sandmonkey
Well-Known Member
me too 
i don't really like green buds at all.
i don't really like green buds at all.
Ph and Flushing!
- Thread starter GayRioThug
- Start date
Matt Rize
Hashmaster
Do you flush to achieve this fading?
I think i have a ph problem in my organic soil, would you guys please give me a feedback on whats wrong with my plants?
https://www.rollitup.org/marijuana-plant-problems/378389-help-newbie-diagnose.html
https://www.rollitup.org/marijuana-plant-problems/378389-help-newbie-diagnose.html
cavorkybuds420
Member
Ight so some people feed with just water especially with subcools super bomb soil. His idea is ingenius. The fact of the matter is would you rather smoke dank or smoke NPK. I feed organic not because of taste because of my family. When i had kids i had to make a decision and there safety was first. I need my medi no matter what so i had to think whats is the best way to keep them safe. Keep every thing the way mother nature intended. I smoke dank tasting nuggets. I dont smoke fish emulsion bat shit iguana shit yucca extract or seaweed. I flush so i no there isint any of that in there. Whether the benifical mold eats it or not its still a by product of some shit that stanks and i could imagine the shots i feed my plant would tast good if i straight took that shot. As for ph if you use an organic buffer such as compost with lime in it you will be fine. The only ph problem ive had so far is when i mixed peat moss with compost 50/50 then added perlite 50/50 to that mix. The ph shot close to seven because the compost is neutral and it was a little less than 50 percent. The plant is loving life after i flush a few waterings. Oh and as for the you cant burn with organics rule of thumb not true. you can very easly burn clones or seedlings. And if the organics build up then you will need to flush until the water drains clear. NUTES WILL ALWAYS ADJUST YOUR PH ORGANICS OR NOT. If you flush in between waterings you benificial mold will leave of less waste. The mold is like yeaste when it eats it lets off gases. Which when feed constantly they will inturn burn i have seen it first hand. Now as for the ending flush i like hot knifes and so when i take a hit i can tell if it was chemical or organic flushed or not flushed slow dry or super quick cure or no cure all on the way my throat feels. I have hit the chemical bound shit that burnt my throat for days and organics that tasted like the poop they were feed with. So always make sure you use somethign to stable ph like compost or dolimite lime. As for chloryphil it is slowly realesed during drying process and some during flush i flush last to weeks to achive less chloryphil when drying comes. Dry without trimming and it will take close to four weeks you will need to keep humidity down but in turn you will have no chloryphil trimming will be a bitch but if its tast and effect you after do it that way. I dont because im hell inpatient but the OG's from UK do it an they got dank.
woodsmaneh!
Well-Known Member
I put the summery first. It is also backed up by science links attached.
It's never too late to learn good information and grow better and more. An open mind is a wonderful thing.
Peace
Summary:
Pre-harvest flushing puts the plant(s) under serious stress. The plant has to deal with nutrient deficiencies in a very important part of its cycle. Strong changes in the amount of dissolved substances in the root-zone stress the roots, possibly to the point of direct physical damage to them. Many immobile elements are no more available for further metabolic processes. We are loosing the fan leaves and damage will show likely on new growth as well.
The grower should react in an educated way to the plant needs. Excessive, deficient or unbalanced levels should be avoided regardless the nutrient source. Nutrient levels should be gradually adjusted to the lesser needs in later flowering. Stress factors should be limited as far as possible. If that is accomplished throughout the entire life cycle, there shouldn’t be any excessive nutrient compounds in the plants tissue. It doesn’t sound likely to the author that you can correct growing errors (significant lower mobile nutrient compound levels) with pre-harvest flushing.
[FONT="]Drying and curing (when done right) on the other hand have proved (In many studies) to have a major impact on taste and flavor, by breaking down chlorophyll's and converting starches into sugars. Most attributes blamed on un-flushed buds may be the result of unbalanced nutrition and/or over fertilization and improper drying/curing.[/FONT]
For one thing, the most common way that growers flush their crops is by giving their crops water that has no nutrients in it. But this doesn't fully cleanse your crops. It only starves your plants so they lose vigorous floral growth and resin percentages just before harvest.
Other growers use flushing formulas that generally consist of a few chemicals that sometimes have the ability to pull a limited amount of residues out of your plants.
The deep stuff...
Nutrient fundamentals and uptake:
Until recently it was common thought that all nutrients are absorbed by plant roots as ions of mineral elements. However in newer studies more and more evidence emerged that additionally plant roots are capable of taking up complex organic molecules like amino acids directly thus bypassing the mineralization process.
The major nutrient uptake processes are:
1) Active transport mechanism into root hairs (the plant has to put energy in it, ATP driven) which is selective to some degree. This is one way the plant (being immobile) can adjust to the environment.
