Poor man's indoor lights

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Relic79

Well-Known Member
When I was researching no till, I came across this post from @Northwood

Here is an example of your "poor man's led" in action.

The general gist is, you can make lots of different things work, some better than others, but there are bare minimums you need to try to achieve regardless of technology or technique.

My budget 5X5 setup

I'm growing my Canadian legal limit (4 plants), all White Widow X Jacky White from fem seeds. It cost me less than $300 Canadian dollars to adequately light the 25 square feet with over 33 watts per square foot (840 watts total right now). Not my first grow with these, or with this soil. The...
www.rollitup.org

I'm not saying do one thing or the other, just that you could do it, and wouldn't be the first.
 
N

Northwood

Well-Known Member
Relic79 said:
When I was researching no till, I came across this post from @Northwood

Here is an example of your "poor man's led" in action.

The general gist is, you can make lots of different things work, some better than others, but there are bare minimums you need to try to achieve regardless of technology or technique.

My budget 5X5 setup

I'm growing my Canadian legal limit (4 plants), all White Widow X Jacky White from fem seeds. It cost me less than $300 Canadian dollars to adequately light the 25 square feet with over 33 watts per square foot (840 watts total right now). Not my first grow with these, or with this soil. The...
www.rollitup.org

I'm not saying do one thing or the other, just that you could do it, and wouldn't be the first.
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My wife commandeered all my household LED bulb stuff for her no-till veggie growing room she's building. I should have photos next month of her great work. lol

I'm still not sure if the 4 Kingbrite 240w V4s are an upgrade or a downgrade from my regular light bulbs. What I gain in running efficiency I lose in flexibility and coverage. I do plan on supplementing the quantum boards with a couple bathroom bar fixtures I have with regular warm-white (3,000K) LED bulbs when I flip my plant in a few days. At 16 to 18" above the canopy with the 4 quantum boards, I still have a "cold" spot in the center even with them running full power. So I'll move the boards closer together to make room for the bathroom bars along opposite walls of the tent. That adds 16 bulbs = an extra 230 watts or so, for a total of 1,190 watts of LED in the tent if I continue to run the quantum boards at full power.

I'm running some crazy VPD numbers right now with the humidity around 30% and the temperature at 28 to 30 degrees Celsius, yet the plants seem to be saying: "Hell yes we can take more light!". I don't understand. Lol
 
NukaKola

NukaKola

Well-Known Member
Northwood said:
My wife commandeered all my household LED bulb stuff for her no-till veggie growing room she's building. I should have photos next month of her great work. lol

I'm still not sure if the 4 Kingbrite 240w V4s are an upgrade or a downgrade from my regular light bulbs. What I gain in running efficiency I lose in flexibility and coverage. I do plan on supplementing the quantum boards with a couple bathroom bar fixtures I have with regular warm-white (3,000K) LED bulbs when I flip my plant in a few days. At 16 to 18" above the canopy with the 4 quantum boards, I still have a "cold" spot in the center even with them running full power. So I'll move the boards closer together to make room for the bathroom bars along opposite walls of the tent. That adds 16 bulbs = an extra 230 watts or so, for a total of 1,190 watts of LED in the tent if I continue to run the quantum boards at full power.

I'm running some crazy VPD numbers right now with the humidity around 30% and the temperature at 28 to 30 degrees Celsius, yet the plants seem to be saying: "Hell yes we can take more light!". I don't understand. Lol
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I would say the kingbrites would be an upgrade. LM301’s are among the most efficient diodes on the market. What type of diodes do your standard bulbs use?
 
N

Northwood

Well-Known Member
NukaKola said:
I would say the kingbrites would be an upgrade. LM301’s are among the most efficient diodes on the market. What type of diodes do your standard bulbs use?
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Yeah I mentioned efficiency in my post, but as I also said - I sacrifice coverage and flexibility. I have a few ol' Cree light bulbs, and I'm guessing they likely use Cree diodes. The others from Home Depot, Dollar Store, Costco, and Amazon Basics have "mystery" diodes. lol

Keep in mind that I was only using 840W with the light bulbs, but still managing up to 1.5 grams per flowering Watt if I bothered to do training like SCROG. While I don't expect that this round (I'm only growing one plant in my 5X5), it should be interesting to see what the yield is like. This will be my first time flowering with quantum boards instead of HPS or regular LED light bulbs Lol, so maybe it will surprise me. I'm trying to keep an open mind here, since I'm still in veg and only flipping in the next few days. I better darn well get more than one kg from this plant.

