Public Health: Tips and information on how to prepare for the epidemic, avoid illness and protect our communities.

DIY-HP-LED · May 29, 2020

Fogdog said:
Talking abour woo-woo science if fun!!! It also demonstrates the effectiveness of right wing propaganda.

Behind the right's obsession with a miracle cure for coronavirus: It's not just about Trump
The conservative run on antimalarial drugs, sparked by Trump, is also about deep-rooted hostility to public health

Behind the right's crazed search for a COVID-19 miracle cure

The conservative run on antimalarial drugs, sparked by Trump, is also about deep-rooted hostility to public health

www.salon.com

So why are so many people so eager to get their hands on drugs that are clearly dangerous and may do no good?

The most immediate reason is simple: The people rushing the pharmacies are Republicans, and both Donald Trump and numerous Fox News personalities have told them these drugs are a "game-changer" that can save them from the coronavirus.

But there's a reason these false or unproven claims are resonating with the ordinary citizens of Trumpistan. The hope that there's a hard-to-get miracle cure that will save them speaks directly to the poisonous social Darwinism that guides modern conservatism. It reflects deep hostility to the very concept of a shared public good and a fierce attachment to a racialized ideology of individualism that treats public goods such as health care as things to be hoarded by those with the privilege, money and status to do so.

There's no question that Trump and other right-wing figures are pushing this hydroxychloroquine angle hard. Trump has talked about these drugs several times during his daily propaganda-dump "press briefings," as well as on Twitter.

There are many other examples, carefully collected here by Media Matters. This kind of repetition works, and goes a long way towards explaining how enthusiastically right-wing audiences have latched onto these drugs as a possible miracle cure.

But hydroxychloroquine mania also flows from the rigidly hierarchical view conservatives hold of society, one where even basic necessities like health care should be differentiated along class and race lines. Public health measures like quarantine and vaccine are viewed suspiciously precisely because they involve everyone on an approximately equal basis. They long for a special kind of medical care, one that's just for the people they see as better than everyone else.

This article is being posted for information purposes only. I'm not saying that by going ga-ga over the fake science about HCQ, DIY was deliberately allying with Republican blue-bloods who would encourage the masses to self-treat instead of demanding access to public health services.

I made a post that addresses these issues on another thread, a sort of a personal manifesto and consolidation of experiences and lessons learned thus far from the politicization of this matter and how I plan on resisting it and countering it here at least. I go into some detail and need not repeat it here. These are not normal times and normal things must be set aside in the greater interest, preprint articles included, at least from a public policy and medical perspective. Things like supplements are ok if covered responsibly as are any other activities people use to promote good health like diet and fitness. This is a pot site and pre print articles and other speculation on the health benefits of pot are rampant, most people here use it anyway! I stay well clear of that one and echinacea too ( a fav of @potroast

) but usually remain silent or say there is no proof etc! If you want to see fanatics, go to the Canadian medial section to see the true believers! I was lucky to get out of the place with my skin intact, fucking savages

The stakes are higher now though.

Fogdog · May 29, 2020

DIY-HP-LED said:
These are not normal times and normal things must be set aside in the greater interest,

These are not normal times, agreed. That doesn't mean we must take desperate measures. That would acting in panic, not reason. To set aside what's known to work and replace it with what is not known to work is abnormal thinking.

It's not times for desperate measures. It's time for reason. It's time for effective leadership and good management.

Just look at where we are with implementing a test for antibodies. The main problem is tests aren't accurate enough for most applications. Are desperate measures going to help that?

DIY-HP-LED · May 29, 2020

Fogdog said:
These are not normal times, agreed. That doesn't mean we must take desperate measures. That would acting in panic, not reason. To set aside what's known to work and replace it with what is not known to work is abnormal thinking.

It's not times for desperate measures. It's time for reason. It's time for effective leadership and good management.

Just look at where we are with implementing a test for antibodies. The main problem is tests aren't accurate enough for most applications. Are desperate measures going to help that?

