RO Filter on a septic system

I’m a ROLS grower....

My leachfiled is 50 years old and failing. The septic tank is only 1000G and we are a family of 5. My 100GPD RO filter supplies my 8x8 flower room and 4x4 tent.

I can no longer run the RO filter like I have. But, I can run the waste water line down to my crawl space into the crock (ground water hole under my house) which is then pumped out to the storm drain.

Would a whole house carbon filter, or a simple one for the grow, to remove chloramine be suitable for microbial life and ROLS? I guess I’m not so concerned with other things in the water as I am the chlorine.

Thanks

It's funny I have the same size system and 30 years old but for just myself. I have been concerned about the same thing. How many gallons of water does each of your systems use and how often do you need to fill them?

See my above question but I want to give some advice I was thinking about. This may be a good thing to do anyway if you have a failing system or new system.. If you haven't already replace your toilets with a dual flush low gallons per flush. Toilets are extremely cheap and around $100 to $450 and anybody can replace them in an hour. The hardest part is disposing of the old one. The cheaper ones are still good and the more expensive ones are basically just style.

These toilet use .75 and 1.5 gallons or less depending on if it is a small job or a big one vs the old 5 -6 gallon systems. I would bet you with 5 people you would have less water going down the septic with the new toilets vs not running any RO water down the system, Do the math and a conservative estimate saved on 10 big flushes is 35 gallons and you probably have way way more than 10 flushes in a day. This will pay for itself in the water bill in a year and make the grow more stealth too.

Now I'm not saying you shouldn't try and not have the ro waste go down the system too but this is something everybody should do and will make ro water waste look like a drop in the tank..

Another thing you can do is get an ro filter that is closer to 1 to 1 if yours isn't. Now none of them are really 1 to 1 unless you have a commercial system but mine is running at about 1 to 1.5 I think they also make devices to raise the water pressure increasing the efficiency of the filter if you lack home water pressure. I personally wouldn't run one of those 1 - 4 ro filters. My system is getting me from 150ppms down to 15ppm which is more than good enough for me.

Our toilets only flush 1.5 at a time and I’m not flushing every time anymore. My biggest question is can I get away with only using a carbon filter for chloramine? I want to eliminate waste water.

Actually, what you should be doing is running the waste water from the RO filter to a rain barrel. That water is still PERFECTLY suitable for watering your lawn, flower beds, washing cars, clothes, whatever.

TacoMac said:

Actually, what you should be doing is running the waste water from the RO filter to a rain barrel. That water is still PERFECTLY suitable for watering your lawn, flower beds, washing cars, clothes, whatever.

Click to expand...

Even if I thought the waste water was perfectly suitable for other waterings I still wouldn’t have a means to save hundreds of gallons of waste water per week until spring time. Thanks...

TacoMac said:

Actually, what you should be doing is running the waste water from the RO filter to a rain barrel. That water is still PERFECTLY suitable for watering your lawn, flower beds, washing cars, clothes, whatever.

Click to expand...

Ew, you fucking would wash your clothes in sewer water, wouldn’t you? Nasty ass.

whats your current waste to water ratio you currently have?

nc208 said:

whats your current waste to water ratio you currently have?

Click to expand...

Up until the winter it was 1-3,4 ish. Now it’s much more. The cold water does a number on efficiency. I’m going to put 50 feet of tubing in a 5 gallon bucket of water that goes into the RO filter to maybe warm it up a bit. The bucket would sit full, in the flower room, next to the filter. The water going into the filter should be 70-78 degrees instead of 45-50 right now.

Also...I have a traditional 14 gallon bladder tank. I purchased an after market permeate pump to help force water into the tank.