Even with the greater efficiency of the LM301H, I bet I use more total watt-hours with the quantum boards for a complete cycle than with light bulbs. It's because when I start my seedlings, only 2 bulbs are screwed in (turned on) per plant. That turns into 3 bulbs, then 4 bulbs, then 6 bulbs, etc. per plant as they grow. So I never uselessly waste photons lighting up my soil or the tent floor - only the plants. The only time I have all the bulbs turned on is upon flip to flower, when I screw in the remaining 3000k bulbs.
 
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SpideyManDan

SpideyManDan

Well-Known Member
Northwood said:
Yeah I mentioned efficiency in my post, but as I also said - I sacrifice coverage and flexibility. I have a few ol' Cree light bulbs, and I'm guessing they likely use Cree diodes. The others from Home Depot, Dollar Store, Costco, and Amazon Basics have "mystery" diodes. lol

Keep in mind that I was only using 840W with the light bulbs, but still managing up to 1.5 grams per flowering Watt if I bothered to do training like SCROG. While I don't expect that this round (I'm only growing one plant in my 5X5), it should be interesting to see what the yield is like. This will be my first time flowering with quantum boards instead of HPS or regular LED light bulbs Lol, so maybe it will surprise me. I'm trying to keep an open mind here, since I'm still in veg and only flipping in the next few days. I better darn well get more than one kg from this plant.

Even with the greater efficiency of the LM301H, I bet I use more total watt-hours with the quantum boards for a complete cycle than with light bulbs. It's because when I start my seedlings, only 2 bulbs are screwed in (turned on) per plant. That turns into 3 bulbs, then 4 bulbs, then 6 bulbs, etc. per plant as they grow. So I never uselessly waste photons lighting up my soil or the tent floor - only the plants. The only time I have all the bulbs turned on is upon flip to flower, when I screw in the remaining 3000k bulbs.
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Im using a couple of SILS for my little seedlings and they seem to be liking it as well. Im torn between they efficiency of the diodes, or mystery diodes, and being able to shine directly at the seedlings with "no waste". Which are you better off doing? With all the hype of different diodes and grow lights, i think we forget that the LEDS in our household bulbs are pretty much the same damn thing, just cheaper. Not to mention, you buy a grow light and a couple months later the bastards are coming out with a completely new model putting your old one to shame..smh its like fucking apple products lol
 
Jenko

Jenko

Well-Known Member
SpideyManDan said:
Im using a couple of SILS for my little seedlings and they seem to be liking it as well. Im torn between they efficiency of the diodes, or mystery diodes, and being able to shine directly at the seedlings with "no waste". Which are you better off doing? With all the hype of different diodes and grow lights, i think we forget that the LEDS in our household bulbs are pretty much the same damn thing, just cheaper. Not to mention, you buy a grow light and a couple months later the bastards are coming out with a completely new model putting your old one to shame..smh its like fucking apple products lol
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What are SILS?
 
printer

printer

Well-Known Member
I went to Dollar Store's and picked up bulbs for around a buck a piece. Probably not as efficient as the good quality leds but already have the driver on board. I didn't want to buy all the lamp holders for them so I broke them and mounted them on aluminum rails. Mind you I have the tools to build with, the rails and soldering bits. I have seen people do the same on aluminum cookie sheets.
 
R

Relic79

Well-Known Member
SpideyManDan said:
Im using a couple of SILS for my little seedlings and they seem to be liking it as well. Im torn between they efficiency of the diodes, or mystery diodes, and being able to shine directly at the seedlings with "no waste". Which are you better off doing? With all the hype of different diodes and grow lights, i think we forget that the LEDS in our household bulbs are pretty much the same damn thing, just cheaper. Not to mention, you buy a grow light and a couple months later the bastards are coming out with a completely new model putting your old one to shame..smh its like fucking apple products lol
Click to expand...

It's like all technology. You buy bleeding edge, you pay for R&D, you buy slightly older and you get something not quite as advanced, but will work just fine for many years. Also, as a tech becomes common, the knockoffs and copies tend to get better over time as well.


It really seems like it is all efficiency related now, making sure all the photons are in the right spectrum, making sure all the electricity turns into light,. making sure all light isnspread evenly, etc.

At the end of the day, if you aren't trying to save the environment by saving electricity, and not throwing away bulbs, and if your electricity is cheap enough to not care, then they all work. Some you need more of, some less, but it all grows.