Better tests will and the reason we know the serological tests are shit is because of these highly accurate tests, The problem here foggy is lives/time for the medical community at least. The researchers take a different approach and frown upon short cuts where the risks are great like testing. vaccines, and large scale treatments, things must be done right in these areas at least. A doctor often knows what will happen if they do nothing and will only do something if there is nothing to lose, medicine is an art as well as a science. Doctors are scientists too and there is whole ethical school of experts involved in this stuff as well. Things evolve and the word spreads in the medical grapevine in extraordinary times like these quickly, the FDA? had to make HCQ hospital only after Trump created supply issues and safety concerns. Many rapidly and poorly conducted studies were rushed through and put on pre print servers and only recently has it been confirmed that this drug is harmful to the kinds of patients they were giving it to at least, by a credible study involving large numbers of patients. I figure doctors will now even reconsider the people they give it to for malaria, they would before, even for those with a heart condition, this will make them think about it, but malaria is lethal too.

DIY-HP-LED · May 30, 2020

Here is an interesting idea that might prove useful for detection of outbreaks, I understand they were studying something like this in America. This stuff is gonna go on for awhile, so it might even be used in some places. It is NOT a substitute for testing though, but might supplement it. Water is important for sanitation too, in many places it is an issue and now a it's a crises.
From German National TV, english service.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What we can learn about coronavirus from analyzing sewage water | COVID-19 Special

Water is life. But there's evidence coronavirus could survive in it for days. What role does water play in the fight against the pandemic? It's not just drinking water we're talking about. Monitoring waste water is also important. Sewage water testing is can be key to staving off the virus and detecting a second wave. If the scientists' calculations are accurate, they can develop models to compare the measurements in different regions, even if the water is diluted by rain. In the end, 900 wastewater treatment plants in Germany can be analyzed, painting a picture of the coronavirus’s expansion.

Fogdog · May 30, 2020

DIY-HP-LED said:
Better tests will and the reason we know the serological tests are shit is because of these highly accurate tests, The problem here foggy is lives/time for the medical community at least. The researchers take a different approach and frown upon short cuts where the risks are great like testing. vaccines, and large scale treatments, things must be done right in these areas at least. A doctor often knows what will happen if they do nothing and will only do something if there is nothing to lose, medicine is an art as well as a science. Doctors are scientists too and there is whole ethical school of experts involved in this stuff as well. Things evolve and the word spreads in the medical grapevine in extraordinary times like these quickly, the FDA? had to make HCQ hospital only after Trump created supply issues and safety concerns. Many rapidly and poorly conducted studies were rushed through and put on pre print servers and only recently has it been confirmed that this drug is harmful to the kinds of patients they were giving it to at least, by a credible study involving large numbers of patients. I figure doctors will now even reconsider the people they give it to for malaria, they would before, even for those with a heart condition, this will make them think about it, but malaria is lethal too.

What you are saying is not too far different from what was said in this article that compared Seattle/Washington's with NYC/New York's response to early cases of coronavirus. Epidemiology is not a new science and they are a window into what has been found most effective to deal with plagues of the past.

Seattle’s Leaders Let Scientists Take the Lead. New York’s Did Not

The initial coronavirus outbreaks on the East and West Coasts emerged at roughly the same time. But the danger was communicated very differently.

www.newyorker.com

From the article:

Epidemiology is a science of possibilities and persuasion, not of certainties or hard proof. “Being approximately right most of the time is better than being precisely right occasionally,” the Scottish epidemiologist John Cowden wrote, in 2010. “You can only be sure when to act in retrospect.” Epidemiologists must persuade people to upend their lives—to forgo travel and socializing, to submit themselves to blood draws and immunization shots—even when there’s scant evidence that they’re directly at risk.

So, there is recognition that it's time to go as quickly as possible and the communication doesn't have to be universally correct. On the other hand, the message needs to be consistent, clear and trusted. There is a balance that is needed.

