Recycled Organic Living Soil (ROLS) and No Till Thread

SouthernSoil*

Well-Known Member
Just wanted to share my soil recipe thats worked wonders for me so far...Credit to ShLUbY for his advice on the ratios.

Base:

1/3 perlite
1/3 coco coir
1/6 local compost
1/6 Wiggle Worm Castings

Nutrients per cubic foot of base
1/2 cup: Espoma Alfalfa Meal, Espoma Bone Meal, Espoma Greensand, Micronized Azomite, Espoma Bio-Tone, Espoma Garden Gypsum

3/4 cup: Neptunes Harvest Kelp Meal

1/4 cup: Espoma Blood Meal, Espoma Garden Lime

Microbes

Mykos, applied directly to the rootball during transplant
Oregonism XL, two tablespoons per cubic foot of soil.

Thanks for sharing your mix man !

I've been on the lookout for what sort of nutrients/amendments i should be adding.

My base mix is 1/3 pumice, 1/3 peat, 1/3 earth worm castings & hoping something similar can work, i cannot however find greensand locally at all & i would have to make my own bio-tone from the ingredients listed on its packaging ( Feather Manure, Poultry Manure, Bone Meal, Alfalfa Meal, Greensand, Sulfate of Potash, Sulfate of Potash Magnesia, 936 Colony Forming Units.

I cannot find oregonism xl but there is a local company here which can supply local myco products.They have a liquid form and powdered form.

"Mycoroot products have been developed using southern African isolates of AM fungi. These are naturally occurring soil microorganisms, which have not been genetically altered in any way. The product is 100% mycorrhizal with no other additives or chemicals making it environmentally friendly and suitable for organic plant production."

Any help will be pretty cool ! Thanks
 

kratos015

Well-Known Member
My last batch of no-till lasted me a good 3 years until I had to start over. My veggies are loving the old no-till soil pots, but I had to make a new batch because the weed wasn't liking how compacted the soil was becoming.

I've since started taking it a little easy on the compost when I make new batches of soil. I've been putting more peat and perlite into my mix than compost, something like 12cuft peat/12cuft perlite/8cuft compost. My reasoning is that eventually the peat and amendments will become compost over time, so if I used even 1:1:1 ratios then eventually I have more compost in the mix than I do peat and perlite so I inevitably suffer from soil compaction. Been working pretty awesome for me so far.
 

CanadianDank

Well-Known Member
Thanks for sharing your mix man !

I've been on the lookout for what sort of nutrients/amendments i should be adding.

My base mix is 1/3 pumice, 1/3 peat, 1/3 earth worm castings & hoping something similar can work, i cannot however find greensand locally at all & i would have to make my own bio-tone from the ingredients listed on its packaging ( Feather Manure, Poultry Manure, Bone Meal, Alfalfa Meal, Greensand, Sulfate of Potash, Sulfate of Potash Magnesia, 936 Colony Forming Units.

I cannot find oregonism xl but there is a local company here which can supply local myco products.They have a liquid form and powdered form.

"Mycoroot products have been developed using southern African isolates of AM fungi. These are naturally occurring soil microorganisms, which have not been genetically altered in any way. The product is 100% mycorrhizal with no other additives or chemicals making it environmentally friendly and suitable for organic plant production."

Any help will be pretty cool ! Thanks
Man you don't need to follow an exact recipe, you can tweak it according to what's available in your area for sure.
Why don't you post what you have so far and we can maybe offer some suggestions on what to add to help complete it.
 

SouthernSoil*

Well-Known Member
Man you don't need to follow an exact recipe, you can tweak it according to what's available in your area for sure.
Why don't you post what you have so far and we can maybe offer some suggestions on what to add to help complete it.
Thanks for the reply man, id be stoked if you can help me mix something.

