Powdery Mildew

Norby Grown

Norby Grown

Well-Known Member
But it could be seeping down into the buds caverns and hardening there.
So why is no one hassling this guy and why is no one jumping down everyones throat who uses Neem, Greencure, capt jacks, etc.etc.?
So everyone else can make their own calls about what hey use but eagle 20 is the only spray that gets thrown under the bus even though there is NO approved spray for mite, pm, bud rot, thrips, fungus gnats, etc.
If capt jack himself came out and said their spray was not approved for use on MJ would everyone jump on that next? What if the companies that produce neem came out and said we haven't tested on MJ and neem shouldn't be smoked would you all jump on them next? Is it the petro chemical thing? Cause I would use 2mls of a product that's only 10% active ingredient, that's less than 1/2ml per gallon while neem oil is an oz per gallon. Lot more left behind with neem and it's an oil. Anyone test what that stuff does when smoked? Does that turn into hydrogen cyanide? Bet no one knows and would have to look it up even if you've used it in the past.

natureboygrower said:
personally,that is the chance i am willing to take.this bud is for me and me alone.im not worried about what baking soda does to my buds,there is moisture on my flowers every morning,like i said,more than likely diluting any baking soda residue.
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Norby Grown

Norby Grown

Well-Known Member
Now there is an approved list? I thought you used to be against these lists because nothing is actually approved for a smokeable product that they don't have data on. I guess if it fits your argument it's ok? What criteria did they use to make this list? Bet they picked them outta there ass!

chemphlegm said:
this is a useful database search concerning approved pesticides
http://cru66.cahe.wsu.edu/LabelTolerance.html

here are 3 states' approved lists

https://www.colorado. gov/pacific/agplants/pesticide-use-cannabis-production-information
http://www.oregon. gov/ODA/programs/Pesticides/Pages/CannabisPesticides.aspx
https://agr.wa. gov/pestfert/pesticides/pesticideuseonmarijuana.aspx
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Norby Grown

Norby Grown

Well-Known Member
chemphlegm

chemphlegm

Well-Known Member
Norby Grown said:
Now there is an approved list? I thought you used to be against these lists because nothing is actually approved for a smokeable product that they don't have data on. I guess if it fits your argument it's ok? What criteria did they use to make this list? Bet they picked them outta there ass!
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what? I dont decide if and when a state can produce a list. I'm not here to argue Norby. You didnt know there was lists, I informed you, brought you up to date is all. has nothing to do with my personal choices, your personal choices or the health of any user data criteria used. we're not here to discuss or argue using peppermint oil on cannabis. But if we were the first place I'd site for supposed safety would be big baccy they use it.
 
Odin*

Odin*

Well-Known Member
Norby Grown said:
... I've done the research and showing others there is a sure fire way to get rid of pm that's safe.
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"Safe", it seems, is subjective. In other posts you've mentioned the levels required to cause death, but sometimes "death" is not the worst that can result from exposure.



"In a two-generation study on rats over the effects of myclobutanil on reproduction, researchers found a decrease in pup weight gain, increased incidence of stillborns, and atrophy of the testes and prostate (#EPA). Myclobutanil is listed as a developmental toxin in the Toxics Release Inventory (#PANNA).

Chronic toxicity tests on rats found decreased body weight and changes to brain and spleen weight, in addition to reproductive effects (#EPA)."


Link



It also states that myclobutanil is environmentally mobile (found in surface water and rain). This means that it can leave the plant during transporation and that it is in the air you are breathing while watering the plants, don't forget about the dried particles that enter the air from the floor/walls/medium/plant surface/etc.




Just how much does it take to shrink your nuts/brain and cause erectile dysfunction (also attributed to pesticide use/exposure)? It wouldn't matter if the manufacturers answer to that was "1 US gallon", I don't want any amount of it near my person... for my dick's sake, I worry about grey matter as well (but to a much lesser extent than my man parts).




I know that you said that you haven't used it in a couple years, just keep this in mind if you ever go to reach for it (double entendre there).

I too have a "safe" method of eradicating PM, but my "safe" means that I can get it all over my person, drink it even, without any worries at all. I haven't seen PM since I stopped gathering genetics via "clone collecting", but if it ever pops up, I know exactly how to quickly resolve the issue.
 