The above all mostly applies to tech that has already been invented. What is difficult is to be "approximately right most of the time" when working on what has yet to be invented. Such as vaccines, tests for antibodies that is accurate and fast enough for most applications or effective secondary treatment. I see your desire for taking risks and clearing bureaucratic hurdles as something that belongs in the realm of the known. In research, it's more a matter of making progress by completing tasks as quickly and accurately as reasonable but the completion of those activities and outcomes of many tasks is unpredictable. Researchers know about taking risks, long hours and hard choices because that's part and parcel of their job. For them, the idea that removing regulations or red tape will speed this up is not really going to help. It's better to let them cook behind closed doors and just give periodic progress updates.

captainmorgan · May 30, 2020

Magnetic Resonance Imaging Alteration of the Brain in a Patient With COVID-19 and Anosmia

This case report describes a 25-year-old female radiographer with no significant medical history who had been working in a coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) ward who presented with a mild dry cough that lasted for 1 day, followed by persistent severe anosmia and dysgeusia.

jamanetwork.com

DIY-HP-LED · May 30, 2020

Fogdog said:
What you are saying is not too far different from what was said in this article that compared Seattle/Washington's with NYC/New York's response to early cases of coronavirus. Epidemiology is not a new science and they are a window into what has been found most effective to deal with plagues of the past.

Seattle’s Leaders Let Scientists Take the Lead. New York’s Did Not

The initial coronavirus outbreaks on the East and West Coasts emerged at roughly the same time. But the danger was communicated very differently.

www.newyorker.com

From the article:

Epidemiology is a science of possibilities and persuasion, not of certainties or hard proof. “Being approximately right most of the time is better than being precisely right occasionally,” the Scottish epidemiologist John Cowden wrote, in 2010. “You can only be sure when to act in retrospect.” Epidemiologists must persuade people to upend their lives—to forgo travel and socializing, to submit themselves to blood draws and immunization shots—even when there’s scant evidence that they’re directly at risk.

So, there is recognition that it's time to go as quickly as possible and the communication doesn't have to be universally correct. On the other hand, the message needs to be consistent, clear and trusted. There is a balance that is needed.

The above all mostly applies to tech that has already been invented. What is difficult is to be "approximately right most of the time" when working on what has yet to be invented. Such as vaccines, tests for antibodies that is accurate and fast enough for most applications or effective secondary treatment. I see your desire for taking risks and clearing bureaucratic hurdles as something that belongs in the realm of the known. In research, it's more a matter of making progress by completing tasks as quickly and accurately as reasonable but the completion of those activities and outcomes of many tasks is unpredictable. Researchers know about taking risks, long hours and hard choices because that's part and parcel of their job. For them, the idea that removing regulations or red tape will speed this up is not really going to help. It's better to let them cook behind closed doors and just give periodic progress updates.

I agree on clear and consistent messaging and because of the failure of that I'm gonna work more on it's side as solid evidence emerges specific to this disease. If donald had done the right thing in the beginning or even after and invoked the defense production act they could have had a staff of 3,000 logistical planners working with experts on ventilators and PPE, the desperate solutions would not have even existed or the options considered. We were anticipating a disaster (prepare for the worst) that only partially materialised in some places, it's now more of a slow roll instead of a raging fire, except in red states. In such desperate situations where time equals lives, desperate officials, scientists and doctors make bad calls, hindsight is 20/20. We live and learn for when we no longer learn we might as well be dead, there is an example of such a zombie in the WH now!

Fogdog · May 30, 2020

DIY-HP-LED said:
I agree on clear and consistent messaging and because of the failure of that I'm gonna work more on it's side as solid evidence emerges specific to this disease. If donald had done the right thing in the beginning or even after and invoked the defense production act they could have had a staff of 3,000 logistical planners working with experts on ventilators and PPE, the desperate solutions would not have even existed or the options considered. We were anticipating a disaster (prepare for the worst) that only partially materialised in some places, it's now more of a slow roll instead of a raging fire, except in red states. In such desperate situations where time equals lives, desperate officials, scientists and doctors make bad calls, hindsight is 20/20. We live and learn for when we no longer learn we might as well be dead, there is an example of such a zombie in the WH now!

Trump did everything wrong on this effort, much like his entire term. It would have been worse if leaders in the most populous states had followed his lead.

DIY-HP-LED · May 30, 2020

captainmorgan said:
Magnetic Resonance Imaging Alteration of the Brain in a Patient With COVID-19 and Anosmia

This case report describes a 25-year-old female radiographer with no significant medical history who had been working in a coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) ward who presented with a mild dry cough that lasted for 1 day, followed by persistent severe anosmia and dysgeusia.

jamanetwork.com

It's becoming clear that this bug can be more than a respiratory illness and there are blood issues with clotting and the virus directly attacking organs in the body like the kidneys. The brain should be no different with increased stroke risk and attack by the virus, it depends on how many ACE2 receptors sites there are on the cells and apparently that can vary in number even in cells that have lots like in the lungs.