At the moment i can source ( Alfalfa Meal, Bone Meal, Micronized Azomite, Gypsum, Kelp, Blood meal, Garden Lime & Mycos from Link )

I can also get hold of ( Basalt Rock Dust , Biochar, Calcitic Lime, Crushed oyster shells , Dolomite lime, Fulvic acid powder, humic acid granular, insect frass, soft rock phosphate, Zeolite, Volcanic rock dust, Efficient Microbes EM-Pro Link , organic fertilizer blends Link , Link )

I have also made my own Lacto Bacillus recently which i can use in the mix.
 

kratos015

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the reply man, id be stoked if you can help me mix something.

At the moment i can source ( Alfalfa Meal, Bone Meal, Micronized Azomite, Gypsum, Kelp, Blood meal, Garden Lime & Mycos from Link )

I can also get hold of ( Basalt Rock Dust , Biochar, Calcitic Lime, Crushed oyster shells , Dolomite lime, Fulvic acid powder, humic acid granular, insect frass, soft rock phosphate, Zeolite, Volcanic rock dust, Efficient Microbes EM-Pro Link , organic fertilizer blends Link , Link )

I have also made my own Lacto Bacillus recently which i can use in the mix.
How much soil are you trying to make? Just remember, less is more. Crab, Neem, and Kelp meal could almost be considered a holy trinity for making your own soil. Those 3 ingredients + a mineral amendment of some kind are really all you need, aside from Lime of course. Makes things simple and affordable. I see you can source Basalt and Volcanic Rock Dust, I'd grab both and do a 3:1 ratio of Basalt:Rock Dust. If you can't/don't want to get the Crab and Neem Meals, the Alfalfa and Blood meals can be substituted for the Neem Meal and the Bone Meal can replace the Crab Meal. Just need to be cautious because those ingredients can burn, where as Crab/Neem will not.

There are no "strict" requirements, it's really just about whatever is local, cheap, and/or convenient. I live out in the middle of nowhere, so Amazon is my only source. I've been omitting the Crab Meal in favor of the frass for a source of Chitin. My well water is incredibly hard, calcifies the crap out of everything. So I had to eliminate the Crab Meal, Oyster Shell Flour, and Gypsum because my water is effectively my liming agent and my water plus all of those amendments with Calcium in them was causing me problems.

You may not be able to get Neem Meal locally, but it's incredible stuff for a wide variety of reasons. IPM and great NPK, always worth the money. Neem also doesn't run the risk of burn like the Alfalfa and Blood Meals do. I just spent $18 on a 5lb bag on Amazon that was enough to amend ~1.5 cu.yd. of soil, or a little over 300g. The last few runs I've also been getting pre-blended mixes from either Dr Earth or Down to Earth because they're made with a variety of amendments instead of me having to buy them all separately.

My latest batch of outdoor soil was made with what was available to me. Amended the soil with Down to Earth's Citrus Mix, Neem, Kelp and Azomite for veg. In another 3 months I'll start top dressing with Guano and Dr Earth's Life mix.

As long as your soil has good compost, proper aeration/drainage, and a steady supply of organic fertilizer then you're ready to rock and roll.
 

SouthernSoil*

Well-Known Member
How much soil are you trying to make? Just remember, less is more. Crab, Neem, and Kelp meal could almost be considered a holy trinity for making your own soil. Those 3 ingredients + a mineral amendment of some kind are really all you need, aside from Lime of course. Makes things simple and affordable. I see you can source Basalt and Volcanic Rock Dust, I'd grab both and do a 3:1 ratio of Basalt:Rock Dust. If you can't/don't want to get the Crab and Neem Meals, the Alfalfa and Blood meals can be substituted for the Neem Meal and the Bone Meal can replace the Crab Meal. Just need to be cautious because those ingredients can burn, where as Crab/Neem will not.