Norby Grown

Norby Grown

Well-Known Member
natureboygrower said:
well for starters,if youre talking about me specifically,im not supplying anyone and calling it meds.
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No difference. My 5 patients all knew I sprayed it once over 2 years ago. I only have 5 patients I'm in Michigan. They know I'd spray a new set of clones. They wouldn't go elsewhere because mine is that good and disp bud is probably sprayed and there last caregivers sold them moldy stuff, sprayed preventatively, etc. and sold the good stuff to the dispensaries. My patients tell me everytime I see them how good I am and how much they appreciate what I do.
I've taken one patient from pissing herself in bed to clean MS diagnoses, she cleared 11 brain lesions under my care and dropped 15 Pharma meds including kolonopin. I have a colon cancer patient in remission. I have a teacher off vicodin and spending time with her kids again and another off pain meds for his knees.
But because I sprayed eagle 20 over 2 years ago and plan on doing it to 5 small clones when i start up this is the shit I get? Fuck off all of you and your bullshit guidelines on how to care for patients.
Have a nice day!
 
Norby Grown

Norby Grown

Well-Known Member
Good for you. Care to go into the math on how much active ingredient is used for 6 - 6 inch clones and how much they fed the rats in teh studies?

I've already said it is more harmful to the one spraying the plants then teh people smoking them.
Althoug i wouldn't do it I bet I could drink the amount used on 6 - 6 inch clones with no ill effects either considering it would only be a drop or 3 and they can be sprayed outside in a 10 gal tank as I have said before in this thread.

I mean really, if you are worried about what a few drops of anything sprayed on some clones 4 months before harvest you really do not want to know what;s in the air you breathe, teh food you eat or the water you drink. They spray this stuff on fields so if it respires into the air i'd hate to be near any crop ever sprayed with it since it can come out in clouds off the fields and it can go into your well quite easily from runoff. Just for some perspective.

Odin* said:
"Safe", it seems, is subjective. In other posts you've mentioned the levels required to cause death, but sometimes "death" is not the worst that can result from exposure.



"In a two-generation study on rats over the effects of myclobutanil on reproduction, researchers found a decrease in pup weight gain, increased incidence of stillborns, and atrophy of the testes and prostate (#EPA). Myclobutanil is listed as a developmental toxin in the Toxics Release Inventory (#PANNA).

Chronic toxicity tests on rats found decreased body weight and changes to brain and spleen weight, in addition to reproductive effects (#EPA)."


Link



It also states that myclobutanil is environmentally mobile (found in surface water and rain). This means that it can leave the plant during transporation and that it is in the air you are breathing while watering the plants, don't forget about the dried particles that enter the air from the floor/walls/medium/plant surface/etc.




Just how much does it take to shrink your nuts/brain and cause erectile dysfunction (also attributed to pesticide use/exposure)? It wouldn't matter if the manufacturers answer to that was "1 US gallon", I don't want any amount of it near my person... for my dick's sake, I worry about grey matter as well (but to a much lesser extent than my man parts).




I know that you said that you haven't used it in a couple years, just keep this in mind if you ever go to reach for it (double entendre there).

I too have a "safe" method of eradicating PM, but my "safe" means that I can get it all over my person, drink it even, without any worries at all. I haven't seen PM since I stopped gathering genetics via "clone collecting", but if it ever pops up, I know exactly how to quickly resolve the issue.
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Werp

Werp

Well-Known Member
Norby has decided a to open a seed bank based on his beliefs....His first line -The "Eagle 20 dankness line"

Includes such strains as:

Eagle 20 brain shrinker
Eagle 20 where have my balls gone
Eagle 20 Patient windfall lawsuit
Eagle 20 "I am God!" bud

Of course free gallon of eagle 20 with orders over $ 200
 
natureboygrower

natureboygrower

Well-Known Member
Norby Grown said:
No difference. My 5 patients all knew I sprayed it once over 2 years ago. I only have 5 patients I'm in Michigan. They know I'd spray a new set of clones. They wouldn't go elsewhere because mine is that good and disp bud is probably sprayed and there last caregivers sold them moldy stuff, sprayed preventatively, etc. and sold the good stuff to the dispensaries. My patients tell me everytime I see them how good I am and how much they appreciate what I do.
I've taken one patient from pissing herself in bed to clean MS diagnoses, she cleared 11 brain lesions under my care and dropped 15 Pharma meds including kolonopin. I have a colon cancer patient in remission. I have a teacher off vicodin and spending time with her kids again and another off pain meds for his knees.
But because I sprayed eagle 20 over 2 years ago and plan on doing it to 5 small clones when i start up this is the shit I get? Fuck off all of you and your bullshit guidelines on how to care for patients.
Have a nice day!
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i have no doubt you have helped people,i commend you on that,honestly.you should notice ive never jumped on you about your eagle20 use.im not that well informed on the subject,ignorance leaves me leery of using it.ive simply offered up and agreed with others about a more natural way(imo) to try to treat and prevent pm.:peace:
 
