Reparations for Weed Dealers?

DiogenesTheWiser · Jul 14, 2017

jonsnow399 said:
and when the states ignore the injunction? With the shitstorm going on in Washington right now they aren't about to start with this. If things cool down and I don't see how, then they might try something, but not something like this.

It's an assumption that the states will ignore it. From my understanding, all of the legal states have a sizeable contingent of people, powerful people, who want weed re-criminalized.

And we have history to go on with this. When Orval Faubus, George Wallace and Ross Barnett (governors) defied federal court injunctions, the presidents federalized the national guard in those states to carry out federal order. And they supported the Guard with regular army or air force troops

greg nr · Jul 14, 2017

jonsnow399 said:
and when the states ignore the injunction? With the shitstorm going on in Washington right now they aren't about to start with this. If things cool down and I don't see how, then they might try something, but not something like this.

They will get the states to comply, or at least stand down and stop obstructing, by withholding federal dollars. States will buckle if they are going to lose out on Billions of dollars in highway funds, housing subsidies, education funds, etc. It is a huge part of every state budget and states almost always back down when pinned to the mat financially.

DiogenesTheWiser · Jul 14, 2017

greg nr said:
They will get the states to comply, or at least stand down and stop obstructing, by withholding federal dollars. States will buckle if they are going to lose out on Billions of dollars in highway funds, housing subsidies, education funds, etc. It is a huge part of every state budget and states almost always back down when pinned to the mat financially.

Yes, in the 1980s, the federales wanted all states to raise the drinking age to 21. There were several holdouts, and once the feds threatened the states' federal highway funds, very quickly state legislatures began writing potential laws to be consistent with federal law.

greg nr · Jul 14, 2017

DiogenesTheWiser said:
I agree, and we also have an army of state jackboots and many different state bureaus of narcotics that are itching for the federal order to crackdown on weed, whether in legal or illegal states. It would make more sense for Jeff Secessions's states' rights ideology to empower staties to do the crackdown. It gives an illusion that the federales are kowtowing to states' rights.

All of the actions will be against either people violating state law, people selling/growing pure rec, or mixed use operations (e.g. everyone else). There will be almost no cases where they can't say a med grower/seller isn't also in the rec market. All they have to do is find one sale or gift to someone without a med card or outside of a state approved channel, or simply claim one occurred.

jonsnow399 · Jul 14, 2017

DiogenesTheWiser said:
It's an assumption that the states will ignore it. From my understanding, all of the legal states have a sizeable contingent of people, powerful people, who want weed re-criminalized.

And we have history to go on with this. When Orval Faubus, George Wallace and Ross Barnett (governors) defied federal court injunctions, the presidents federalized the national guard in those states to carry out federal order. And they supported the Guard with regular army or air force troops

Wow, what next public executions for pot dealers? The public favors legalization, we may take two steps forward and one step back but things aint back to where they were.

greg nr · Jul 14, 2017

Rob Roy said:
Actually it is plain and simple. You separate the victimless crimes from those which created a victim.

A drug dealer making a consensual trade with another person, creates no real victim. Their arrest actually victimized them and the people who are forced to pay for feeding them while they are being held as political prisoners.

A drug dealer who also does real crime, such as assaulting people etc. acts criminally not by his selling something to willing buyers, but by his assaulting people. Which coincidentally is what prohibition enforcers do.

This is a sensible and rational approach. It is doomed to never happen for those very reasons.

jonsnow399 · Jul 14, 2017

DiogenesTheWiser said:
Yes, in the 1980s, the federales wanted all states to raise the drinking age to 21. There were several holdouts, and once the feds threatened the states' federal highway funds, very quickly state legislatures began writing potential laws to be consistent with federal law.

They threatened sanctuary cities too, hows that working out? States will lose their pot revenue, and the threat of withholding funds ain't gonna happenl
What was the constituency for people against raising the age? 18 to 21 yr olds who don't vote anyways.

greg nr · Jul 14, 2017

jonsnow399 said:
Wow, what next public executions for pot dealers? The public favors legalization, we may take two steps forward and one step back but things aint back to where they were.

Indonesia executes dealers AND users, but with the use of vigilantes. Can you think of a group of well armed radicals who could be taapped, spun up, and set to kill that are rabidly behind our fearless leader? So the signal goes out it is open season on drug dealers. No prosecutions. No arrests.

What would happen?

Btw, fearless leader has praised the president of indonesia for his stance on drugs.

DiogenesTheWiser · Jul 14, 2017

jonsnow399 said:
Wow, what next public executions for pot dealers? The public favors legalization, we may take two steps forward and one step back but things aint back to where they were.

Certainly you've understood by now that in America, it doesn't make one fuck of a difference what the public supports.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/10769041/The-US-is-an-oligarchy-study-concludes.html

jonsnow399 · Jul 14, 2017

DiogenesTheWiser said:
Certainly you've understood by now that in America, it doesn't make one fuck of a difference what the public supports.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/10769041/The-US-is-an-oligarchy-study-concludes.html

Whatever, but there isn't gonna be a major crackdown like you're describing, If all the Russia stuff and special prosecutor blows over (and its not) then they will slowly move, most likely if Trump wins re-election (hint, it aint gonna happen). However all this is speculation, no one knows what's gonna happen til it happens.