There are no "strict" requirements, it's really just about whatever is local, cheap, and/or convenient. I live out in the middle of nowhere, so Amazon is my only source. I've been omitting the Crab Meal in favor of the frass for a source of Chitin. My well water is incredibly hard, calcifies the crap out of everything. So I had to eliminate the Crab Meal, Oyster Shell Flour, and Gypsum because my water is effectively my liming agent and my water plus all of those amendments with Calcium in them was causing me problems.

You may not be able to get Neem Meal locally, but it's incredible stuff for a wide variety of reasons. IPM and great NPK, always worth the money. Neem also doesn't run the risk of burn like the Alfalfa and Blood Meals do. I just spent $18 on a 5lb bag on Amazon that was enough to amend ~1.5 cu.yd. of soil, or a little over 300g. The last few runs I've also been getting pre-blended mixes from either Dr Earth or Down to Earth because they're made with a variety of amendments instead of me having to buy them all separately.

My latest batch of outdoor soil was made with what was available to me. Amended the soil with Down to Earth's Citrus Mix, Neem, Kelp and Azomite for veg. In another 3 months I'll start top dressing with Guano and Dr Earth's Life mix.

As long as your soil has good compost, proper aeration/drainage, and a steady supply of organic fertilizer then you're ready to rock and roll.
Appreciate the reply Kratos,

Im currently mixing about 20 gallons of base. It seems crab meal is pretty rare over here aswell but as you said bone meal should work too i just have to be pretty gentle with the servings. The only neem i have access is to is neem leaf powder, i take it you were talking about neem seed meal ? Will definitely grab some of the basalt think i still might have some volcanic rock powder left over.

I take it i wont have a problem with these amendments using reverse osmosis water ?

Wish i had local access to neem meal but looks like i will have to import it aswell. I have also heard many good things about it.

Thanks man.
 

hillbill

Well-Known Member
Alfalfa meal is a base of many organic fertilizers as is bone meal and they can cover a lot of your N and P and micros. Available most places and a blenderturns pellets to meal again if needed.
 

kratos015

Well-Known Member
Appreciate the reply Kratos,

Im currently mixing about 20 gallons of base. It seems crab meal is pretty rare over here aswell but as you said bone meal should work too i just have to be pretty gentle with the servings. The only neem i have access is to is neem leaf powder, i take it you were talking about neem seed meal ? Will definitely grab some of the basalt think i still might have some volcanic rock powder left over.

I take it i wont have a problem with these amendments using reverse osmosis water ?

Wish i had local access to neem meal but looks like i will have to import it aswell. I have also heard many good things about it.

Thanks man.
Yeah, Crab/Crustacean Meal is something I've always had to source from Amazon personally. Bone Meal will totally work, but unless you're getting a killer deal on it I'd recommend sourcing the Crab Meal from the internet if it is within your budget. 3-16-0 is a ton of Phosphorus and your microbes will appreciate a lighter source of Phosphorus such as the Crab/Crustacean Meal or even a 0-5-0 Bat Guano.

I was looking into the Crab Meal on Amazon for you and came across this

https://www.amazon.com/BuildASoil-Craft-Blend-Nutrient-Pack/dp/B01M4FASNT/ref=sr_1_4?keywords=crustacean+meal&qid=1552184603&s=lawn-garden&sr=1-4

Pretty amazing deal and should be more than enough to amend 20 gallons of soil. $17 with 2 day shipping (if you have Prime) and this has literally everything you could possibly need in terms of amendments. Do you have a good source of compost handy? The compost is what will make or break your soil.

You should be totally fine using RO water with whatever amendments you choose though.

Glad to be of service.
 

hillbill

Well-Known Member
I also really love the zippers on their bags...and the Bio-Tone is some great stuff...you could arguably get by on that alone with a cheap potting mix and probably grow some decent smoke for dirt cheap.
I did 10 years ago with Garden Tone! Bought 66% off end of season. That was it with Promix and Mushroom Compost!
Norton products are available down the hill and they tend to grind some of their stuff extremely fine which we like.
 