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chemphlegm

chemphlegm

Well-Known Member
Norby Grown said:
? Fuck off all of you and your bullshit guidelines on how to care for patients.
Have a nice day!
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hey everybody in this thread did not tell you to fuck off, maybe narrow that down bit, notice the love I'z sending?

like rick simpson, the cures may very well be related to the eagle 20 ppm's in the plant through its life,
even the small bits in the end, maybe nothing at all to do with the marijuana, maybe even the lack of molds in their
sick organs chronically, who knows. (watch medicine man)

Norby=wants to say using eagle 20 against every scientific and manufacturer recommendation
Chemphlegm= wants Norby to be safe, consider other options, and agree that using this chemical
is not to replace proper controls, safe gardening habits, healthier choices.
It is a choice of course, is easy, and does work.

this is straight forward common sense any way you wrap your head on it. just give it some thought, some meditation on the matter. maybe you find you cant grow without mold, and this works, and its safer than mold, that does not mean it is the safe thing to do at all
 
Budley Doright

Budley Doright

Well-Known Member
Norby Grown said:
umm, I knew that. It was an analogy.
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An analogy of what? Who says it as addictive as heroin? I thought you said you were leaving lol. Go ahead and use it I don't care and yes you are advocating its use, why else would you feel the need to post again and again that it is safe, and you haven't used it in two years, you know because it's safe and accepted by your patience lol. Anywhoo I'll never use it and I don't buy clones, I give em away to who ever wants them, and yup unsprayed. Ya once I passed around a few mites but it came from a partners clone room :(. That was 25 years ago, nothing since. Carry on I'm out ..... yes that means I won't be back, it's a stupid argument ;).
 
Norby Grown

Norby Grown

Well-Known Member
Missed this. It's not really complex at all. How are states doing it? They make dispensaries test to see if there is any trace amount of any pesticides and fungicides in the flowers, oil, medibles, etc. There were scientists involved. They took in the samples and put them thru a machine to check for any contaminants. They found none. That's just what they do for food, water and medicines to deem them safe, except they allow small amounts of these same pesticides in your air, water and food. That's how the system works to protect people. I went a step further and made sure there is NO detectable levels of what I used. I simply used that system and my MJ passed states laws. It would have been allowed to be sold in any state that has any laws against using any adulterants on the plants to be sold as medicine. It's not that hard to understand.

Werp said:
"The only reason anyone is still in this conversation is to do nothing but cast doubt on me or prove me wrong. no one actually wants to learn anything or discuss the reality of the situation so I'm out."

I don't anybody is trying to cast doubt or prove you wrong anymore than you are trying cast doubt on or prove them wrong as to why not to use it..

It's that it is something so complex that it takes several studies and the input from several phd level scientist. You neither have a PHD or are a scientist I gather..though you do have a fairly good command on the topic given the lack of either. So what you are left with is going over studies that are not necessarily specific to what the government guidelines would require to deem it safe for human comsumption (and has much as I hate government over reach, red tape and the general bureaucracy of it all) in some cases it really does protect the consumer. So it is something that entails an inherent risk of the "what if " factor that people simply aren't willing to risk given the fact that other means of producing the same product can be achieved without its use. I think it basically boils down to this that I would rather lose a crop to pm than risk the unknowns in a man made chemical with known toxicities. Marijuana (in most cases) is not a life saving drug and if the cure can produce worst possible effects than what its treating than you have a problem. Over and out
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Norby Grown

Norby Grown

Well-Known Member
You took this wrong. I knew tehre were lists. The lists came up when we were arguing this same topic on MMMA forum 2 years ago when I got the PM and crap I forgot his handle, the chemist, was arguing that he used it on clones. That's when I changed my mind. He posted up the MSDS and said how much was used per gallon and that it wasn't a carcinogen and that it was a translaminar, etc. A lot of the info that I wen and looked up and then decided to ask my patients and they made the choice for me.
I was saying"now there are lists" because back then you said there were no approved sprays for MJ because it was federally illegal and no one could do the testing. You rejected those state lists back then.
And all the problems tobacco causes and you would go to the list of approved sprays for tobacco for safety? Say that back to yourself and see how it sounds. And shit you might as well take Chinas recommendations considering how in the pocket of the chem companies our gov't is.

chemphlegm said:
what? I dont decide if and when a state can produce a list. I'm not here to argue Norby. You didnt know there was lists, I informed you, brought you up to date is all. has nothing to do with my personal choices, your personal choices or the health of any user data criteria used. we're not here to discuss or argue using peppermint oil on cannabis. But if we were the first place I'd site for supposed safety would be big baccy they use it.
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Odin*

Odin*

Well-Known Member
Norby Grown said:
And shit you might as well take Chinas recommendations considering how in the pocket of the chem companies our gov't is.
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This doesn't even make sense considering the "Chem Company" that makes E20 says not to use it on MJ. If the gov is in their pocket, why wouldn't it advocate tobacco/MJ application as that would greatly increase said "Chem Co's" profits.