We are learning more all the time and these observations and others are added to the pile of knowledge along with how it affects some kids. Like in kids, these things appear to be rare and in most folks the disease follows the standard pattern of illness.

DIY-HP-LED · May 30, 2020

captainmorgan said:
Magnetic Resonance Imaging Alteration of the Brain in a Patient With COVID-19 and Anosmia

This case report describes a 25-year-old female radiographer with no significant medical history who had been working in a coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) ward who presented with a mild dry cough that lasted for 1 day, followed by persistent severe anosmia and dysgeusia.

jamanetwork.com

One more thing Captain, the regions of the brain that were infected (apparently) were associated with smell and a loss of sense of smell was reported by many, including people here, this could offer an explanation. Also the virus could have entered the brain along the olfactory nerves leading from the nose to the brain, a very short route on friendly specialised nerve fibers. What we think of as separate organs like the eyes or nose are really part of the brain/neural network and our sinus cavities go deeply into our skulls. Also Ace 2 receptors might be more plentiful here, since it's associated with the respiratory system, the lack of spread in the brain in general (encephalitis) seems to indicate this

The fact that people seemed to recover their sense of smell appears to be a good sign though, designing a study would be hard, to compare before and after changes, to see if there was any permanent impairment. Perhaps gourmets and foodies everywhere can give us some anecdotal evidence on this matter of taste, expert opinion as it were, plenty of those were infected and had the same thing happen.

Fogdog · May 30, 2020

Researchers warn covid-19 could cause debilitating long-term illness in some patients

At the National Institutes of Health and elsewhere, scientists who have been studying post-viral ME/CFS are seizing the opportunity to focus on covid-19 patients. They want to understand what biological factors separate those who regain their health from those who remain sick.
“We want to look at who recovers and who doesn’t,” said Avindra Nath, the head of clinical neurology at NIH’s Clinical Center in Bethesda, Md., who is gearing up to study covid-19 patients. “It’s quite possible some will never get their health back.”

In addition to emerging reports of damage to lungs, kidneys and hearts, covid-19 patients are complaining of ongoing crushing fatigue, muscle pain, cognitive problems and other symptoms that anyone with ME/CFS is very familiar with.
“I’m 69 days after my first symptoms and still feeling fatigued,” wrote Canadian comedian Wayne Jones on Twitter, saying he has tested positive for the new coronavirus. “I also have sore eyes, and weakness and headaches that come and go. All signs point to post-viral fatigue.”

A survey organized by a group of covid-19 patients called the Body Politic shows that many coronavirus symptoms overlap with those of post-viral fatigue syndrome. Fatigue, including severe fatigue, brain fog — problems with concentration and thinking — chills and sweats, and sleep problems were commonly reported among 640 respondents, who were recruited from online support groups. The Body Politic, which includes some patients with expertise in survey design and statistics, calculated that respondents had just a 20 percent chance of being symptom-free 50 days after the illness began. The group cautioned that while the survey suggests many respondents had long illnesses, the results may not apply to the broader population of covid-19 patients.

The patients themselves had to conduct follow up surveys to track what happens after a patient recovers. So, it's not a statistically valid study. It could have been, given the right resources from the start. Still, though, the idea that we just get sick and some die while the herd becomes immune and then gets on with life is bunk.

DIY-HP-LED · May 30, 2020

Fogdog said:
Researchers warn covid-19 could cause debilitating long-term illness in some patients

At the National Institutes of Health and elsewhere, scientists who have been studying post-viral ME/CFS are seizing the opportunity to focus on covid-19 patients. They want to understand what biological factors separate those who regain their health from those who remain sick.
“We want to look at who recovers and who doesn’t,” said Avindra Nath, the head of clinical neurology at NIH’s Clinical Center in Bethesda, Md., who is gearing up to study covid-19 patients. “It’s quite possible some will never get their health back.”