I only use cold water and never had a problem with with pressure or efficiency. mine is around 60-65 so a bit warmer than yours. Hot water will deplete a RO membrane much faster though so be careful by how much you warm it up, 45 does sound a bit low though.
You could look into a system like this which utilizes a 1:1 waste to water system which would reduce your waste water by 3-4 times at least by the sounds of it. Carbon filters long term will be very expensive if connected to your whole house supply.
http://spectrapure.com/MaxCap-Performance-Plus-1-1-Ultra-Low-Waste-Water-Ratio-RO-DI-System

TacoMac said:

Actually, what you should be doing is running the waste water from the RO filter to a rain barrel. That water is still PERFECTLY suitable for watering your lawn, flower beds, washing cars, clothes, whatever.

Click to expand...

This is true. Only reason i didn't recommend it is being winter and here in Mass I was getting 15 inches of snow at the time. That would be a split rain barrel from the cold. I was just thinking if it was warm you would run it out the basement with a long hose instead instead of under the foundation.

Tyleb173rd said:

Our toilets only flush 1.5 at a time and I’m not flushing every time anymore. My biggest question is can I get away with only using a carbon filter for chloramine? I want to eliminate waste water.

Click to expand...

I don't think the filter would do it depending on your water composition. Their are other things in the water that can cause you problems.too. What is the ppm reading of your water out of the tap? Mine is around 150 and 15 after going through my 1 to 1 RO filter. I don't know if this is true but I have heard hard water can cause a calcium deficiency. The calcium in hard water is bigger than a plant can use but leeches smaller calcium out of the water that the plants can use. Kinda of like snowball.

nc208 said:

I only use cold water and never had a problem with with pressure or efficiency. mine is around 60-65 so a bit warmer than yours. Hot water will deplete a RO membrane much faster though so be careful by how much you warm it up, 45 does sound a bit low though.
You could look into a system like this which utilizes a 1:1 waste to water system which would reduce your waste water by 3-4 times at least by the sounds of it. Carbon filters long term will be very expensive if connected to your whole house supply.
http://spectrapure.com/MaxCap-Performance-Plus-1-1-Ultra-Low-Waste-Water-Ratio-RO-DI-System

Click to expand...

I will disaggree with you on this. I run my RO mebrane at 40 psi and 100 F, works great and has continued to work as good as new for over 3 years now.
My RO water comes out at .1 EC
I filter the hell out of my water first but still, heat has not degraded my membrane.

Uncle Reefer said:

I will disaggree with you on this. I run my RO mebrane at 40 psi and 100 F, works great and has continued to work as good as new for over 3 years now.
My RO water comes out at .1 EC
I filter the hell out of my water first but still, heat has not degraded my membrane.

Click to expand...

Your actually hurting the performance of your membrane at that temperature and not making the most of your efficiency. Even the manufacturers test them at 77 F and thats a bloated number to advertise a higher GPD than what most people achieve. and 0.1 EC . Sorry I measure in PPM and your .1 converts to 50 ppm and that for me is too high. I usually get 0 ppm tds and change my filters when i see as high as 5 ppm. I change pre filters every 6 months and my membrane has lasted 4 years Di resin lasts about 2 years.

"Lastly, it is not recommended that you introduce water from your water heater in an effort to increase water temperature. RO membranes cannot handle water temperatures over 100 degrees F, and all water heaters have silt and other sediment in their reservoirs that can damage the membrane and RO unit."

https://www.aquaticlife.com/blog/how-temperature-affects-ro-water-production-/

nc208 said:

Your actually hurting the performance of your membrane at that temperature and not making the most of your efficiency. Even the manufacturers test them at 77 F and thats a bloated number to advertise a higher GPD than what most people achieve. and 0.1 EC . Sorry I measure in PPM and your .1 converts to 50 ppm and that for me is too high. I usually get 0 ppm tds and change my filters when i see as high as 5 ppm. I change pre filters every 6 months and my membrane has lasted 4 years Di resin lasts about 2 years.

"Lastly, it is not recommended that you introduce water from your water heater in an effort to increase water temperature. RO membranes cannot handle water temperatures over 100 degrees F, and all water heaters have silt and other sediment in their reservoirs that can damage the membrane and RO unit."

https://www.aquaticlife.com/blog/how-temperature-affects-ro-water-production-/

Click to expand...

more my point is that it has been making water at .1 ec since day 1 and is still making water at .1 ec 3 years later.