Also related to the OP, you mention wanting to experiment, keep in mind, as you scale up new problems will emerge. You will eventually likely be most limited by your cooling capacity (at least for me, that is the hardest to improve on)

For example your home AC and Furnace might handle a small grow fine, but add 10 plants and a couple more lights and you may struggle with humidity and temp, and the equient you need will be bigger and my more expensive.

Small scale experiments will get you used to working with the plant, but not managing environmental problems imho.
 
SpideyManDan

SpideyManDan

Well-Known Member
Relic79 said:
It's like all technology. You buy bleeding edge, you pay for R&D, you buy slightly older and you get something not quite as advanced, but will work just fine for many years. Also, as a tech becomes common, the knockoffs and copies tend to get better over time as well.


It really seems like it is all efficiency related now, making sure all the photons are in the right spectrum, making sure all the electricity turns into light,. making sure all light isnspread evenly, etc.

At the end of the day, if you aren't trying to save the environment by saving electricity, and not throwing away bulbs, and if your electricity is cheap enough to not care, then they all work. Some you need more of, some less, but it all grows.

Also related to the OP, you mention wanting to experiment, keep in mind, as you scale up new problems will emerge. You will eventually likely be most limited by your cooling capacity (at least for me, that is the hardest to improve on)

For example your home AC and Furnace might handle a small grow fine, but add 10 plants and a couple more lights and you may struggle with humidity and temp, and the equient you need will be bigger and my more expensive.

Small scale experiments will get you used to working with the plant, but not managing environmental problems imho.
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God damn. Well said.
 
SpideyManDan

SpideyManDan

Well-Known Member
printer said:
I went to Dollar Store's and picked up bulbs for around a buck a piece. Probably not as efficient as the good quality leds but already have the driver on board. I didn't want to buy all the lamp holders for them so I broke them and mounted them on aluminum rails. Mind you I have the tools to build with, the rails and soldering bits. I have seen people do the same on aluminum cookie sheets.
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The only thing i ask, is please be careful with the lights after you have taken the globes off. The globe is a function to help spread the light but its also a safety feature. The two soldering points or sometimes prongs can not only give you a shock but potentially worse in the wrong environment, especially really humid wet ones. I havent really seen anything happen yet, but i have to give a fair warning. I imagine most people here are fairly competent, but of course you get some others...
 
printer

printer

Well-Known Member
SpideyManDan said:
The only thing i ask, is please be careful with the lights after you have taken the globes off. The globe is a function to help spread the light but its also a safety feature. The two soldering points or sometimes prongs can not only give you a shock but potentially worse in the wrong environment, especially really humid wet ones. I havent really seen anything happen yet, but i have to give a fair warning. I imagine most people here are fairly competent, but of course you get some others...
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Yes, I did not want to get too in depth with the details. I used a dab of silicon to insulate the live wires sticking out of the board.

 
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Aapoo

Aapoo

Well-Known Member
gatewood said:
About $400. I want to make some micro-experimentation, to see what works best and get some experience, before making big expenditures

Some ppl in other forums suggested "the quantum boards and the new Samsung strip lights and or the QB 96 elite.
Because the QB's and Samsung LED strips are so efficient buying any other kind of LED lighting is going to be a waist of money because it doesn't compare to newest technology."

What I've read so far, is that photosynthesis only truly requires blue, red and UV spectrums, that you can dispense with green, yellow and infrared (and below):

www.sciencedaily.com

Giving plants the right amount of light

Enormous amounts of energy are wasted in greenhouses where our food is grown as a result of the plants receiving too much and the wrong kind of light. This can also stress and damage the plants. Researchers are working on a globally unique method to measure how much and what type of light plants...
www.sciencedaily.com

Is UV Light Good For Plants? | UV Lighting & Plants | DesignSpark

Learn about the uses of UV LED lighting in horticulture, the benefits and the applications. We will explore the many ways in which ultraviolet can benefit the horticultural market and explain how UV light can benefit wildlife and the growing process.
www.rs-online.com www.rs-online.com

I really rather only use LED lights (or fluorescent at the very least) to save on electricity.

Well... if we go for the same amount of wattage input, you could produce far more light with cheap LED lights.

And on that note (forgive my ignorance), what happens if you oversaturate an area with light?
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Your leaves curl and twist trying to protect themselves from the oversaturation
 
D

Dape Green

Well-Known Member
My first grow 25 yrs ago was under t-12s and it was good smoke. Start where ya can and work your way up. A grower with a great environment and proper watering technique with t5’s will out produce buddy who has blurples and shitty conditions.
 
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