Real Organics

MistaRasta

MistaRasta

Well-Known Member
Grandpa GreenJeans said:
When I make soil I consider the CEC of the ingredients. How do they hold and release elements based on plant needs. How do they react with certain elements. Water retention and air is another thing to seriously think about. And finally their natural pH and abilities to buffer pH.

My mix goes like this.
Coco coir (pith, fiber, chips)
Canadian peat
Course #3 perlite (washed first to remove dust. Dust and tiny particles can cause blockages and prevent drainage)
Par boiled rice hulls
Hydroton (LECA)
Mushroom compost
Leaf mold
Rock dust
High P guano
Alfalfa meal
Kelp meal
Brewer's yeast
Endo/Ecto +Tricoderma
Powdered lime

I'll mix it all up and let sit. This is going to get watered with some tea. Let the buffet begin.

I'm going to give my tea recipe, not all have these ingredient but it can be tweeked. Any AACT is better than water or no tea at all, so you really can't fail.

I start with 5 gallons of RODI (reverse osmosis, de ionized water)
I make my own fertilizer and I have a veg formula and a bloom formula. Veg is 1 whole fish and 4 gallons of Lake weeks pureed and fermented with lacto bacillus.
The bloom is bat guano, bananas, molasses, oats and grapes.
Just like earth juice, just a different initial blend of ingredients.
Any and all water, or food that hit my soil get brewed in the vortex first. Then after pH stabilizes and nutrients are available it's applied. Always! Even plain water days need a boost of 02 in the mix.

Grandpa's Tea:
5ml/gallon Ferment Veg
5ml/gallon Ferment Bloom
Humic Acid 10ml/gallon
Fulvic Acid 10ml/gallon
Liquid silica 1.25ml/gallon
Epsom Salt 1 tsp/gallon
Earth juice CATYLIST 9ml/gallon
Calimagic. 5ml/gallon
Age old kelp 5ml/gallon
Aquashield 6ml/gallon
Microbe life photosynthesis plus. 12ml/gallon
Ancient forest 250ml/5 gallon.

Brew for 48 hours-
**pictures taken while starting the brew**
pH 4.6
Temp 67F
PPM 750
Click to expand...

"Real Organics"

I love this term as it can be used in the funniest of ways ;)

My results are definitely similar to yours but I only use a few of the ingredients you use. why not simplify?
 
Grandpa GreenJeans

Grandpa GreenJeans

Well-Known Member
MistaRasta said:
"Real Organics"

I love this term as it can be used in the funniest of ways ;)

My results are definitely similar to yours but I only use a few of the ingredients you use. why not simplify?
Click to expand...
The threads name Real Organics is intended to dis credit all the bro science i have seen. Not to dis credit any of the factual threads on organics, I just thought I'd give a go and share my experience and methods.
Kiss is always a great thing, but I was a newbie at one time, I needed answers for my questions, I wanted to understand plants, microbes and the environment completly. I guess it's what prompted me to seek an education in horticulture. It's now what I do for a living and is more than most will in this area. Again I'm sorry if it has offended some viewers.
 
MistaRasta

MistaRasta

Well-Known Member
Grandpa GreenJeans said:
The threads name Real Organics is intended to dis credit all the bro science i have seen. Not to dis credit any of the factual threads on organics, I just thought I'd give a go and share my experience and methods.
Kiss is always a great thing, but I was a newbie at one time, I needed answers for my questions, I wanted to understand plants, microbes and the environment completly. I guess it's what prompted me to seek an education in horticulture. It's now what I do for a living and is more than most will in this area. Again I'm sorry if it has offended some viewers.
Click to expand...

to each his own. Whatever works for ya bud, that's all that matters at the end of the day.