FYI I have a thermoplus ac unit so I have an embarrassment of riches of hot water available to me, so I use it for what ever I can rather than just heating my sewer with it

-If you g oogle search questions about getting rid of chloramine you'll find some Old roll it up threads.

Some experienced organic guys say chloramine isn't even an issue for the microbes. Don't worry about them, just use your tap water to water, and your beneficial will be just fine. If you go this route, you get the added bonus of not having to worry about your septic tank, and using way less water.

Some experienced organic guys say RO filters don't even remove chloramine! So your living soil might be doing just fine, right now, with chloramine water. If your water is good, and you're only concerned about the chloramine, you can stop using that RO filter right now.

Other organic guys say you can put a teaspoon or two of humic acid, or molasses, or fish hydrosolate in your 5 gallon bucket of chloramine water, with your bubbling air stone. The chlorine is supposed to bond with the junk you add to the water, then bubble away after 2 days.

If you're still worried about the microbes, you could make compost tea every week or two to make sure you've always got some live ones. Or top dress with EWC or compost regularly.

I'm an organic soil guy myself. I used to mix up stuff, or bubble water, or do whatever to get rid of chloramine. Gradually I did less. Now I just water out of the tap. The crabshell I add to the soil still breaks down and disappears. Plants still grow. The beneficials must be OK.

youraveragehorticulturist said:

-If you g oogle search questions about getting rid of chloramine you'll find some Old roll it up threads.

Some experienced organic guys say chloramine isn't even an issue for the microbes. Don't worry about them, just use your tap water to water, and your beneficial will be just fine. If you go this route, you get the added bonus of not having to worry about your septic tank, and using way less water.

Some experienced organic guys say RO filters don't even remove chloramine! So your living soil might be doing just fine, right now, with chloramine water. If your water is good, and you're only concerned about the chloramine, you can stop using that RO filter right now.

Other organic guys say you can put a teaspoon or two of humic acid, or molasses, or fish hydrosolate in your 5 gallon bucket of chloramine water, with your bubbling air stone. The chlorine is supposed to bond with the junk you add to the water, then bubble away after 2 days.

If you're still worried about the microbes, you could make compost tea every week or two to make sure you've always got some live ones. Or top dress with EWC or compost regularly.

I'm an organic soil guy myself. I used to mix up stuff, or bubble water, or do whatever to get rid of chloramine. Gradually I did less. Now I just water out of the tap. The crabshell I add to the soil still breaks down and disappears. Plants still grow. The beneficials must be OK.

Click to expand...

Thanks....I’m going to do some side by sides and see what happens. If there’s no negative difference in the end result then I’ll omit RO in a heart beat. I don’t like wasting water.

I was curious, so I searched around and found this;

It seemed legit. I'd like to see some footage from under a microscope, tap water vs distilled, but I came across this video first.

nc208 said:

Your actually hurting the performance of your membrane at that temperature and not making the most of your efficiency. Even the manufacturers test them at 77 F and thats a bloated number to advertise a higher GPD than what most people achieve. and 0.1 EC . Sorry I measure in PPM and your .1 converts to 50 ppm and that for me is too high. I usually get 0 ppm tds and change my filters when i see as high as 5 ppm. I change pre filters every 6 months and my membrane has lasted 4 years Di resin lasts about 2 years.

"Lastly, it is not recommended that you introduce water from your water heater in an effort to increase water temperature. RO membranes cannot handle water temperatures over 100 degrees F, and all water heaters have silt and other sediment in their reservoirs that can damage the membrane and RO unit."

https://www.aquaticlife.com/blog/how-temperature-affects-ro-water-production-/

Click to expand...

You dont use the DI water for drinking do you?

My tap water is at 90ppm btw. Perhaps I could cut down on RO water by only using it for teas and adding microbes like Mammoth P and/or EM1. The in between watering would be with tap water only.