WeedFreak78

Well-Known Member
I throw a couple handfuls of garden tone in my recycles, mainly for the diversity of beneficials. It's got Bacillus licheniformis, Bacillus megaterium and Bacillus pumilus in it. All shown to increase crop sizes and improve disease resistance, not specifically in cannabis, but I figure it can't hurt.
 

IIReignManII

Well-Known Member
How much soil are you trying to make? Just remember, less is more. Crab, Neem, and Kelp meal could almost be considered a holy trinity for making your own soil. Those 3 ingredients + a mineral amendment of some kind are really all you need, aside from Lime of course. Makes things simple and affordable. I see you can source Basalt and Volcanic Rock Dust, I'd grab both and do a 3:1 ratio of Basalt:Rock Dust. If you can't/don't want to get the Crab and Neem Meals, the Alfalfa and Blood meals can be substituted for the Neem Meal and the Bone Meal can replace the Crab Meal. Just need to be cautious because those ingredients can burn, where as Crab/Neem will not.

There are no "strict" requirements, it's really just about whatever is local, cheap, and/or convenient. I live out in the middle of nowhere, so Amazon is my only source. I've been omitting the Crab Meal in favor of the frass for a source of Chitin. My well water is incredibly hard, calcifies the crap out of everything. So I had to eliminate the Crab Meal, Oyster Shell Flour, and Gypsum because my water is effectively my liming agent and my water plus all of those amendments with Calcium in them was causing me problems.

You may not be able to get Neem Meal locally, but it's incredible stuff for a wide variety of reasons. IPM and great NPK, always worth the money. Neem also doesn't run the risk of burn like the Alfalfa and Blood Meals do. I just spent $18 on a 5lb bag on Amazon that was enough to amend ~1.5 cu.yd. of soil, or a little over 300g. The last few runs I've also been getting pre-blended mixes from either Dr Earth or Down to Earth because they're made with a variety of amendments instead of me having to buy them all separately.

My latest batch of outdoor soil was made with what was available to me. Amended the soil with Down to Earth's Citrus Mix, Neem, Kelp and Azomite for veg. In another 3 months I'll start top dressing with Guano and Dr Earth's Life mix.

As long as your soil has good compost, proper aeration/drainage, and a steady supply of organic fertilizer then you're ready to rock and roll.
On the other end of the spectrum, just to show how open ended this stuff is as far as recipes, I used 0 crab or neem, mostly because I couldn't find any. The same could be achieved with blood for nitrogen, bone for P, and alfalfa and kelp to round it out with growth hormones and potassium
 

SouthernSoil*

Well-Known Member
Yeah, Crab/Crustacean Meal is something I've always had to source from Amazon personally. Bone Meal will totally work, but unless you're getting a killer deal on it I'd recommend sourcing the Crab Meal from the internet if it is within your budget. 3-16-0 is a ton of Phosphorus and your microbes will appreciate a lighter source of Phosphorus such as the Crab/Crustacean Meal or even a 0-5-0 Bat Guano.

I was looking into the Crab Meal on Amazon for you and came across this

https://www.amazon.com/BuildASoil-Craft-Blend-Nutrient-Pack/dp/B01M4FASNT/ref=sr_1_4?keywords=crustacean+meal&qid=1552184603&s=lawn-garden&sr=1-4

Pretty amazing deal and should be more than enough to amend 20 gallons of soil. $17 with 2 day shipping (if you have Prime) and this has literally everything you could possibly need in terms of amendments. Do you have a good source of compost handy? The compost is what will make or break your soil.

You should be totally fine using RO water with whatever amendments you choose though.

Glad to be of service.
I can source bone meal for next to nothing over here but from what you saying it seems crab meal is too good to be left out ! Guano is readily available here so wont have any problem sourcing that.