In addition to emerging reports of damage to lungs, kidneys and hearts, covid-19 patients are complaining of ongoing crushing fatigue, muscle pain, cognitive problems and other symptoms that anyone with ME/CFS is very familiar with.
“I’m 69 days after my first symptoms and still feeling fatigued,” wrote Canadian comedian Wayne Jones on Twitter, saying he has tested positive for the new coronavirus. “I also have sore eyes, and weakness and headaches that come and go. All signs point to post-viral fatigue.”

A survey organized by a group of covid-19 patients called the Body Politic shows that many coronavirus symptoms overlap with those of post-viral fatigue syndrome. Fatigue, including severe fatigue, brain fog — problems with concentration and thinking — chills and sweats, and sleep problems were commonly reported among 640 respondents, who were recruited from online support groups. The Body Politic, which includes some patients with expertise in survey design and statistics, calculated that respondents had just a 20 percent chance of being symptom-free 50 days after the illness began. The group cautioned that while the survey suggests many respondents had long illnesses, the results may not apply to the broader population of covid-19 patients.

The patients themselves had to conduct follow up surveys to track what happens after a patient recovers. So, it's not a statistically valid study. It could have been, given the right resources from the start. Still, though, the idea that we just get sick and some die while the herd becomes immune and then gets on with life is bunk.

Anything that impresses on people that they are gonna be asymptomatic or have an easy time is harmful, Many people in their 40, 50, and 60's get a real shit kicking from this bug, even if they recover fully and it takes awhile to recover, depending on how rough a ride. I do not want treatment options to give people this impression they will be home free,, they will be only for those who are having the roughest of rides, the one to the grave, the rest will suffer and many mighty and some will be screwed for life. Chris Cuomo's ordeal with covid seemed to age him and he still looks worn, he was a healthy man with a good lifestyle.

My interest in treatment options is to give hope to the old, vulnerable and frail many of whom are my peers, my message is consistent, avoid getting this bug for as long as you can and your odds of survival go up month by month from now on. Stay as safe as you can for as long as you can and perhaps a convalescent plasma treatment might save your life or spare you the worst, most drug treatments have logistical issues if they are proven effective. Convalescent plasma if it is proven to be effective is scalable enough, if we keep a lid on the infection rate, to be honest it appeals to me personally, as it is non profit, involves people helping each other for a double social benefit, and political or money interests are kept to a minimum. It can be quickly deployed with good serological testing and immunoassay ( being developed now) and can be used in any country with a blood bank system and that includes most. There are plenty of post infection people around and many are eager to help in any way they can and this would provide a means.

So far the signs of efficacy are good at all stages of illness and a good quality clinical trial that the experts like is all that's required, it will kick started immediately, many are anticipating this, we should know in a month or two, I'm surprised we haven't heard something, other than plenty of positive anecdotes. Plasma and blood transfusions are done everyday by the tens of thousands, so there are not nearly the ethical concerns surrounding this treatment as with others, though there are issues with it too.

Fogdog · May 30, 2020

DIY-HP-LED said:
Anything that impresses on people that they are gonna be asymptomatic or have an easy time is harmful, Many people in their 40, 50, and 60's get a real shit kicking from this bug, even if they recover fully and it takes awhile to recover, depending on how rough a ride. I do not want treatment options to give people this impression they will be home free,, they will be only for those who are having the roughest of rides, the one to the grave, the rest will suffer and many mighty and some will be screwed for life. Chris Cuomo's ordeal with covid seemed to age him and he still looks worn, he was a healthy man with a good lifestyle.

My interest in treatment options is to give hope to the old, vulnerable and frail many of whom are my peers, my message is consistent, avoid getting this bug for as long as you can and your odds of survival go up month by month from now on. Stay as safe as you can for as long as you can and perhaps a convalescent plasma treatment might save your life or spare you the worst, most drug treatments have logistical issues if they are proven effective. Convalescent plasma if it is proven to be effective is scalable enough, if we keep a lid on the infection rate, to be honest it appeals to me personally, as it is non profit, involves people helping each other for a double social benefit, and political or money interests are kept to a minimum. It can be quickly deployed with good serological testing and immunoassay ( being developed now) and can be used in any country with a blood bank system and that includes most. There are plenty of post infection people around and many are eager to help in any way they can and this would provide a means.