DiogenesTheWiser · Jul 14, 2017

jonsnow399 said:
Whatever, but there isn't gonna be a major crackdown like you're describing, If all the Russia stuff and special prosecutor blows over (and its not) then they will slowly move, most likely if Trump wins re-election (hint, it aint gonna happen). However all this is speculation, no one knows what's gonna happen til it happens.

I'm a little more pessimistic. I see things getting much worse. I think Mueller and his team might find actual, hard evidence, and then I could also see Congress ignoring it. Congress is controlled by the GOP and they like having King Donald I the dumbass in the WH because he'll sign whatever radical legislation that they pass.

jonsnow399 · Jul 14, 2017

DiogenesTheWiser said:
I'm a little more pessimistic. I see things getting much worse. I think Mueller and his team might find actual, hard evidence, and then I could also see Congress ignoring it. Congress is controlled by the GOP and they like having King Donald I the dumbass in the WH because he'll sign whatever radical legislation that they pass.

No, if they find hard evidence, Trump is history, The establishment Repubs will be more than glad to throw him under the bus. If they find hard evidence against Trump and don't act on it they won't control congress in 2018, the repub congressmen gonna save their own ass.

greg nr · Jul 14, 2017

jonsnow399 said:
Whatever, but there isn't gonna be a major crackdown like you're describing, If all the Russia stuff and special prosecutor blows over (and its not) then they will slowly move, most likely if Trump wins re-election (hint, it aint gonna happen). However all this is speculation, no one knows what's gonna happen til it happens.

The solution to trump will be political, not legal. He can actually pardon himself and there is nothing mueller can do. If congress fails to act, nothing will happen to him, and congress won't act.

In fact, it is a well know political tactic to spin up controversy and drama in other areas to distract the public from presidential woes. Trump is famous for that.

So it is actually more likely they will do something dramatic to distract people from focusing on his problems.

tampee · Jul 14, 2017

DiogenesTheWiser said:
Alright, I know this will be a lightning rod as I write it, but let's get reparations for African Americans before we do it for weed dealers who knowingly broke the law when it was illegal.

I will take legal drugs over reparations. Lol

DiogenesTheWiser · Jul 14, 2017

jonsnow399 said:
No, if they find hard evidence, Trump is history, The establishment Repubs will be more than glad to throw him under the bus. If they find hard evidence against Trump and don't act on it they won't control congress in 2018, the repub congressmen gonna save their own ass.

Who are the establishment GOP in Congress that'll toss him under the bus? I haven't heard of too many of them with actual power and are on the committees that Mueller reports to.

jonsnow399 · Jul 14, 2017

DiogenesTheWiser said:
Who are the establishment GOP in Congress that'll toss him under the bus? I haven't heard of too many of them with actual power and are on the committees that Mueller reports to.

first you said congress is controlled by Repubs now you say they have no power, which is it? McCain, for one will be happy to vote for impeachment. Anyway, as I said before no one knows what is going to happen, we'll see.

DiogenesTheWiser · Jul 14, 2017

jonsnow399 said:
first you said congress is controlled by Repubs now you say they have no power, which is it? McCain, for one will be happy to vote for impeachment. Anyway, as I said before no one knows what is going to happen, we'll see.

The GOP is split between Tea Party fanatics and old stalwarts like McCain. The Tea Party is more aligned with the Trump monarchy.

I agree, we don't know. But as I stated, I'm pessimistic. The USA has a really weak system, and Trump is demonstrating that.

MMJ Dreaming 99 · Jul 14, 2017

DiogenesTheWiser said:
Reparations doesn't mean handouts. If you were a tad more thoughtful, you'd research how reparations programs would play out, and it wouldn't be a massive handout to anyone, but instead provide programs for training and education to the most vulnerable in society. But I know that you disagree with any kind of gov. assistance for anything and that's fine, it's America. You can be in favor of a unequal distribution of resources as most American conservatives are!

You go first.

How about you work hard and for free to grow lots of weed and donate it to black families?

LOL! 8 years of Obama, 8 years of the Bushes and 8 years of the Clintons all war mongers with trillions shoveled into wars and weapons systems. $1 trillion in that F-35 turkey. Meanwhile, homelessness keeps growing. Obama, Bushes and Clintons - all corporate, deep state war mongering NeoCons.

MMJ Dreaming 99 · Jul 14, 2017

jonsnow399 said:
first you said congress is controlled by Repubs now you say they have no power, which is it? McCain, for one will be happy to vote for impeachment. Anyway, as I said before no one knows what is going to happen, we'll see.

McCain is a war mongering shit bag just like the Bushes, Clintons and Obama. If Trump does not get out of Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan - then add him to the list.

MMJ Dreaming 99 · Jul 14, 2017

DiogenesTheWiser said:
Reparations doesn't mean handouts. If you were a tad more thoughtful, you'd research how reparations programs would play out, and it wouldn't be a massive handout to anyone, but instead provide programs for training and education to the most vulnerable in society. But I know that you disagree with any kind of gov. assistance for anything and that's fine, it's America. You can be in favor of a unequal distribution of resources as most American conservatives are!

UncleBuck said:
anyone ever remind you of what a piece of shit you are?

I thought personal insults were a violation of RIU terms? Ha ha.

Reparations for Weed Dealers?

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