If any viewers are offended by this they need to go put on their big boy pants and grow up.
 
greasemonkeymann

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
Grandpa GreenJeans said:
The threads name Real Organics is intended to dis credit all the bro science i have seen. Not to dis credit any of the factual threads on organics, I just thought I'd give a go and share my experience and methods.
Kiss is always a great thing, but I was a newbie at one time, I needed answers for my questions, I wanted to understand plants, microbes and the environment completly. I guess it's what prompted me to seek an education in horticulture. It's now what I do for a living and is more than most will in this area. Again I'm sorry if it has offended some viewers.
Click to expand...
Mr GreenJeans,
welcome and glad to have you here, you seem to have a pleasant demeanor which is a good thing.
I'd like to offer you my opinions on some things, if you are interested, if not, just ignore this post.
Your recipe.

My mix goes like this.
Coco coir (pith, fiber, chips)
Canadian peat
Course #3 perlite (washed first to remove dust. Dust and tiny particles can cause blockages and prevent drainage)
Par boiled rice hulls
Hydroton (LECA)
Mushroom compost
Leaf mold
Rock dust
High P guano
Alfalfa meal
Kelp meal
Brewer's yeast
Endo/Ecto +Tricoderma
Powdered lime

Some things i'd change if it were me, and of course this doesn't mean you are doing anything incorrect, just things that I wished were explained to me decades ago.
First, you mentioned caution exchange capacity, peat is the best for that, many of us growers have experienced issues with using a coco based mix, and by issues I mean smaller harvests. NO other issues were noticed, but about a 15% drop in yields. The best thing on the planet (so it would seem) is a leafmold compost, that stuff is like gold.
I like to mix aeration, with volcanic rock, rotted tree log chunks, and pumice being my favorites.
I like t use different ph controlling additives, like crab, shrimp meal, biochar, and oyster flour, reason being is they contribute much more than simple d-lime, and not to mention it's easier controlled.
I don't like guanos... too water soluble, and by the time you need it, it's long gone.
I really like long-term nutrients, or slow release nutrients. Fishbonemeal, feather meal (if you can source safe ones), doghair, human hair, comfrey, grass clippings, neem meal, crab meal.. those are examples.
For minerals, I like the same, rock phosphates, azomite, granite dust, gypsum, oyster flour, langbeinite, etc.
SLOW release is where the magic happens.
I don add anything to inoculate my mix, the compost and wormbin do that for me.
You have a good mix, and i'm positive you can grow great herb with it, I just have tweaked my recipe a bit as the yrs go by, and this is what works the best for me and my style of growing.
 
greasemonkeymann

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
VTMi'kmaq said:
Where has anyone shown offense?

your methods are your methods, who gives a fuck what someone else thinks gndpa greenjeans imvho i let it fly if it don't apply but when folks (like you) throw out a bunch of good knowledge and we get hydro cluts claiming this or that is superior to organics and such i have gotten heated in the past because it's bullshit trying to disuade someone who has taken time in there life to become educated, whether tat be via first hand tutiledge or book, I agree with your orig post some stuff here is good lots of it is shit and it pisses me off because exactly as you stated, newb with the willingness to love and chesrish this plant get led astray imho by these certain threads of bullshit info. I was glad you'd started this thread honeslty
Click to expand...
did I miss something?
Do I have ignored people replying to this thread? i'm confused...
 
G

GrowUrOwnDank

Well-Known Member
greasemonkeymann said:
Mr GreenJeans,
welcome and glad to have you here, you seem to have a pleasant demeanor which is a good thing.
I'd like to offer you my opinions on some things, if you are interested, if not, just ignore this post.
Your recipe.