So far the signs of efficacy are good at all stages of illness and a good quality clinical trial that the experts like is all that's required, it will kick started immediately, many are anticipating this, we should know in a month or two, I'm surprised we haven't heard something, other than plenty of positive anecdotes. Plasma and blood transfusions are done everyday by the tens of thousands, so there are not nearly the ethical concerns surrounding this treatment as with others, though there are issues with it too.

I have interest in a miracle cure too. Depending on a miracle is not good strategy. I'd leave promoting that to Trump and his clergy.

The message I'd promote is we don't have a cure, we don't have secondary treatment and we don't have a system for containing it. This virus has a nasty affect on many people even after their immune system fights it off. People SHOULD continue to self isolate if they can. If they can't, then demand that work places follow safety guidelines and provide PPE. I know, it's not what's happening. Hence my justified pessimism. Given the virus's persisting, uncontrolled presence and rational fear of infection, the economy will NOT recover and more lives will be lost than should.

DIY-HP-LED · May 30, 2020

Fogdog said:
I have interest in a miracle cure too. Depending on a miracle is not good strategy. I'd leave promoting that to Trump and his clergy.

The message I'd promote is we don't have a cure, we don't have secondary treatment and we don't have a system for containing it. This virus has a nasty affect on many people even after their immune system fights it off. People SHOULD continue to self isolate if they can. If they can't, then demand that work places follow safety guidelines and provide PPE. I know, it's not what's happening. Hence my justified pessimism. Given the virus's persisting, uncontrolled presence and rational fear of infection, the economy will NOT recover and more lives will be lost than should.

Foggy you want the best for your country and are a patriot and are on the right track for sure. I think the red stes who reopened stupidly with inadequate testing and climbing infection rates will pay a price, this ain't rocket science at this point, most informed intelligent people know what is going to happen, most are still staying home. It will kill a lot of people in the south and heartland, but it will by and large kill the republican party for sometime, Donald is leading them into disaster. They are leaning on the hot stove, not just touching it, they won't be back for seconds anytime soon, but the damage to the GOP and Trump has been done, Nancy will make it as bad as possible for the fuckers in november.

If the GOP want to keep Trump until november, they had better be prepared to defend him and there is a lot to defend against. The pundits are saying that Donald wants to run as an asshole in november, seriously, he's his own campaign manager and this is his idea! Donald wants to win this time and needs to, last time he fucked up and won anyway, tells ya something.

Fogdog · May 30, 2020

DIY-HP-LED said:
Foggy you want the best for your country and are a patriot and are on the right track for sure. I think the red stes who reopened stupidly with inadequate testing and climbing infection rates will pay a price, this ain't rocket science at this point, most informed intelligent people know what is going to happen, most are still staying home. It will kill a lot of people in the south and heartland, but it will by and large kill the republican party for sometime, Donald is leading them into disaster. They are leaning on the hot stove, not just touching it, they won't be back for seconds anytime soon, but the damage to the GOP and Trump has been done, Nancy will make it as bad as possible for the fuckers in november.

If the GOP want to keep Trump until november, they had better be prepared to defend him and there is a lot to defend against. The pundits are saying that Donald wants to run as an asshole in november, seriously, he's his own campaign manager and this is his idea! Donald wants to win this time and needs to, last time he fucked up and won anyway, tells ya something.

It's not just red states that fail to meet safety guidelines. There is competition between states and when a neighbor "cheats" on the rules, other states are forced to follow suit or lose jobs.

Only three states have an adequate containment system.

We are in for a very bad year.

DIY-HP-LED · May 30, 2020

Fogdog said:
It's not just red states that fail to meet safety guidelines. There is competition between states and when a neighbor "cheats" on the rules, other states are forced to follow suit or lose jobs.

View attachment 4580913

Only three states have an adequate containment system.

We are in for a very bad year.

Yep I posted an article on that one, it's gonna be a real problem with hundreds of thousands looking for haircuts and a good time on weekends in less restrictive states. We can only hope they get burned bad enough to learn the lesson and repeats won't be required. Even in the worst hit states wise people still struggle of protect themselves, but with a high infection rate it gets much harder. This is where the problem of lack of leadership at the federal level is most acute a national plan and cooperation is required for success. We can only hope the lesson won't be too costly, more innocent than trumpers will probably die. I told a racist touting religious freedom for Trump that the white churches across the south would be full, the black ones would be empty. He didn't realise the implications of what he was selling and fell silent when it was explained to him.