2) Passive transport (diffusion) through symplast to endodermis.
http://www.biol.sc.edu/courses/bio102/f99-3637.html
The claim only ‘chemical’ ferted plants need to be flushed should be taken with a grain of salt. Organic and synthetic ferted plants take up mineral ions alike, probably to a different degree though. Many influences play key roles in the taste and flavor of the final bud, like the nutrition balance and strength throughout the entire life cycle of the plant, the drying and curing process and other environmental conditions.
3) Active transport mechanism of organic molecules into root hairs via endocytosis.
Here is a simplified overview of nutrient functions:
Nitrogen is needed to build chlorophyll, amino acids, and proteins. Phosphorus is necessary for photosynthesis and other growth processes. Potassium is utilized to form sugar and starch and to activate enzymes. Magnesium also plays a role in activating enzymes and is part of chlorophyll. Calcium is used during cell growth and division and is part of the cell wall. Sulfur is part of amino acids and proteins.
Plants also require trace elements, which include boron, chlorine, copper, iron, manganese, sodium, zinc, molybdenum, nickel, cobalt, and silicon.
Copper, iron, and manganese are used in photosynthesis. Molybdenum, nickel, and cobalt are necessary for the movement of nitrogen in the plant. Boron is important for reproduction, while chlorine stimulates root growth and development. Sodium benefits the movement of water within the plant and zinc is neeeded for enzymes and used in auxins (organic plant hormones). Finally, silicon helps to build tough cell walls for better heat and drought tolerance.
http://www.sidwell.edu
You can get an idea from this how closely all the essential elements are involved in the many metabolic processes within the plant, often relying on each other.
Nutrient movement and mobility inside the plant:
Besides endocytosis, there are two major pathways inside the plant, the xylem and the phloem. When water and minerals are absorbed by plant roots, these substances must be transported up to the plant's stems and leaves for photosynthesis and further metabolic processes. This upward transport happens in the xylem. While the xylem is able to transport organic compounds, the phloem is much more adapted to do so.
The organic compounds thus originating in the leaves have to be moved throughout the plant, upwards and downwards, to where they are needed. This transport happens in the phloem. Compounds that are moving through the phloem are mostly:
Sugars as sugary saps, organic nitrogen compounds (amino acids and amides, ureides and legumes), hormones and proteins.
http://www.sirinet.net
Not all nutrient compounds are movable within the plant.
1) N, P, K, Mg and S are considered mobile: they can move up and down the plant in both xylem and phloem.
Deficiency appears on old leaves first.
2) Ca, Fe, Zn, Mo, B, Cu, Mn are considered immobile: they only move up the plant in the xylem.
Deficiency appears on new leaves first.
http://generalhorticulture.tamu.edu
Storage organelles:
Salts and organic metabolites can be stored in storage organelles. The most important storage organelle is the vacuole, which can contribute up to 90% of the cell volume. The majority of compounds found in the vacuole are sugars, polysaccharides, organic acids and proteins though.
http://jeb.biologists.org.pdf
Trans-location:
Now that the basics are explained, we can take a look at the trans-location process. It should be already clear that only mobile elements can be trans located through the phloem. Immobile elements cant be trans located and are not more available to the plant for further metabolic processes and new plant growth.
Since flushing (in theory) induces a nutrient deficiency in the root-zone, the translocation process aids in the plants survival. Trans-location is transportation of assimilates through the phloem from source (a net exporter of assimilate) to sink (a net importer of assimilate). Sources are mostly mature fan leaves and sinks are mostly apical meristems, lateral meristem, fruit, seed and developing leaves etc.
You can see this by the yellowing and later dying of the mature fan leaves from the second day on after flushing started. Developing leaves, bud leaves and calyxes don’t serve as sources, they are sinks. Changes in those plant parts are due to the deficient immobile elements which start to indicate on new growth first.
Unfortunately, several metabolic processes are unable to take place anymore since other elements needed are no longer available (the immobile ones). This includes processes where nitrogen and phosphorus, which have likely the most impact on taste, are involved.
For example nitrogen: usually plants use nitrogen to form plant proteins. Enzyme systems rapidly reduce nitrate-N (NO3-) to compounds that are used to build amino-nitrogen which is the basis for amino acids. Amino acids are building blocks for proteins, most of them are plant enzymes responsible for all the chemical changes important for plant growth.
Sulfur and calcium among others have major roles in production and activating of proteins, thereby decreasing nitrate within the plant. Excess nitrate within the plant may result from unbalanced nutrition rather than an excess of nitrogen.
http://muextension.missouri.edu
Summary:
Preharvest flushing puts the plant(s) under serious stress. The plant has to deal with nutrient deficiencies in a very important part of its cycle. Strong changes in the amount of dissolved substances in the root-zone stress the roots, possibly to the point of direct physical damage to them. Many immobile elements are no more available for further metabolic processes. We are loosing the fan leaves and damage will show likely on new growth as well.