My mix goes like this.
Coco coir (pith, fiber, chips)
Canadian peat
Course #3 perlite (washed first to remove dust. Dust and tiny particles can cause blockages and prevent drainage)
Par boiled rice hulls
Hydroton (LECA)
Mushroom compost
Leaf mold
Rock dust
High P guano
Alfalfa meal
Kelp meal
Brewer's yeast
Endo/Ecto +Tricoderma
Powdered lime

Some things i'd change if it were me, and of course this doesn't mean you are doing anything incorrect, just things that I wished were explained to me decades ago.
First, you mentioned caution exchange capacity, peat is the best for that, many of us growers have experienced issues with using a coco based mix, and by issues I mean smaller harvests. NO other issues were noticed, but about a 15% drop in yields. The best thing on the planet (so it would seem) is a leafmold compost, that stuff is like gold.
I like to mix aeration, with volcanic rock, rotted tree log chunks, and pumice being my favorites.
I like t use different ph controlling additives, like crab, shrimp meal, biochar, and oyster flour, reason being is they contribute much more than simple d-lime, and not to mention it's easier controlled.
I don't like guanos... too water soluble, and by the time you need it, it's long gone.
I really like long-term nutrients, or slow release nutrients. Fishbonemeal, feather meal (if you can source safe ones), doghair, human hair, comfrey, grass clippings, neem meal, crab meal.. those are examples.
For minerals, I like the same, rock phosphates, azomite, granite dust, gypsum, oyster flour, langbeinite, etc.
SLOW release is where the magic happens.
I don add anything to inoculate my mix, the compost and wormbin do that for me.
You have a good mix, and i'm positive you can grow great herb with it, I just have tweaked my recipe a bit as the yrs go by, and this is what works the best for me and my style of growing.
Click to expand...
Way too complicated bro. Cliff notes are probably still too complicated. Love your passion.
 
Grandpa GreenJeans

Grandpa GreenJeans

Well-Known Member
greasemonkeymann said:
Mr GreenJeans,
welcome and glad to have you here, you seem to have a pleasant demeanor which is a good thing.
I'd like to offer you my opinions on some things, if you are interested, if not, just ignore this post.
Your recipe.

My mix goes like this.
Coco coir (pith, fiber, chips)
Canadian peat
Course #3 perlite (washed first to remove dust. Dust and tiny particles can cause blockages and prevent drainage)
Par boiled rice hulls
Hydroton (LECA)
Mushroom compost
Leaf mold
Rock dust
High P guano
Alfalfa meal
Kelp meal
Brewer's yeast
Endo/Ecto +Tricoderma
Powdered lime

Some things i'd change if it were me, and of course this doesn't mean you are doing anything incorrect, just things that I wished were explained to me decades ago.
First, you mentioned caution exchange capacity, peat is the best for that, many of us growers have experienced issues with using a coco based mix, and by issues I mean smaller harvests. NO other issues were noticed, but about a 15% drop in yields. The best thing on the planet (so it would seem) is a leafmold compost, that stuff is like gold.
I like to mix aeration, with volcanic rock, rotted tree log chunks, and pumice being my favorites.
I like t use different ph controlling additives, like crab, shrimp meal, biochar, and oyster flour, reason being is they contribute much more than simple d-lime, and not to mention it's easier controlled.
I don't like guanos... too water soluble, and by the time you need it, it's long gone.
I really like long-term nutrients, or slow release nutrients. Fishbonemeal, feather meal (if you can source safe ones), doghair, human hair, comfrey, grass clippings, neem meal, crab meal.. those are examples.
For minerals, I like the same, rock phosphates, azomite, granite dust, gypsum, oyster flour, langbeinite, etc.
SLOW release is where the magic happens.
I don add anything to inoculate my mix, the compost and wormbin do that for me.
You have a good mix, and i'm positive you can grow great herb with it, I just have tweaked my recipe a bit as the yrs go by, and this is what works the best for me and my style of growing.
Click to expand...
You are a wise man. I completely agree with you. If I were to build a soil from bare bones I'd have have everything you stated and the ect's. Lol. You are right about long term elements being most reliable for plant nutrition. And any shell fish are very important not only for the buffering and calcium but shrimp and crab are comprised of chitin and this stimulates soil organisms to excrete enzymes called chitenase. This is the preferred diet of tricoderma fungi. Once the plant roots come into contact with the fungi, it stimulates the plant and initiates the SAR effect. Systemic Aquire Resistance is the full term, it basically means that the plant has heightened resistance or immunities to disease, bugs, wounds/stress, temps. Very benificial.
And thank you for the welcome sir.
 