Budley Doright · May 30, 2020

DIY-HP-LED said:
Yep I posted an article on that one, it's gonna be a real problem with hundreds of thousands looking for haircuts and a good time on weekends in less restrictive states. We can only hope they get burned bad enough to learn the lesson and repeats won't be required. Even in the worst hit states wise people still struggle of protect themselves, but with a high infection rate it gets much harder. This is where the problem of lack of leadership at the federal level is most acute a national plan and cooperation is required for success. We can only hope the lesson won't be too costly, more innocent than trumpers will probably die. I told a racist touting religious freedom for Trump that the white churches across the south would be full, the black ones would be empty. He didn't realise the implications of what he was selling and fell silent when it was explained to him.

Yup we find out this week if it’s gonna be a regional reopening ......... not sure how I feel about that

.

DIY-HP-LED · May 30, 2020

Budley Doright said:
Yup we find out this week if it’s gonna be a regional reopening ......... not sure how I feel about that .

Dougie has a plan at least and every time I see him he looks scared shitless, which is a good thing! I understand testing is ramping up and the bugs are being worked out, I hear contact tracing and case isolation are either underway or about to be implemented too. If they get enough of those spartan cube testing gizmos (Doug ordered a million alone) by fall we might have a chance for businesses and schools Budley. Alberta is giving out 4 masks per citizen at 900 drive thru's through out the province, ten million masks and I want to see more wearing them in public here, hang it around yer neck outside and slip it on when ya go inside or are near others is all I ask.

Also, people are standing like dummies inline in the corner stores, had to tell one to back off today just to get out the door, did it skilfully with a joke, knew the guy, we had a laugh but he backed up! Told him it was the new etiquette etc.

Budley Doright · May 30, 2020

DIY-HP-LED said:
Dougie has a plan at least and every time I see him he looks scared shitless, which is a good thing! I understand testing is ramping up and the bugs are being worked out, I hear contact tracing and case isolation are either underway or about to be implemented too. If they get enough of those spartan cube testing gizmos (Doug ordered a million alone) by fall we might have a chance for businesses and schools Budley. Alberta is giving out 4 masks per citizen at 900 drive thru's through out the province, ten million masks and I want to see more wearing them in public here, hang it around yer neck outside and slip it on when ya go inside or are near others is all I ask.

Also, people are standing like dummies inline in the corner stores, had to tell one to back off today just to get out the door, did it skilfully with a joke, knew the guy, we had a laugh but he backed up! Told him it was the new etiquette etc.

A plan? Nope not really when it comes to regional opening. Lots of logistical issues. Lots of people west of here would love to drive down and stay a bit if everything is open......yay. Already alerts to report boats that are coming across the river to shop. Glad I’m not in the river crossing buisness any more, it’s like a lynch mob out there lol.

DIY-HP-LED · May 30, 2020

Budley Doright said:
A plan? Nope not really when it comes to regional opening. Lots of logistical issues. Lots of people west of here would love to drive down and stay a bit if everything is open......yay. Already alerts to report boats that are coming across the river to shop. Glad I’m not in the river crossing buisness any more, it’s like a lynch mob out there lol.

That is an issue with a regional approach with in a province, same problem as with adjacent states, it reeks of a too quick a reopening and not enough preparation. No wonder Dougie looked scared, I only caught part of the story on the radio going thru for a Tim's. Masks will cut the spread in half, probably more though and we know many of the danger spots, in closed spaces for extended periods etc. Summer is coming and as much business as possible should be done in front of the store outside under canvas to give us some summer breathing room for better preparation.

Here restrictions are being lifted the weather is nice and the rates are going down, I think in june we will be more open. One thing I did notice though, all the regular older employees at the grocery store (Atlantic Super Store) have been furloughed and young college students have taken their place. I noticed the shelves are almost empty of vitamin D now too, so someone is getting wise, or just reading the news, summer is here now though and sunshine is free.

I think we're gonna do ok Budley, everybody is gonna get a real economic kick in the nuts though, hard times are coming for many.

Public Health: Tips and information on how to prepare for the epidemic, avoid illness and protect our communities.

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member