Opinion on ACT(Aerated Compost Teas)

Northwood

Well-Known Member
My microscope is plenty powerful enough to see bacteria, protozoa, nematodes, fungi etc
Even with your own scanning electron microscope, identifying the specific species of whatever was grown would be impossible without extracting, purifying, and sequencing the nucleic acid found in the tea. Bacteria aren't all the same, and just because it's shaped like a "rod" doesn't mean anything for positive identification. There can be as many as 50,000 different species of bacteria in a single gram of field soil! The diversity is dizzying because a different gram of soil somewhere may only have a few hundred species overlapping with the other. In all cases some of these bacteria are beneficial in some way, some will be innocuous, some will compete with a throw off the balance of nitrifiers in your soil causing N issues, and some may be deadly human pathogens. Which species are we growing in our tanks and bottles?

Bacteria and other creatures who find themselves floating around in an aqueous solution in a bottle obviously find themselves in a radically different environment than your typical rhizosphere. It's obvious that these environmental changes will favor some species over others as many will find the new environment even better than soil, while other species do not and competition ensues. So you'll get a different distribution of species than the raw compost starting material. Is that good or bad? Luck of the draw I guess?

There are hundreds of bacteria inoculant preparations currently licensed in the world. For example I think species from the Rhizobium genus have been available as an inoculant for a long time now. But the way these inoculants are cultured and prepared has no connection to compost teas prepared under uncontrolled conditions and starting material. This is why science can't even ask your question as a hypothesis, because to ask "do compost teas offer real benefits" assumes that compost teas would have the same bacterial composition, and we know that's not true.

What we do know is that fermented teas can often contain more plant available nutrients (NPK) than that contained in the original compost or other starting material. Is this a good thing? It depends on the goal of organic agriculture in general, and these days I honestly don't know what that is anymore. Regardless of whether the salts you use come from a bottle or a tank of brewing poop, the use of readily available salts has severely impacted soil tilth and CEC through the continuing loss of stable carbon. These salts are also highly mobile in soil, and raise the nutrient levels of whatever body of water is nearby causing eutrophication and the end to someone's favorite fishing spot. Haven't we learned our lesson yet?

Anyway, I did find this Korean study that is an interesting read: Effect of Aerated Compost Tea on the Growth Promotion of Lettuce, Soybean, and Sweet Corn in Organic Cultivation
 

P10p

Well-Known Member
Even with your own scanning electron microscope, identifying the specific species of whatever was grown would be impossible without extracting, purifying, and sequencing the nucleic acid found in the tea. Bacteria aren't all the same, and just because it's shaped like a "rod" doesn't mean anything for positive identification. There can be as many as 50,000 different species of bacteria in a single gram of field soil! The diversity is dizzying because a different gram of soil somewhere may only have a few hundred species overlapping with the other. In all cases some of these bacteria are beneficial in some way, some will be innocuous, some will compete with a throw off the balance of nitrifiers in your soil causing N issues, and some may be deadly human pathogens. Which species are we growing in our tanks and bottles?

Bacteria and other creatures who find themselves floating around in an aqueous solution in a bottle obviously find themselves in a radically different environment than your typical rhizosphere. It's obvious that these environmental changes will favor some species over others as many will find the new environment even better than soil, while other species do not and competition ensues. So you'll get a different distribution of species than the raw compost starting material. Is that good or bad? Luck of the draw I guess?

There are hundreds of bacteria inoculant preparations currently licensed in the world. For example I think species from the Rhizobium genus have been available as an inoculant for a long time now. But the way these inoculants are cultured and prepared has no connection to compost teas prepared under uncontrolled conditions and starting material. This is why science can't even ask your question as a hypothesis, because to ask "do compost teas offer real benefits" assumes that compost teas would have the same bacterial composition, and we know that's not true.

What we do know is that fermented teas can often contain more plant available nutrients (NPK) than that contained in the original compost or other starting material. Is this a good thing? It depends on the goal of organic agriculture in general, and these days I honestly don't know what that is anymore. Regardless of whether the salts you use come from a bottle or a tank of brewing poop, the use of readily available salts has severely impacted soil tilth and CEC through the continuing loss of stable carbon. These salts are also highly mobile in soil, and raise the nutrient levels of whatever body of water is nearby causing eutrophication and the end to someone's favorite fishing spot. Haven't we learned our lesson yet?

Anyway, I did find this Korean study that is an interesting read: Effect of Aerated Compost Tea on the Growth Promotion of Lettuce, Soybean, and Sweet Corn in Organic Cultivation
You don't necessarily need identification of individual bacteria for a microscope to be useful. You simply need to confirm or deny the presence of microbe growth. There really is even no point in identifying individual microbes as many of them haven't even been discovered yet.

The goal of ACT if that you're aerating it with hopes of multiplying bacteria which thrive in oxygen rich environments, stacking the deck against pathogens. That's how I see it laid out at least. That study was a great read and seems to bode well for the ACT community!

Thanks for the write up very helpful!
 

Northwood

Well-Known Member
The goal of ACT if that you're aerating it with hopes of multiplying bacteria which thrive in oxygen rich environments, stacking the deck against pathogens.
Well being aerated the good news is that it's extremely unlikely you'll be brewing a batch of Clostridium botulinum at least.
 

rkmcdon

Well-Known Member
Thanks for all the replies guys. I came with this question because I found a lot of naysayers in my research. And many times, all the beneficial claims are made with no proof.

For example, just because we know we are breeding bacteria is not enough proof to prove that act works. I want real substantial proof of the benefits.

I was able to find a study that did show act having no benefits over compost, ewc, and commercial product. Only thing is it was done using certain trees.
I was interested in this as well and did some searching. I was not able to find any research showing a benefit to ACT. I stopped doing them as a result but i do use quite a lot of ewcs and DTE's bio-live and do a top dress with both mid flower as well.

There is certainly plenty of anecdotal evidence here and other places. People who have used both and swear by the use of ACT's. Conversely, I've not seen much evidence of people having worse outcomes with their use. Take that for what its worth :)
 

ChrispyCritter

Well-Known Member
Get a microscope or you are just hoping. Compost teas can and will throw your medium out of whack. Topdressing compost is safe. Malted barley teas will jump start your microlife and work with your compost.
 

Rurumo

Well-Known Member
All you can do is experiment for yourself to see if there is enough of a benefit for you to continue using them. I think they're great, but I don't notice a benefit from more frequent use than once per week, and I'm leaning towards once every two weeks. I throw in a little trichoderma and a few bacillus sp just so i have a reasonable idea of what the tea may or may not contain, but I've always had good luck with straight EWC tea too. The next time I do a grow with a single strain I'll do a side by side, same nutes, but with or without the tea. The other thing I've been playing around with lately that surprised me is Clackmascootz's barley and corn SSTs. I used it quite a bit on outdoor plants in containers last summer and the plants loved it. I know we don't have much evidence for some of these practices but when someone like cootz recommends something over a period of many years, and you have seen their results and trust their judgement, there is no harm in trying it out for yourself. Just take notes, compare, and be observant and see for yourself whether it's BS or something great.
 
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