Grandpa GreenJeans

Grandpa GreenJeans

Well-Known Member
So after I hydrated the soil with the tea, I cover it with plastic sheeting and tuck in the corner folds. Room is steady at 67F.
I'll leave this for 1 week and then uncover it.20151019_135002.jpg
 
greasemonkeymann

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
Grandpa GreenJeans said:
You are a wise man. I completely agree with you. If I were to build a soil from bare bones I'd have have everything you stated and the ect's. Lol. You are right about long term elements being most reliable for plant nutrition. And any shell fish are very important not only for the buffering and calcium but shrimp and crab are comprised of chitin and this stimulates soil organisms to excrete enzymes called chitenase. This is the preferred diet of tricoderma fungi. Once the plant roots come into contact with the fungi, it stimulates the plant and initiates the SAR effect. Systemic Aquire Resistance is the full term, it basically means that the plant has heightened resistance or immunities to disease, bugs, wounds/stress, temps. Very benificial.
And thank you for the welcome sir.
Click to expand...
may want to check out this thread, if chitin is something you are interested in, it's my (not-so) secret weapon
ahh here we are.
https://www.rollitup.org/t/interesting-find-for-insect-frass-users.851214/
annnnd the actual content for you nerdier types (myself included)
http://www.moonvalleyreptiles.com/crested-geckos/diet-nutrition/feeder-insects
 
Grandpa GreenJeans

Grandpa GreenJeans

Well-Known Member
greasemonkeymann said:
may want to check out this thread, if chitin is something you are interested in, it's my (not-so) secret weapon
ahh here we are.
https://www.rollitup.org/t/interesting-find-for-insect-frass-users.851214/
annnnd the actual content for you nerdier types (myself included)
http://www.moonvalleyreptiles.com/crested-geckos/diet-nutrition/feeder-insects
Click to expand...
Holly shit that insect frass is an excellent thread. I'm bookmarking, watching it. And I'm following you from now on. You are a true asset to this forum. I love your passion btw.
 
Richard Drysift

Richard Drysift

Well-Known Member
Grandpa GreenJeans said:
Quick update on the grandpa's tea feeding. Peppers seem to like it and the veggie seedlings, autos and photos too.
View attachment 3525591
Click to expand...
I love the idea of using what you have on hand to make/compost food for your plants and/or soil microbes...gonna have a lot of pumpkin guts after our carving party this weekend - now I have a use for it. I used to toss out all this stuff thinking it was trash but now I throw any organic waste in my worm bin which is a win win for everyone: plants, worms, and humans lol thanks for sharing your methods; truly inspiring
 
Grandpa GreenJeans

Grandpa GreenJeans

Well-Known Member
Richard Drysift said:
I love the idea of using what you have on hand to make/compost food for your plants and/or soil microbes...gonna have a lot of pumpkin guts after our carving party this weekend - now I have a use for it. I used to toss out all this stuff thinking it was trash but now I throw any organic waste in my worm bin which is a win win for everyone: plants, worms, and humans lol thanks for sharing your methods; truly inspiring
Click to expand...
Ferment it bro, it will be pre chewed and the worms will go nuts for it. Keep the liquid that separates from the pulp and add 1 tbsp/gallon of water.
 
Grandpa GreenJeans

Grandpa GreenJeans

Well-Known Member
This little bastard had the audacity to hang out on top of 1 of my auto seedlings. I'm not very happy to see this but it's expected due to the organic soil. Now I'm going to have to go beast mode.
20151021_090634.jpg 20151021_090644.jpg
 
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