The grower should react in an educated way to the plant needs. Excessive, deficient or unbalanced levels should be avoided regardless the nutrient source. Nutrient levels should be gradually adjusted to the lesser needs in later flowering. Stress factors should be limited as far as possible. If that is accomplished throughout the entire life cycle, there shouldn’t be any excessive nutrient compounds in the plants tissue. It doesn’t sound likely to the author that you can correct growing errors (significant lower mobile nutrient compound levels) with preharvest flushing.
Drying and curing (when done right) on the other hand have proved (In many studies) to have a major impact on taste and flavor, by breaking down chlorophylls and converting starches into sugars. Most attributes blamed on un-flushed buds may be the result of unbalanced nutrition and/or overfert and unproper drying/curing.
It's never too late to learn good information and grow better and more. An open mind is a wonderful thing.
Peace
Summary:
Pre-harvest flushing puts the plant(s) under serious stress. The plant has to deal with nutrient deficiencies in a very important part of its cycle. Strong changes in the amount of dissolved substances in the root-zone stress the roots, possibly to the point of direct physical damage to them. Many immobile elements are no more available for further metabolic processes. We are loosing the fan leaves and damage will show likely on new growth as well.
The grower should react in an educated way to the plant needs. Excessive, deficient or unbalanced levels should be avoided regardless the nutrient source. Nutrient levels should be gradually adjusted to the lesser needs in later flowering. Stress factors should be limited as far as possible. If that is accomplished throughout the entire life cycle, there shouldn’t be any excessive nutrient compounds in the plants tissue. It doesn’t sound likely to the author that you can correct growing errors (significant lower mobile nutrient compound levels) with pre-harvest flushing.
[FONT="]Drying and curing (when done right) on the other hand have proved (In many studies) to have a major impact on taste and flavor, by breaking down chlorophyll's and converting starches into sugars. Most attributes blamed on un-flushed buds may be the result of unbalanced nutrition and/or over fertilization and improper drying/curing.[/FONT]
For one thing, the most common way that growers flush their crops is by giving their crops water that has no nutrients in it. But this doesn't fully cleanse your crops. It only starves your plants so they lose vigorous floral growth and resin percentages just before harvest.
Other growers use flushing formulas that generally consist of a few chemicals that sometimes have the ability to pull a limited amount of residues out of your plants.
The deep stuff...
Nutrient fundamentals and uptake:
Until recently it was common thought that all nutrients are absorbed by plant roots as ions of mineral elements. However in newer studies more and more evidence emerged that additionally plant roots are capable of taking up complex organic molecules like amino acids directly thus bypassing the mineralization process.
The major nutrient uptake processes are:
1) Active transport mechanism into root hairs (the plant has to put energy in it, ATP driven) which is selective to some degree. This is one way the plant (being immobile) can adjust to the environment.
2) Passive transport (diffusion) through symplast to endodermis.
http://www.biol.sc.edu/courses/bio102/f99-3637.html
The claim only ‘chemical’ ferted plants need to be flushed should be taken with a grain of salt. Organic and synthetic ferted plants take up mineral ions alike, probably to a different degree though. Many influences play key roles in the taste and flavor of the final bud, like the nutrition balance and strength throughout the entire life cycle of the plant, the drying and curing process and other environmental conditions.
3) Active transport mechanism of organic molecules into root hairs via endocytosis.
Here is a simplified overview of nutrient functions:
Nitrogen is needed to build chlorophyll, amino acids, and proteins. Phosphorus is necessary for photosynthesis and other growth processes. Potassium is utilized to form sugar and starch and to activate enzymes. Magnesium also plays a role in activating enzymes and is part of chlorophyll. Calcium is used during cell growth and division and is part of the cell wall. Sulfur is part of amino acids and proteins.
Plants also require trace elements, which include boron, chlorine, copper, iron, manganese, sodium, zinc, molybdenum, nickel, cobalt, and silicon.
Copper, iron, and manganese are used in photosynthesis. Molybdenum, nickel, and cobalt are necessary for the movement of nitrogen in the plant. Boron is important for reproduction, while chlorine stimulates root growth and development. Sodium benefits the movement of water within the plant and zinc is neeeded for enzymes and used in auxins (organic plant hormones). Finally, silicon helps to build tough cell walls for better heat and drought tolerance.
http://www.sidwell.edu
You can get an idea from this how closely all the essential elements are involved in the many metabolic processes within the plant, often relying on each other.
