Over 30% of US Now Non-Religious!

Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
[youtube]urwVVycMp8g&feature=g-u-u&context=G2fed9eeFUAAAAAAAGAA[/youtube]

With all the darkness we see on a daily basis, this is pretty damn enlightening, and while it's hard to talk to ordinary Americans about most topics, there are plenty of those that actually care about knowing what they're saying.

Old beliefs will eventually become extinct and that is the reality.

This actually gives me a little shred of hope for the future...

I'm going to plan a trip to DC for the Reason Rally next year!
 
B

boneheadbob

Well-Known Member
Yeah, things are a lot better now that less people fear the Lord and getting better every day.By the time we get to 50 % this place will be a utopia
 
P

psari

Well-Known Member
I blame it on Negativland's work and Wikipedia.

[video=youtube;a1vYGi7Hiro]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a1vYGi7Hiro[/video]
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
boneheadbob said:
Yeah, things are a lot better now that less people fear the Lord and getting better every day.By the time we get to 50 % this place will be a utopia
Click to expand...

Yeah, thinks aren't going to change overnight. Right now we're seeing the consequences of having a population with high religiosity.

The declines are fucking beautiful, if they stay consistent, check back in 20 years and see where we're at.
 
tyler.durden

tyler.durden

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:

Yeah, thinks aren't going to change overnight. Right now we're seeing the consequences of having a population with high religiosity.

The declines are fucking beautiful, if they stay consistent, check back in 20 years and see where we're at.
Click to expand...
Hey, Pad! I think Bob was being sarcastic, but I share your enthusiasm about this trend. It seems like the herding of cats is getting more effective all the time, I'm going to try to make it to a couple conventions this year. That Reason Rally looks like the biggest and best...
 
mudminer

mudminer

Active Member
Wow. Im honestly surprised its that low. I would certainly have guessed a higher percentage.
 
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Yamabushi

Member
Hmmm I'm not religious (I subscribe to no set ideology) but I do believe in God as a creative and inspiring force. So what does such a simplistic statistic really mean? I also have a big problem with those who are staunch atheists parading themselves as the champions of reason. To my mind they are almost as guilty as the religionists in terms of cherry picking data to fit their own belief systems.

On the subject of religious belief and social standing. I think it is more likely that the collapse of religious values will instead only increase the amount of cold selfish mentalities on display in society as pure philosophical materialism and genetic pre-determinism lead to an increasing hardness of peoples hearts. All encouraged by the dominant minority in order to break communal bonds (which like it or not, the church is a big part of) and render society a collection of isolated individuals more able to be dominated and controlled. God help us in the brave new world.
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
Yamabushi said:
Hmmm I'm not religious (I subscribe to no set ideology) but I do believe in God as a creative and inspiring force. So what does such a simplistic statistic really mean? I also have a big problem with those who are staunch atheists parading themselves as the champions of reason. To my mind they are almost as guilty as the religionists in terms of cherry picking data to fit their own belief systems.

On the subject of religious belief and social standing. I think it is more likely that the collapse of religious values will instead only increase the amount of cold selfish mentalities on display in society as pure philosophical materialism and genetic pre-determinism lead to an increasing hardness of peoples hearts. All encouraged by the dominant minority in order to break communal bonds (which like it or not, the church is a big part of) and render society a collection of isolated individuals more able to be dominated and controlled. God help us in the brave new world.
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Who are you speaking of when you mention 'staunch atheists', and what have they cherry picked to further their agenda? Were you speaking generally or did you have someone in mind specifically?

What leads you to believe the collapse of religious values will also lead to the collapse of normal values? The values we hold dear and feel are important do not originate from religion, though you may believe they do. IMO, that's something that we've been conditioned with to make us think it's true. If that was the case, why don't the statistics reflect it?

Why would pure philosophical materialism and genetic pre-determinism replace religious values?

What do you mean exactly by "hardness of peoples hearts"?

Finally, why do you feel a stronger collective awareness, emphasis on science and education, and a more intelligent population would be easier to dominate and control?

I really am having a tough time coming to the same conclusions as you, walk me through it..
 
darkdestruction420

darkdestruction420

Well-Known Member
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Padawanbater2 again.

For post #9 above.

One thing I would also mention is that religious values have also caused a huge amount of suffering in the world. both now and in the past. theyve caused countless wars and countless acts of utter barbarity on others because they are different. being religious doesnt make you a good person.
 
