19. Then walls will be skinned with osb board and haven't decided on painting it white or using the bubble foil insulation on top for some extra R value and reflection. I can add a heater and ac easy enough.

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awesome sounds like you got it figured out. im sure there's someone on here that has a similar setup, coffee not working yet so I can't fully access my brain atm to remember who.

based on timeframe you will be doing your first rounds late spring/early summer so I would def go for led fixtures for now.

ok last question will you have a seperate space for veg or are you going to do a full cycle in same space?

ilovereggae said:

awesome sounds like you got it figured out. im sure there's someone on here that has a similar setup, coffee not working yet so I can't fully access my brain atm to remember who.

based on timeframe you will be doing your first rounds late spring/early summer so I would def go for led fixtures for now.

ok last question will you have a seperate space for veg or are you going to do a full cycle in same space?

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That I haven't decided yet. But for now I'd go full cycle in the room. Down the road maybe I could add another space for veg. What are some advantages/disadvantages to having them separate?

DrGrnThumb90 said:

That I haven't decided yet. But for now I'd go full cycle in the room. Down the road maybe I could add another space for veg. What are some advantages/disadvantages to having them separate?

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all depends on what your goals are. if you just want/need a few harvests per year a single space is fine.

having 2 spaces means you could always have something flowering. depending on how you run your space you could do staggered harvests and pull something every month.

spectrums also come into play. if you want to keep your plants short during veg, a higher color temp like 4000k is great. some ppl even go up to 5000k. then for flower 2700k-3000k is ideal. with seperate spaces this is easier, you just build seperate fixtures for each space.

part of the reason I like the Bridgelux Vesta tuneable is bc I am switching over to earthbox SIPs and will veg the plants for a while in my flower tent before I flip to 12/12. having a tuneable setup allows to dial in those color temps.

also the simplest solution is to just build fixtures with say 3500k strips. those are good for both veg and flower.

What's the spectrum for those 660w on alibaba? @jonnynobody

DrGrnThumb90 said:

What's the spectrum for those 660w on alibaba? @jonnynobody

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They will customize the board to order. I opted for a 50/50 mix of 3000k and 5000k chips for an average of 4000k. They refer to it as "daylight spectrum." I ordered the same spectrum in the 110w units. However, after discussing the color index with some other growers it appears 3000k is more preferential for flowering. If I ordered another 660w board I would opt for all 3000k chips based on the advice of other reputable members. I'd love to experiment to see if there's any observable difference in the end result. I doubt it's anything remarkable, but you never know until you run the test. No matter which configuration you order they include UV and IR chips. The rep I worked with is named Ring. She's very responsive. I never waited more than 12 hours for a response. If it's 2:00 PM here in the US it's roughly a 12 hour time difference, so sometimes you'll attempt a communication while they're sleeping. I always had a response waiting in my inbox in the morning. Great people to work with.

jonnynobody said:

They will customize the board to order. I opted for a 50/50 mix of 3000k and 5000k chips for an average of 4000k. They refer to it as "daylight spectrum." I ordered the same spectrum in the 110w units. However, after discussing the color index with some other growers it appears 3000k is more preferential for flowering. If I ordered another 660w board I would opt for all 3000k chips based on the advice of other reputable members. I'd love to experiment to see if there's any observable difference in the end result. I doubt it's anything remarkable, but you never know until you run the test. No matter which configuration you order they include UV and IR chips. The rep I worked with is named Ring. She's very responsive. I never waited more than 12 hours for a response. If it's 2:00 PM here in the US it's roughly a 12 hour time difference, so sometimes you'll attempt a communication while they're sleeping. I always had a response waiting in my inbox in the morning. Great people to work with.

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fwiw from anecdotal evidence ive seen, mixed spectrum is better than any single color. I also think end of the day more light wins over exact spectrum. id be interested to see a side by side of your current board vs one with all 3000k. my flower setup is currently all 3000k v1 HLG boards but this Vesta fixture im making is also for that reason, to try and see how a mixed spectrum performs instead.

Thanks for all the information so far guys. Definitely have me alot of food for thought. I'm hopeful to have the room insulation finished and at least all of my outlet boxes installed this weekend.

Will this be a sealed room with co2? If not, just curious how you plan on dealing with temps/air exchange during the winter. I'm working on a similar project now.

Temps will be controlled by a mini split and dehumidifier for right now. After a few runs I will then switch to sealed room and C02. I could probably get away with a small ceramic heater during winter with as well as this room is gonna be insulated. Depends alot of your lighting choices as well. Led vs HPS