Nutrient movement and mobility inside the plant:
Besides endocytosis, there are two major pathways inside the plant, the xylem and the phloem. When water and minerals are absorbed by plant roots, these substances must be transported up to the plant's stems and leaves for photosynthesis and further metabolic processes. This upward transport happens in the xylem. While the xylem is able to transport organic compounds, the phloem is much more adapted to do so.
The organic compounds thus originating in the leaves have to be moved throughout the plant, upwards and downwards, to where they are needed. This transport happens in the phloem. Compounds that are moving through the phloem are mostly:
Sugars as sugary saps, organic nitrogen compounds (amino acids and amides, ureides and legumes), hormones and proteins.
http://www.sirinet.net
Not all nutrient compounds are movable within the plant.
1) N, P, K, Mg and S are considered mobile: they can move up and down the plant in both xylem and phloem.
Deficiency appears on old leaves first.
2) Ca, Fe, Zn, Mo, B, Cu, Mn are considered immobile: they only move up the plant in the xylem.
Deficiency appears on new leaves first.
http://generalhorticulture.tamu.edu
Storage organelles:
Salts and organic metabolites can be stored in storage organelles. The most important storage organelle is the vacuole, which can contribute up to 90% of the cell volume. The majority of compounds found in the vacuole are sugars, polysaccharides, organic acids and proteins though.
http://jeb.biologists.org.pdf
Trans-location:
Now that the basics are explained, we can take a look at the trans-location process. It should be already clear that only mobile elements can be trans located through the phloem. Immobile elements cant be trans located and are not more available to the plant for further metabolic processes and new plant growth.
Since flushing (in theory) induces a nutrient deficiency in the root-zone, the translocation process aids in the plants survival. Trans-location is transportation of assimilates through the phloem from source (a net exporter of assimilate) to sink (a net importer of assimilate). Sources are mostly mature fan leaves and sinks are mostly apical meristems, lateral meristem, fruit, seed and developing leaves etc.
You can see this by the yellowing and later dying of the mature fan leaves from the second day on after flushing started. Developing leaves, bud leaves and calyxes don’t serve as sources, they are sinks. Changes in those plant parts are due to the deficient immobile elements which start to indicate on new growth first.
Unfortunately, several metabolic processes are unable to take place anymore since other elements needed are no longer available (the immobile ones). This includes processes where nitrogen and phosphorus, which have likely the most impact on taste, are involved.
For example nitrogen: usually plants use nitrogen to form plant proteins. Enzyme systems rapidly reduce nitrate-N (NO3-) to compounds that are used to build amino-nitrogen which is the basis for amino acids. Amino acids are building blocks for proteins, most of them are plant enzymes responsible for all the chemical changes important for plant growth.
Sulfur and calcium among others have major roles in production and activating of proteins, thereby decreasing nitrate within the plant. Excess nitrate within the plant may result from unbalanced nutrition rather than an excess of nitrogen.
http://muextension.missouri.edu
Summary:
Preharvest flushing puts the plant(s) under serious stress. The plant has to deal with nutrient deficiencies in a very important part of its cycle. Strong changes in the amount of dissolved substances in the root-zone stress the roots, possibly to the point of direct physical damage to them. Many immobile elements are no more available for further metabolic processes. We are loosing the fan leaves and damage will show likely on new growth as well.
The grower should react in an educated way to the plant needs. Excessive, deficient or unbalanced levels should be avoided regardless the nutrient source. Nutrient levels should be gradually adjusted to the lesser needs in later flowering. Stress factors should be limited as far as possible. If that is accomplished throughout the entire life cycle, there shouldn’t be any excessive nutrient compounds in the plants tissue. It doesn’t sound likely to the author that you can correct growing errors (significant lower mobile nutrient compound levels) with preharvest flushing.
Drying and curing (when done right) on the other hand have proved (In many studies) to have a major impact on taste and flavor, by breaking down chlorophylls and converting starches into sugars. Most attributes blamed on un-flushed buds may be the result of unbalanced nutrition and/or overfert and unproper drying/curing.
cavorkybuds420
Member
If plants are defiecent and stressed to the point of burning fiberous roots why do they continue to swell after flush begins. The point of flush is to leach of all chemical compounds within the plant its self. So we are only getting the chemical compounds within the medicine that are most healing, not NPK and the other 10 secondary nutrients. That dont heal but harm us when combusted or vaporized. If growers were worried about those nutrients within the plant they wouldnt smoke it but eat the plant raw as we do all other vegitable and fruit so we could inturn intake those nutrients wich make us healthy as well as our desired cannabis. ITS THC AND CBD WE DESIRE MOST FROM THE PLANT. Not NPK and all other secondary and macro nutrients. Hey doesnt take science and research to paint it clear we enjoy and embrace this plant for it medicinal value.