Zaehet Strife

Zaehet Strife

Well-Known Member
we experience but a momentary glimpse of this astounding universe, it is sad to still see so many wasting it away on spiritual fantasy.
 
D

DaSprout

Well-Known Member
In my honest opinion. I feel that with the mentioned decline in the number of people that subscribe to organized religion. We may soon see a growth in the number of people that may not be a part of a specific religious sect or group, but rather more people that consider a broader spiritualistic approach to their lives.
 
eye exaggerate

eye exaggerate

Well-Known Member
Yamabushi said:
Hmmm I'm not religious (I subscribe to no set ideology) but I do believe in God as a creative and inspiring force. So what does such a simplistic statistic really mean? I also have a big problem with those who are staunch atheists parading themselves as the champions of reason. To my mind they are almost as guilty as the religionists in terms of cherry picking data to fit their own belief systems.

On the subject of religious belief and social standing. I think it is more likely that the collapse of religious values will instead only increase the amount of cold selfish mentalities on display in society as pure philosophical materialism and genetic pre-determinism lead to an increasing hardness of peoples hearts. All encouraged by the dominant minority in order to break communal bonds (which like it or not, the church is a big part of) and render society a collection of isolated individuals more able to be dominated and controlled. God help us in the brave new world.
Click to expand...

...I like this post. I even cherry-picked a piece of it :)
 
Jakebake420

Jakebake420

Member
boneheadbob said:
Yeah, things are a lot better now that less people fear the Lord and getting better every day.By the time we get to 50 % this place will be a utopia
Click to expand...
I could not have said it better. Fewer people should fear the lord, and really start fearing his followers . . .
 
mudminer

mudminer

Active Member
Ive actually been thinkig about this stat (30%) for a little bit now which obviously leaves 70% claiming to be religious. As Ive stated in a previous post I thought that the citing of 30% was low. While I dont have any data to back up my statement, it isnt something I just pulled out of my rear end. Ive been an observer of people and things for quite some time. Im wondering if people are confusing being "religious" with being "spiritual"? I could completely agree with the stat that was cited if it was applied to people who considered themselves non spiritual. But I still have a hard time attributing the implied 70% to folks who say they apply actual religiosity to their spiritual beliefs. This post isnt made to belittle anyones spiritual beliefs, its just something I was wondering out loud (as it were) based on observations Ive made in the past and to make some ditinction between being spiritual and being religious.
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
What percentage of people would you say hold no religious dogma but still consider themselves to be 'spiritual'?

What I see many times is people who claim to be 'spiritual' but not religious have some sort of abstract connection to their previous religion, so while they may claim they're not actually religious, they get their faith from something stemming from something literally defined an religion. When questioned about this, very rarely are you ever given an answer that actually makes sense and are more often than not left with even more questions than before. (personal experience)

Or...

Someone claims they're 'spiritual', but when questioned further, they have pretty much no idea what they are even trying to say, they want to seem like they're moral individuals to the rest of society while still remaining on the fringe group that claims no religion. So they can sort of enjoy the best of both worlds without actually understanding their own stance on the topic.
 
mudminer

mudminer

Active Member
Padawanbater2 said:
What percentage of people would you say hold no religious dogma but still consider themselves to be 'spiritual'? What I see many times is people who claim to be 'spiritual' but not religious have some sort of abstract connection to their previous religion, so while they may claim they're not actually religious, they get their faith from something stemming from something literally defined an religion. When questioned about this, very rarely are you ever given an answer that actually makes sense and are more often than not left with even more questions than before. (personal experience)Or...Someone claims they're 'spiritual', but when questioned further, they have pretty much no idea what they are even trying to say, they want to seem like they're moral individuals to the rest of society while still remaining on the fringe group that claims no religion. So they can sort of enjoy the best of both worlds without actually understanding their own stance on the topic.
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Pad, I think the two observations you made and described were precisely the conclusions that I have come to. Not to mention, probably better articulated than I would have been able to.(lol) As far as the actual percentage of religious to spiritual folk out there I wouldnt be hesitant to give that a 30% to 70% split. Heavy on the spiritual side. I guess, from what Ive seen, people have come to the place where they accept the spiritual part of their ("heritage"?) as you posted, yet they didnt see the need to take it to the point of getting religious about it. But at the same time if what they believe is ever called into question, their very identity seems to be called into question. As if their identities are tied soundly to what they believe. And if they were to question what they do and always have believed, the very basis of who they are would come into question. Which to me makes an individuals spirituality a very personal thing, not to be dictated to by religion and why I believe a distinction between the two should be observed.
 
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