I had a look at the link although for some odd reason amazon wants to charge about 400$ for shipping.that kind of stuff, same thing happened when i tried to order green sand. I will have to do some more searching, i did however stumble across a post where a person dried & crushed up their own crustacean/shellfish, possibly an option ?

I unfortunately dont have any compost on hand, open to any suggestions on that man.

Thanks again :leaf::peace::leaf:
 

kratos015

Well-Known Member
I can source bone meal for next to nothing over here but from what you saying it seems crab meal is too good to be left out ! Guano is readily available here so wont have any problem sourcing that.

I had a look at the link although for some odd reason amazon wants to charge about 400$ for shipping.that kind of stuff, same thing happened when i tried to order green sand. I will have to do some more searching, i did however stumble across a post where a person dried & crushed up their own crustacean/shellfish, possibly an option ?

I unfortunately dont have any compost on hand, open to any suggestions on that man.

Thanks again :leaf::peace::leaf:
Crab Meal (like Neem and Kelp meal) is so wonderful and highly recommended because they are single ingredient amendments that do a wide variety of different things. They also don't burn, so you don't need to let it "cook" like you do with Blood/Bone/Alfalfa Meals or Guano.

The Crab Meal is a good, steady, and light supply of macro and micro nutrients as well as IPM in the form of chitin. Only reason I'm not using it anymore is because I can't afford an RO set up and well water is all I've got, so I have to get rid of any amendments with Calcium in them. Since you're using RO water you won't have this issue. I use 0-5-0 Guano and Insect Frass in it's place, but as you can see it takes me 2 amendments to give similar results as to what the Crab Meal does alone. That is the main benefit of Crab Meal, just means you have to spend less money/source less products.

Are you not from the US or something? Maybe that's why the shipping is so absurdly high because I linked from Amazon.com instead of Amazon.ca? I have no idea on that one. All you have to do to get Prime 2 day shipping is sign up for the free trial, then cancel it immediately. You'll get a free month of Prime, and you can create as many fake emails to do this infinitely. I mainly recommended the Build a Soil blend because it has everything you could possibly need and only sets you back ~$20. Simple, convenient, and affordable.

You can absolutely grind up your own crustacean shells though once they've dried out, be it crab, lobster, or shrimp. Add the dust to your soil, compost pile, or worm bin and you're set. It's just that making your own is significantly more costly than buying it, unless you know of places you can get the shells for cheap/free then buying it will be cheaper and easier.

Not having compost is going to be an issue, without compost you have nothing but dirt. Fortunately, you only need 20g of soil so that makes things somewhat easy as you'll only need 1cu.ft. of compost, aeration, and peat/coco.

You'll have to scope out your local hardware stores and/or their websites to see what they have on hand, or you can source it from Amazon if you get Prime shipping.

If you're willing to spend the money, Amazon sells a 1 cu.ft. bag of Coast of Maine's Lobster Compost for ~$27 with free Prime Shipping. In the 7+ years I've been doing organics, CoM's Lobster Compost is the absolute best compost I've ever dealt with. Only reason I didn't get it was because I needed 12 cuft of compost, and 12 x $27 was way out of my budget. My local hardware store had bags of Black Gold compost for $8/cuft so that was my best option.

My recommendation is getting the Lobster Compost, since you only need 1cuft and your plants will love you for using that stuff. Your other options are to take a look at what your local hardware stores and nurseries have. I got pretty lucky finding the Black Gold product at Ace Hardware, Home Depot/Lowes typically sell crap from Scotts/Miracle Gro and I recommend avoiding those like the plague. Craigslist is also another option, you may find someone selling either compost or worm castings. I don't recommend buying worm castings online, it's usually mediocre at best. If you're looking at buying compost online, CoM's Lobster Compost all the way.

Sorry for the long winded reply, I hope it was useful to you.
 

hillbill

Well-Known Member
Kelp4less on EBay is sorurce fo lots of organics with decent prices. Mushroom compost and some sort of composted cow manure should be available in bags.
 
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