China is the worst example to follow, even their baby food is "designed to kill". I used to think that China was "out to get us", but in reality they don't even give two shits about their own people, no, zero shits, as those shits could have been used as "filler" in some baby food.
 
Norby Grown

Norby Grown

Well-Known Member
An analogy of believing in the gov't. That you've heard from the gov't that you shouldn't use eagle 20 on MJ but the same gov't also says MJ is addictive as heroin and has no medical value The gov't says mj is addictive as heroin as it's in the same sched 1 category. This category is reserved for drugs with a high possibility of addiction and no medicinal value.
I know it's safe because I had tests done that showed no residual myclobutanil. I don't really care what you do and I'd appreciate the same courtesy from you especially on things that you don't know about. If you don't want to use it fine but trying to say it's unsafe after testing shows it CAN be is flat out lying. You are professing to know about something you know nothing about.
I wonder how many chains that set off with people spraying whole gardens to get rid of mites? Or how many bug bombs or no pest strips?
I'm trying to give a way that people could go without ever having to spray a full crop. I'm trying to reduce it's use by telling people they should be quarantining new clones and treating them. If you don't want to use the plant material you sprayed you can simply wait for new growth and clone that and throw away the original. BUt people still try to peer pressure people into not spraying. I'm glad tehre are ways like cracking seeds which would keep you from having to spray but you can't just force everyone into that box, not up to you to decide. I hate that people use these things too. But I'm not going to lie to them, I'm going to promote the cleanest way of growing using the least amount of non organic anything possible and the least amount of organic sprays. From what I've seen, this guy I got PM from tried everything organic under the sun. Until I see the same results from something organic(greencure doesn't "kill PM") I'm sticking with something I have found a safe way to use.
Budley Doright said:
An analogy of what? Who says it as addictive as heroin? I thought you said you were leaving lol. Go ahead and use it I don't care and yes you are advocating its use, why else would you feel the need to post again and again that it is safe, and you haven't used it in two years, you know because it's safe and accepted by your patience lol. Anywhoo I'll never use it and I don't buy clones, I give em away to who ever wants them, and yup unsprayed. Ya once I passed around a few mites but it came from a partners clone room :(. That was 25 years ago, nothing since. Carry on I'm out ..... yes that means I won't be back, it's a stupid argument ;).
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Norby Grown

Norby Grown

Well-Known Member
Have you seen the list of stuff eagle 20 is sprayed on? There is probably a cheaper PM alternative for tobacco here as it would cost too much to jump thru the hoops($$$$) to get approved here, gotta pay the gov't to peddle your death in this country. You are a smart guy, you should know they are saying that to not get sued, not because they tested it or know the trace hydrogen cyanide would even double what the MJ would produce naturally. They don't give a shit about us. The sarcasm was that you might as well go by China cause the studies you see are the ones the chem companies want you to see.

And just because the company says they don't plan on filing for MJ doesn't mean it isn't already happening. Can't believe a word from these guys, gotta do the research yourself.

A little hint, everything that's "approved" isn't good for you to smoke. some worse than others. The goal should be to make sure tehre is NO residual left. Which is what I did. You can all do it for yourself if you ever needed to, no need to take anyones word for it.
Odin* said:
This doesn't even make sense considering the "Chem Company" that makes E20 says not to use it on MJ. If the gov is in their pocket, why wouldn't it advocate tobacco/MJ application as that would greatly increase said "Chem Co's" profits.

China is the worst example to follow, even their baby food is "designed to kill". I used to think that China was "out to get us", but in reality they don't even give two shits about their own people, no, zero shits, as those shits could have been used as "filler" in some baby food.
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Tangerine_

Tangerine_

Well-Known Member
Hard to believe this is still going on. Not to mention the 10 pages of hijacking the OPs thread.

I'm starting to believe E20 causes Head Up Ass Syndrome. Nothing else could account for such rampant long lasting self-abnegation.
 
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